BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Software Modifications
 
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      06-13-2016, 05:20 PM   #1453
squartus
Major
United_States
190
Rep
1,030
Posts

Drives: 2010 E92 M3 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2010 E92 BMW M3  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by javarithms View Post
No, he went with WPC which has less clearance than the OEM bearing because of the coating (it's an OEM bearing that has been coated).

BE bearing was designed to provide the right clearance.
Actually no your wrong, WPC bearing is a treated oem bearing not a coating. It actually has slightly more clearance than a OEM bearing due to the shotpeening process. This does not include the new higher clearance custom bearings, still say better off doing it right and actually solving the root problem.

Take a look at the WPC treated process and you will see, is reason I did not use a coated bearing due to less clearance.
__________________


4.4L LC stroker/ESS VT2-625/Volk te37 sl's/AA exhaust/DSS Carbon Fiber driveshaft/ARH Headers.. etc
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 05:23 PM   #1454
RoundelObsession
Banned
United_States
208
Rep
1,181
Posts

Drives: S65M3
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Texas

iTrader: (39)

Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
From what I understand really only fix is to turn/mill the crank or with stroker your getting a totally different crank. You then have proper clearance etc, I knew bearing swap was not a fix. Just thought it would buy me more than 30,000 miles!
You have been running Motul 5w40, correct?
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 05:35 PM   #1455
javarithms
First Lieutenant
javarithms's Avatar
United_States
67
Rep
311
Posts

Drives: '13 E92 M3 SG FR, '03 530i
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: WA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
Actually no your wrong, WPC bearing is a treated oem bearing not a coating. It actually has slightly more clearance than a OEM bearing due to the shotpeening process. This does not include the new higher clearance custom bearings, still say better off doing it right and actually solving the root problem.

Take a look at the WPC treated process and you will see, is reason I did not use a coated bearing due to less clearance.
You're right I got it mixed up with VAC (Calico). Either way the BE bearings should be a lot better since they were specifically designed to address the clearance issue. Time will tell if they got it right or if we are all destined to go stroker route. Good luck with whatever direction you choose to go.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 05:37 PM   #1456
Sephiroth
4-6-8
Sephiroth's Avatar
India
108
Rep
914
Posts

Drives: dinosaurs
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: mid-MO

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by m3ninja View Post
So changing out the rod bearings still doesn't solve the issue. Where do we go from here? What's to prevent the stroker motor also having bearing issues?
Didn't take long for the generalizations to come out. Wrong conclusion. Get the complete facts first before making panic posts. He said
Quote:
I used WPC treated stock bearings
__________________
BMW M3 E92 JB/Fox See my old bearings
BMW M3 E46 PY/Black
Honda S2000 AP2 GPW/Tan

Last edited by Sephiroth; 06-13-2016 at 05:43 PM.
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 05:53 PM   #1457
///M Power-Belgium
Major General
///M Power-Belgium's Avatar
Belgium
8220
Rep
8,135
Posts

Drives: ///M3-DCT- E92 Silverstone II
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Belgium

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
Well I got call from the shop, right away was metal in the oil filter etc. Its the bearings. Going to check to main caps to see if I can rebuild it or not, deff not what I wanted to hear.
Almost exactly 30,000 miles on these new bearings and the car already chewed them up to engine failure, orignal set I changed out at 31k and were worn to copper on several. So yea... not happy.
"Nightmare" !!!

I said several times on here that only time (future) will tell if replaced bearings would be better or not..
Well , here we have it ...I don't think this situation sounds positive !
After reading this I don't trust my S65 anymore... even not for one single minute anymore !
///M-BMW...WTF is wrong with our motors ???

Man..I'm so sorry about your luck .
__________________
BPM DEV-Tune & DCT software update & Servotronic & coding///Alpine HID Angeleyes///Oem.exhaust mod.
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 06:06 PM   #1458
///M Power-Belgium
Major General
///M Power-Belgium's Avatar
Belgium
8220
Rep
8,135
Posts

Drives: ///M3-DCT- E92 Silverstone II
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Belgium

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
Didn't take long for the generalizations to come out. Wrong conclusion. Get the complete facts first before making panic posts. He said
There are facts enough on page 1 of this thread !
And that number is only 5-6 % of what happens worldwide !
Not even 20% of the Bimmerpost S65 owners post the bearing failure on here because they are thinking about the value of the car , and actually they are/were right..
Facts , panic posts ...What a joke .
__________________
BPM DEV-Tune & DCT software update & Servotronic & coding///Alpine HID Angeleyes///Oem.exhaust mod.
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 06:10 PM   #1459
squartus
Major
United_States
190
Rep
1,030
Posts

Drives: 2010 E92 M3 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2010 E92 BMW M3  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundelObsession View Post
You have been running Motul 5w40, correct?
I ran motul 5w40 for the last 10k. 6k of those miles were HWY miles, was a road trip to california and back
__________________


4.4L LC stroker/ESS VT2-625/Volk te37 sl's/AA exhaust/DSS Carbon Fiber driveshaft/ARH Headers.. etc
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 06:59 PM   #1460
Doc Oc
Captain fatbelly
Doc Oc's Avatar
United_States
1051
Rep
1,872
Posts

Drives: 2008 M3 Coupe
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Columbia, SC

iTrader: (0)

Any idea how the wpc process affects oil analysis? It hardens an already hard bearing (as compared to lead babbitt bearings) so do you think maybe a uoa is pointless with these?
__________________
2008 dct coupe, engine and dct tune, ttp, ms intake, megan exhaust, ms pulley, cf ds
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 07:00 PM   #1461
L4ces
Major
L4ces's Avatar
United_States
121
Rep
1,180
Posts

Drives: 2008 E92 M3 Alpine White
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: NJ - NY

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
That sucks. There have been several replaced bearing failures. I was going to wait for 60k to change mine again. How bad was your original set at 31k? What bearings and bolts did you use?
My orignal set had copper showing on most at 31k, thats stock no supercharger. When I went FI I used WPC treated stock bearings and ARP bolts.
Was always mindful of engine but especially after i went FI, never went over 3k untill oil was at operating temp, oil changes at 5k. Oil tests every oil change, which last test showed perfect results 3k ago.
Did everything right and still got bit.

Going to stay positive though, was going to do a stroker rebuild way in the future. Guess I just get to have it sooner now
Sorry for you bruh. Thanks for being open on issues.
Thanks bruh.
Appreciate 1
      06-13-2016, 08:03 PM   #1462
aus
Major General
United_States
324
Rep
8,199
Posts

Drives: Odysse
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seal Beach, CA

iTrader: (7)

Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
Well I got call from the shop, right away was metal in the oil filter etc. Its the bearings. Going to check to main caps to see if I can rebuild it or not, deff not what I wanted to hear.
Almost exactly 30,000 miles on these new bearings and the car already chewed them up to engine failure, orignal set I changed out at 31k and were worn to copper on several. So yea... not happy.
Damn. Sorry to hear that.
Any chance you can send an oil sample for that other oil analysis that Auto Talent sent off? Someone here had fuel dilution on their sample and that's all we've seen of that test they ran.
.
__________________
Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 08:59 PM   #1463
squartus
Major
United_States
190
Rep
1,030
Posts

Drives: 2010 E92 M3 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2010 E92 BMW M3  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
Damn. Sorry to hear that.
Any chance you can send an oil sample for that other oil analysis that Auto Talent sent off? Someone here had fuel dilution on their sample and that's all we've seen of that test they ran.
.
I use blackstone, isn't that what they use? I dont have any oil from the previous change that I tested. Everything came back great though, no fuel or antifreeze/foreign matter in oil very low metal counts plently of addatives etc. Said was perfect report
__________________


4.4L LC stroker/ESS VT2-625/Volk te37 sl's/AA exhaust/DSS Carbon Fiber driveshaft/ARH Headers.. etc
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 09:00 PM   #1464
squartus
Major
United_States
190
Rep
1,030
Posts

Drives: 2010 E92 M3 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2010 E92 BMW M3  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by L4ces View Post
Sorry for you bruh. Thanks for being open on issues.
Thanks bruh.
Sure thing man, if it can help someone else I got no problem with sharing. Will be intresting to see what the pictures look like.
__________________


4.4L LC stroker/ESS VT2-625/Volk te37 sl's/AA exhaust/DSS Carbon Fiber driveshaft/ARH Headers.. etc
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 09:49 PM   #1465
aus
Major General
United_States
324
Rep
8,199
Posts

Drives: Odysse
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seal Beach, CA

iTrader: (7)

Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
I use blackstone, isn't that what they use? I dont have any oil from the previous change that I tested. Everything came back great though, no fuel or antifreeze/foreign matter in oil very low metal counts plently of addatives etc. Said was perfect report
There's a Polaris analysis that uses a Mass Spec to analyze the oil.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1233184

This one has a elevated fuel levels, as did a few M5's in the link above.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1268721

.
__________________
Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 10:35 PM   #1466
redpriest
Lieutenant Colonel
redpriest's Avatar
United_States
710
Rep
1,953
Posts

Drives: 2017 M4 / 2011 M3
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Bay Area, CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2017 BMW M4  [5.00]
2011 BMW M3  [5.00]
2013 Mercedes-Benz ...  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
I use blackstone, isn't that what they use? I dont have any oil from the previous change that I tested. Everything came back great though, no fuel or antifreeze/foreign matter in oil very low metal counts plently of addatives etc. Said was perfect report
Your bearings were made from copper-lead? Horrible if so.
__________________
'11 BMW M3 ZCP DCT | Akra Evolution | MS Intake/pulley | JRZ RS Pro + Hyperco 700/800 | BPM Stage2/DCT tune | Dinan sway bar + monoballs | AP Racing Radi-CAL BBK by Essex | 265/35-18 Maxxis RC-1 on APEX EC-7s
'17 BMW M4 ZCP 6MT - Individual Tanzanite Blue + Opal White Leather
instagram.com/titomanlio
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 11:40 PM   #1467
squartus
Major
United_States
190
Rep
1,030
Posts

Drives: 2010 E92 M3 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2010 E92 BMW M3  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by redpriest View Post
Your bearings were made from copper-lead? Horrible if so.
My orignal bearings that I replaced at 31k were copper lead, most of those were down to copper. The WPC treated bearings I put in as replacements where the newer bearings that are Alum, my last oil sample only had Alum at 2.

Hopefully will get some pics of the bearings soon to see which ones failed.
__________________


4.4L LC stroker/ESS VT2-625/Volk te37 sl's/AA exhaust/DSS Carbon Fiber driveshaft/ARH Headers.. etc
Appreciate 0
      06-13-2016, 11:53 PM   #1468
Sephiroth
4-6-8
Sephiroth's Avatar
India
108
Rep
914
Posts

Drives: dinosaurs
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: mid-MO

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
There are facts enough on page 1 of this thread !
And that number is only 5-6 % of what happens worldwide !
Not even 20% of the Bimmerpost S65 owners post the bearing failure on here because they are thinking about the value of the car , and actually they are/were right..
Facts , panic posts ...What a joke .
Cmon man. Don't give up yet! It's not over
Appreciate 0
      06-14-2016, 11:18 AM   #1469
Properstyle
Captain
139
Rep
792
Posts

Drives: 2015 f80 m3
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Miramar, FL

iTrader: (0)

why people feel 5w40 is enough for a motor that operates at a 210 oil temp when not on it is beyond me. Even nissan recommends 20w50 in their sports car during hotter times. and the oil temps aren't as high as ours. the only place 5/40 helps would be on start up. after that when the motor is now hot that oil is like water.
__________________
2002 M3 SMG coupe-Sold
2015 F80 DCT Bootmod3 tuned Sapphire Black-The DD
2010 C63 Renntech tuned artic white-The wifes DD
1993 300zx 2jz Swapped slicktop- The toy/track car
Appreciate 0
      06-14-2016, 12:49 PM   #1470
pbonsalb
Brigadier General
383
Rep
4,010
Posts

Drives: 08 E90 M3, 99 E36 M3 Turbo
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Concord, NH

iTrader: (3)

Whether with 0W40 or 10W60, oil will be around 210 most of the time. Maybe it is 10 degrees hotter with the thinner oil or 10 degrees cooler with the thicker oil. Only on the track or during the kind of hardcore driving I have not experienced in my 2 years with 0W40 (following 3 years with 10W60) might the oil cooler not keep up.
Appreciate 0
      06-14-2016, 02:20 PM   #1471
squartus
Major
United_States
190
Rep
1,030
Posts

Drives: 2010 E92 M3 6MT
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2010 E92 BMW M3  [5.00]
Engine being torn down as we speak, sending block to VAC and having them work their magic. Hopefully block is viable and won't need to source one of those as well.
Will start a build thread once work out parts/build CR ratio etc. So far dealing with VAC has been nothing but a pleasure.

Will be running 5w40 on the new stroker engine.
__________________


4.4L LC stroker/ESS VT2-625/Volk te37 sl's/AA exhaust/DSS Carbon Fiber driveshaft/ARH Headers.. etc
Appreciate 0
      06-14-2016, 02:41 PM   #1472
Rich150001
First Lieutenant
39
Rep
397
Posts

Drives: 2017 Stingray
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Arlington (Ballston), Va

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by squartus View Post
My orignal set had copper showing on most at 31k, thats stock no supercharger. When I went FI I used WPC treated stock bearings and ARP bolts.
Was always mindful of engine but especially after i went FI, never went over 3k untill oil was at operating temp, oil changes at 5k. Oil tests every oil change, which last test showed perfect results 3k ago.
Did everything right and still got bit.

Going to stay positive though, was going to do a stroker rebuild way in the future. Guess I just get to have it sooner now
Ouch, I haven't heard of too many failures with the new bearings, even supercharged, so this is a bit disappointing. Looking forward to seeing your new build thread.
__________________
08 E92 M3 AW (Sold) / 09 Yamaha R6 (Sold)
Appreciate 0
      06-14-2016, 05:48 PM   #1473
Doc Oc
Captain fatbelly
Doc Oc's Avatar
United_States
1051
Rep
1,872
Posts

Drives: 2008 M3 Coupe
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Columbia, SC

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Properstyle View Post
why people feel 5w40 is enough for a motor that operates at a 210 oil temp when not on it is beyond me. Even nissan recommends 20w50 in their sports car during hotter times. and the oil temps aren't as high as ours. the only place 5/40 helps would be on start up. after that when the motor is now hot that oil is like water.
I run 5w30 in my 370z...I think that's factory fill. I will say that during the summer, the m3 definitely seems happier on 5w50 than 0w40. Cooler too.
__________________
2008 dct coupe, engine and dct tune, ttp, ms intake, megan exhaust, ms pulley, cf ds
Appreciate 0
      06-14-2016, 07:56 PM   #1474
aussiem3
Colonel
aussiem3's Avatar
Australia
151
Rep
2,553
Posts

Drives: Goggomobil
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Kangaroo land

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2007 E92 M3  [0.00]
This really sucks. The said failure could be due to a lot of things. However this is not awe inspiring! Sorry to hear.
__________________
E92 M3 2007 - ///PE with Test Pipes and BPM Stage II; CF Interior & Splitters; CIC with Connected Drive
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:17 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST