Top Gear totally smitten with Nissan GT-R:

[gbb357]

Originally Posted by Autoblog

The platitudes keep pouring in for the 2009 Nissan GT-R. Bill Thomas from Top Gear produced our favorite write up by far right before Christmas in which he pits the GT-R against its arch nemesis, the Porsche 911 Turbo, on the back roads of Germany before attacking the Autobahn. His description of accelerating to 190 mph on the 'bahn puts you right there with him riding shotgun as the twin-clutch transmission delivers terrifying levels of velocity with each snick. Thomas actually lays praise on the GT-R's gear box above any of the car's other components, including the twin-turbo VR38 six-cylinder producing 473bhp.

Of course, we all want to know what the Stig thought of Nissan's new supercar, and he fortunately (and mysteriously) walked out of a German forest and demanded a 20-minute drive before reentering the landscape and disappearing. The Stig, however, doesn't speak, so we'll have to wait until the car appears on the television show itself to see how fast it goes on the Top Gear test track with the Stig behind the wheel.

[Source: Top Gear]

http://www.topgear.com/content/featu...ries/12/1.html

[swamp2]

Laptimes are incorrect. The 997TT times are (courtesy of Art here)

7:54 by Horst from Sportauto
7:49 by Walter from Porsche

The 7:40 was a factory estimate from Porsche reported in Motortrend.

If they truly wanted the most "apples to apples" comparison they should have used factory driver time vs. factory driver time. That is 7:38 vs. 7:49. All that being said I think everyone knows my skepticism on the 7:38 time. Of course we all saw it but what does it really mean.

[bruce.augenstein@comcast.]

Originally Posted by swamp2

Laptimes are incorrect. The 997TT times are (courtesy of Art here)

7:54 by Horst from Sportauto
7:49 by Walter from Porsche

The 7:40 was a factory estimate from Porsche reported in Motortrend.

If they truly wanted the most "apples to apples" comparison they should have used factory driver time vs. factory driver time. That is 7:38 vs. 7:49. All that being said I think everyone knows my skepticism on the 7:38 time. Of course we all saw it but what does it really mean.

It means that the GT-R is the real thing, and will likely spawn new competition that will affect most of the performance cars being sold today - except for the very low end of the spectrum.

What I read (in "Car", I think) was that Rohrl was stuck at a bunch of 7:49s with the standard PS2s or whatever, so they went to the PSCs to get that 7:40, safely under the Z06's 7:42.99.

Presto! PSCs became an option on the Porsche Turbo.

That 7:40 has been documented elsewhere, as well.

Bruce

[gbb357]

Originally Posted by swamp2

Laptimes are incorrect. The 997TT times are (courtesy of Art here)

7:54 by Horst from Sportauto
7:49 by Walter from Porsche

The 7:40 was a factory estimate from Porsche reported in Motortrend.

If they truly wanted the most "apples to apples" comparison they should have used factory driver time vs. factory driver time. That is 7:38 vs. 7:49. All that being said I think everyone knows my skepticism on the 7:38 time. Of course we all saw it but what does it really mean.

That's still not apples to apples comparison. You need to have one independent driver to test both cars in the same condition in the same day with the same tires.

[jaiman]

Originally Posted by swamp2

Of course we all saw it but what does it really mean.

it means for all your blatting about wanting evidence you still can't overcome your bias against the GT-R

[footie]

I believe this month's Topgear magazine features a comparison between the GTR and the Audi R8.

Has anyone see the review or know when the mag is on sale?

[JEllis]

Oh the GTR is sexy... If I thought I could get an allocation at MSRP or better than I would probably go to the dark side. But, I think the chances of that are slim....

SEXY

[BMW3R]

Originally Posted by JEllis

Oh the GTR is sexy... If I thought I could get an allocation at MSRP or better than I would probably go to the dark side. But, I think the chances of that are slim....

SEXY

To me, the car is boxy. I like the rounded corners of the BMW.

[JEllis]

Originally Posted by BMW3R

To me, the car is boxy. I like the rounded corners of the BMW.

The design is ahead of its time.

Jason

[Voltigeur]

Originally Posted by autoblog

"The platitudes keep pouring in for the 2009 Nissan GT-R..."

This wally (not you gbb357) means plaudits not platitudes! Learn the Queen's English, mate!

[swamp2]

Originally Posted by jaiman

it means for all your blatting about wanting evidence you still can't overcome your bias against the GT-R

No, it means exactly what I said and only what I said - the times as quoted in the review are not an appropriate comparison and that is all it means, period. What you are doing is purely inventing things you think my post means. Talk about prejudice.... I'll say it again, as I have for the 15 millionth time, the GT-R is an amazing car, contains cutting edge tech. and offers an unheard of price to performance ratio. A truly "terrible bias" I have against the car. You need to learn the definition of healthy skepticism a standard approach in any reasonably scientific method or approach.

Furthermore there is no new evidence of anything in this article. This single piece of very old evidence tells us nothing about many of the variables/uncertainties and reasons for skepticism mentioned by many folks. Nor does it address the fact that most N'Ring times, and to many the only "official" N'Ring times, are those from Sportauto with Horst driving.

gbb: What you call "apples to apples" is clearly a fantastic apples to apples type of test. But such tests will almost never happen so you have to take the next best and the next best is a production (NOT pre-production factory car) car driven by Horst.

[footie]

Just read the Topgear review of the R8 vs GTR and though the Nissan was way quicker in both acceleration and down the course that they tested them on but in the end they preferred the Audi as it feel more right than the clinical approach of the GTR.

I wonder how a comparison between the GTR and the M3 will be based on the above.

[OzCarfreak]

I have gotten my deposit back and am seriously considering putting it down on a 2009 GT-R

[JEllis]

Originally Posted by footie

Just read the Topgear review of the R8 vs GTR and though the Nissan was way quicker in both acceleration and down the course that they tested them on but in the end they preferred the Audi as it feel more right than the clinical approach of the GTR.

I wonder how a comparison between the GTR and the M3 will be based on the above.

Got a link to the article?

Jason

[jaiman]

scans of the r8 vs GTR can be found here: http://www.nagtroc.com/forums/Top-Ge...-R-t20900.html

[spearfisher]

impressive car,

I say 20k over msrp when it comes to the states, maybe even more.

big demand, limited supply

[Los Angeles]

Originally Posted by spearfisher

I say 20k over msrp when it comes to the states, maybe even more.

Over 20k?

[JEllis]

Yeah some dealerships are asking for 30K over MSRP

[spearfisher]

30k over, we'll see when the buying frenzy starts, should go up even more

[JEllis]

Yeah, although Nissan announced that the 1500 allocation for the first was just an estimate. Latest estimates are as big as 3000 in the first year. I guess we will see.. Even 3000 is a limited number given the probable demand.

Jason

[spearfisher]

Looking forward to driving one, it's probably going to be the best performing car for the money

[OC ///M]

gbb357:

Thanks for posting the article..interesting read.