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      01-12-2008, 07:10 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by footie View Post
And finally the tyres, well yeah they can make a big difference but unless it's a well designed chassis the difference they make will be less, so again it all comes down to how well the dynamics of the car has been designed and only the smaller M cars come close to achieving this goal and it's all to do with weight.

Not to try to engage in a discussion about who has a longer e-penis but tires are by far the biggest influence on a street car's performance. There is no other mod that even comes close to improving a street cars performance.

The subject of this thread was M5 vs. M6. Neither car is shabby on a track. If you choose, the M6 will be faster around a track. Also, this tangent started when people compared the M6 to other cars on a track. The M6 will not beat a Miata around a tight track but will more than hold its own against M3s and others.
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      01-12-2008, 07:29 PM   #90
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Go with the E63 is all you want is straight line acceleration. If you want to have fun in the turns also, I'd stick with BMW.
Gotta LOL with this ignorance of "wait till the twisties" mentality of the die hard BMW fans....... Have you rode in the E63 lately? If not, try one. You might be surprised how well it handles in the twisties.

On the other hand, my old E55 is a pig in twisties......
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      01-12-2008, 07:37 PM   #91
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M5, m6 is ugly
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      01-12-2008, 10:49 PM   #92
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Where the hell is the M3??





If you track, there is no ideal car for every track.
  • Miata's are almost untouchable in 1st -2nd gear courses / autocrosses
  • M3s and 911s are great for 2nd - 3rd gear courses
  • Vettes / GTs including the M6 do well in 3rd - 4th gear courses (like Spa / Mosport etc)
Do I care if a Miata kicks M6 butt around an autocross course?? Absolutely not because he has to drive the car in public!


ok here is M3 for you .



M6 - M3 = M3
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      01-12-2008, 11:03 PM   #93
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The people on this forum really amaze me sometimes.

The poor guy asks between an M5 and M6 and you guys turn the topic into one about audis and porsches and astons... it's absolutely ridiculous.

I recently posted a topic asking what car I should lease within a given price range, and what do I get? Comments telling me to buy, not lease, and the thread ends up becoming an argument about whether leasing or buying is more economical and toyotas and hondas got thrown in the mix.

Stick. With. The. Topic.

BMW Diet - my advice is simple. Drive both and see which one you're most comfortable with.

The M6 looks more exclusive and the M5 is more of an underdog. If you need space, no question go with the M5. But if not, simply drive both and see which one puts the biggest smile across your face.

You asked about color, and this is completely subjective, but I really love the M5 in black, I don't think any other color suits the car better.

Hope this helps.
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      01-13-2008, 12:14 AM   #94
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      01-13-2008, 01:22 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
T-Bone,

When did I include either the RS4 or the S5 in my comments, I agree that unless the track suited the RS4 the M6 will be a bit quicker and as for the S5, it wouldn't even be in the reckoning.

All of the above variables only play a smaller roles next to weight, if the chassis is well designed and balanced then everything else falls into place. This is what making the cars I mentioned before so great for track work.

A little Catherham has less than half the M6's power but it would totally destroy it on the track, so power isn't that important.

The GT2 and GT3RS wouldn't be classed as having the engine in the best place but like the Caterham they too will destroy the M6 on the track, so weight balance isn't that important either.

And finally the tyres, well yeah they can make a big difference but unless it's a well designed chassis the difference they make will be less, so again it all comes down to how well the dynamics of the car has been designed and only the smaller M cars come close to achieving this goal and it's all to do with weight.
WOW! You never cease to amaze.

Knowledge is NOT power, in your case!
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      01-13-2008, 02:20 AM   #96
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Honestly everyone I think this looks obvious , its looks like the M5 is the better option for eeryday use and being pratical . and which car do you think is in Par with the M5 .(non bmw ; Merc /Porsche / Audi )
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      01-13-2008, 03:09 AM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev View Post
Gotta LOL with this ignorance of "wait till the twisties" mentality of the die hard BMW fans....... Have you rode in the E63 lately? If not, try one. You might be surprised how well it handles in the twisties.

On the other hand, my old E55 is a pig in twisties......
As a matter of fact, I have. I find the handling of the M5 MUCH better.
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      01-13-2008, 03:56 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T Bone View Post
Not to try to engage in a discussion about who has a longer e-penis but tires are by far the biggest influence on a street car's performance. There is no other mod that even comes close to improving a street cars performance.
Wrong, a well design chassis will make more of a difference than the tyres on their own. Even on a track as long as the ring the difference between the M5 and M6 was only 4 seconds, with one using CUP tyres (M6) and the other high performance road tyres (M5).

The M5 and M6 both suffer from too much frontal weight, their weight balance is 55/45% I believe which doesn't help matters when their is over 500hp going to the rear. The best M car ever was the E30 M3 and it's weight balance when more to the rear where the driven wheels where (a better designed chassis).
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      01-13-2008, 03:59 PM   #99
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Quote:
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Wrong, a well design chassis will make more of a difference than the tyres on their own. Even on a track as long as the ring the difference between the M5 and M6 was only 4 seconds, with one using CUP tyres (M6) and the other high performance road tyres (M5).

The M5 and M6 both suffer from too much frontal weight, their weight balance is 55/45% I believe which doesn't help matters when their is over 500hp going to the rear. The best M car ever was the E30 M3 and it's weight balance when more to the rear where the driven wheels where (a better designed chassis).

Enjoy the pink skies in your world mate. Because what you are saying is just plain wrong.

Tires are one of the key determinants of a car's performance, suspensions allow the tires to work better. Changing suspension without better tires is a waste. Tires alone are good for 4-5 seconds in a sub 2 minute roadcourse.....no other mod will give you this.

If I were out for track performance, the single biggest improvement to the car will be tires.
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      01-13-2008, 04:39 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
Wrong, a well design chassis will make more of a difference than the tyres on their own. Even on a track as long as the ring the difference between the M5 and M6 was only 4 seconds, with one using CUP tyres (M6) and the other high performance road tyres (M5).

The M5 and M6 both suffer from too much frontal weight, their weight balance is 55/45% I believe which doesn't help matters when their is over 500hp going to the rear. The best M car ever was the E30 M3 and it's weight balance when more to the rear where the driven wheels where (a better designed chassis).
Are you serious?

Footie, if anyone knows about chassis and weight distribution, it is YOU.
I mean, just look at the weight distribution/chassis of Audis. Great!

You sure do have a lot of opinions for a guy who never tracks his car.

Tires are one of the best "mods" for your car.
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      01-13-2008, 06:17 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T Bone View Post
Enjoy the pink skies in your world mate. Because what you are saying is just plain wrong.

Tires are one of the key determinants of a car's performance, suspensions allow the tires to work better. Changing suspension without better tires is a waste. Tires alone are good for 4-5 seconds in a sub 2 minute roadcourse.....no other mod will give you this.

If I were out for track performance, the single biggest improvement to the car will be tires.
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      01-13-2008, 06:21 PM   #102
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Are you serious?

Footie, if anyone knows about chassis and weight distribution, it is YOU.
I mean, just look at the weight distribution/chassis of Audis. Great!

You sure do have a lot of opinions for a guy who never tracks his car.

Tires are one of the best "mods" for your car.
You assume a lot, don't you.

I reckon I do know a little about weight balance and what effect it has on the handling of any car, but especially awd cars. But as we are not here to discuss Audis only M5 or M6 lets talk about them, with so much weight over the nose these two will understeer more than any other M car, period but because they have so little weight over the rear and so much power on tap that oversteer is again more readily available than any other M car. They are point and squirt machine, not a true M car in the true sense of the word. If nothing else Porsche has shown that if you have to have a lot of weight over one of the two axles than it's best to have it over the one which drives the wheels.

But this thread is about which is best of the two and based on their respective ring times the M6 is the most over-priced machine when a four version with a lot of extra weight and inferior tyres can all but match it's time. Clearly the winner is the M5, hands down.
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      01-13-2008, 06:53 PM   #103
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Quote:
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You assume a lot, don't you.

I reckon I do know a little about weight balance and what effect it has on the handling of any car, but especially awd cars. But as we are not here to discuss Audis only M5 or M6 lets talk about them, with so much weight over the nose these two will understeer more than any other M car, period but because they have so little weight over the rear and so much power on tap that oversteer is again more readily available than any other M car. They are point and squirt machine, not a true M car in the true sense of the word. If nothing else Porsche has shown that if you have to have a lot of weight over one of the two axles than it's best to have it over the one which drives the wheels.

But this thread is about which is best of the two and based on their respective ring times the M6 is the most over-priced machine when a four version with a lot of extra weight and inferior tyres can all but match it's time. Clearly the winner is the M5, hands down.
You really have no clue what you are talking about. Tell me where you have driven an M5 or M6 on the track. You lost all credibility by trying to say tires are just an afterthought.

If you want to talk about overpriced machines, let's talk about your overpriced Passat that is the S5.

Go to a track where we can make BMW humiliation of Audi complete.
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      01-13-2008, 07:05 PM   #104
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You assume a lot, don't you.

But this thread is about which is best of the two and based on their respective ring times the M6 is the most over-priced machine when a four version with a lot of extra weight and inferior tyres can all but match it's time. Clearly the winner is the M5, hands down.
I only assumed that you don't track your car, because on the news they said nothing about an S5 understeering into a tree in Ireland. So i figured you weren't at the track.
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      01-13-2008, 07:21 PM   #105
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I'm sure we all agree that BMW kicks Audi's ass. So lets not get carried away from the topic here, which is M5 vs M6.
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      01-13-2008, 07:23 PM   #106
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I'm sure we all agree that BMW kicks Audi's ass. So lets not get carried away from the topic here, which is M5 vs M6.
Yes indeed..... It really depends on whether OP needs the 4 doors or not.
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      01-13-2008, 07:23 PM   #107
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Since I was asked my opinion in here , I'd say neither. An e90 335i for the street and a Lotus Exige or C6 for the track, for the same money, FTW

Both the M5 and M6 are fundamentally flawed, though the 5 much less than the 6.
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      01-13-2008, 07:27 PM   #108
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Hey BTW T-Bone,
What happened to the Dinan flashed 335's testing? Is it still happening?
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      01-13-2008, 07:32 PM   #109
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Hey BTW T-Bone,
What happened to the Dinan flashed 335's testing? Is it still happening?
I am calling Gregor tomorrow. I was at CES in Vegas last week (I stayed a bit for the AVN too)

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Both the M5 and M6 are fundamentally flawed, though the 5 much less than the 6.
Flawed for the road? I don't think you are saying that. As a dedicated track car sure but so is the M3 and any car that weighs more than 3000 pounds.
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      01-13-2008, 07:39 PM   #110
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Flawed for the road? I don't think you are saying that. As a dedicated track car sure but so is the M3 and any car that weighs more than 3000 pounds.
I'm saying for both Street and Track combined.

M5 = iDrive + bucking SMG, or manual + electronic restrictions. However, I'm hard pressed to come up with a better sedan, all around, street + track. I don't think it's $40K+ better than a tuned 335i, I'd much rather have a dedicated track car.

M6 = Heavy, iDrive, styling (to many), no faster than a stock 335i around most tracks, too many other great cars in the 2 seater around $100K segment (i.e. 911, Blue Devil, GT-R, AM for style, etc..)

The M3 is also overrated, imho, but can redeem itself somewhat if the price stays under $65K well equipped.
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