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      03-16-2014, 12:36 PM   #1
CarReviewBMW
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Will Lexus regain the lead against BMW in 2014? New IS is selling very well.

Lexus was the #1 Luxury Brand in America for over a decade prior to BMW making their massive push around 2011/2012. Last year, Lexus have managed to stay within competitive striking distance. Finishing at around 275,000 units compared to BMW'S 300,000 and Mercedes's 310,000.

The big hit has been the new Lexus IS. Lexus have two volume sellers: The ES and the RX. The IS was never considered a volume seller for Lexus, yet at the rate the new IS is selling.. it looks like Lexus have created a third volume seller. Will Lexus overtake BMW in sales and regain their lead? The new RC Lineups coming out for Lexus could also boost them a bit.


It's pretty amazing the direction Lexus have taken. Instead of going all out luxury+comfort, they are now heading towards aggression and flash. I think it will alienate some of their older customers but will bring in new ones.

Almost impossible to catch MB, Lexus and BMW will fight for 2nd. MB's new C Class and the current CLA are going to ensure they continue to be #1 in sales.
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      03-16-2014, 06:17 PM   #2
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Once the New NX crossover SUV comes out and the RC coupe - Lexus sales will go up a lot.
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      03-16-2014, 06:28 PM   #3
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Aside from the engine options, I love the new IS. Great aggressive looking exterior, amazing interior, good driving characteristics and well priced. Only issue with it is the terrible engine options. For the average consumer, engine options are not as important (aside from mileage), so I can definitely see why its selling so well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarReviewBMW View Post
It's pretty amazing the direction Lexus have taken. Instead of going all out luxury+comfort, they are now heading towards aggression and flash. I think it will alienate some of their older customers but will bring in new ones.
I think it'll work out since they would have a hard time competing with the 2015 C-Class and how well it dominates in luxury+comfort.
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      03-16-2014, 06:34 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cloakster View Post
Aside from the engine options, I love the new IS. Great aggressive looking exterior, amazing interior, good driving characteristics and well priced. Only issue with it is the terrible engine options. For the average consumer, engine options are not as important (aside from mileage), so I can definitely see why its selling so well.



I think it'll work out since they would have a hard time competing with the 2015 C-Class and how well it dominates in luxury+comfort.
Great post. I think Lexus will take the #2 spot as well. You listed some very good points in that people look at the new Lexus line up and they see something different and aggressive. They could care less about engines and performance because the vast majority of the buyers willing to shell out 40k+ on a car don't know these things. They see something that is eye catching and they will buy it.

Lexus have created another volume seller and it's a smart creation in that it's not eating at ES/RX crowds, it chops away at Q50/3/A4 crowds instead.
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      03-16-2014, 09:44 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R N M View Post
Once the New NX crossover SUV comes out and the RC coupe - Lexus sales will go up a lot.
The NX is one of most awful designs ever.

Last edited by Blipit_; 03-16-2014 at 09:50 PM.
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      03-16-2014, 10:00 PM   #6
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The NX design reminds me of lamborghini for some reason. I actually don't mind it.
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      03-16-2014, 10:24 PM   #7
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I can say from my personally experience with our 2013 GS 350 F-Sport that Lexus has certainly turned a corner and is very competitive now with the best of the European brands in the luxury segment. Our car is gorgeous in and out, has very high quality materials, and is a joy to DRIVE rather than to ride in which makes all the difference in the world. Great, great car (though I'd say the 535i may still be just a tiny fraction better still). Lexus is doing all the right things as of now (sure wish Acura would pay attention)...
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      03-16-2014, 11:25 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majin ssj eric View Post
I can say from my personally experience with our 2013 GS 350 F-Sport that Lexus has certainly turned a corner and is very competitive now with the best of the European brands in the luxury segment. Our car is gorgeous in and out, has very high quality materials, and is a joy to DRIVE rather than to ride in which makes all the difference in the world. Great, great car (though I'd say the 535i may still be just a tiny fraction better still). Lexus is doing all the right things as of now (sure wish Acura would pay attention)...
The 4GS (or 5GS? I forget) is solid. It's arguably more of a driver's car than the F10 (not including the M5 obviously). It's just weird to think about but most head to head tests bear that fact out.
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      03-17-2014, 02:34 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majin ssj eric View Post
I can say from my personally experience with our 2013 GS 350 F-Sport that Lexus has certainly turned a corner and is very competitive now with the best of the European brands in the luxury segment. Our car is gorgeous in and out, has very high quality materials, and is a joy to DRIVE rather than to ride in which makes all the difference in the world. Great, great car (though I'd say the 535i may still be just a tiny fraction better still). Lexus is doing all the right things as of now (sure wish Acura would pay attention)...
Great post. I decided to post this thread in the general forums because the sheer hatred towards Lexus in the '3 Series' specific forums is pretty shocking.

This guy was bashing the IS sales compared to the 3 Series. Which is absurd because Lexus have never intented the IS to be a volume seller. They expected the IS line up to sell 35k(projected target) at the rate it's going, it will far surpass the 35k mark. The IS will most likely end up being a volume seller for Lexus despite it's modest goals prior to launch.

It is also quite interesting that people never mention the fact that the Lexus LS have outsold the BMW 7 Series over the last 15 years. Those are the 'flagship' sedans are they not?

The truth of the matter is that the Lexus Brand is gearing towards pure aggression and styling as oppose to just comfort and luxury. BMW still got the overall better performance but even that is up in the air with the
GS 350/IS 350/ and the RC Lineups.
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      03-17-2014, 03:21 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarReviewBMW View Post
It is also quite interesting that people never mention the fact that the Lexus LS have outsold the BMW 7 Series over the last 15 years. Those are the 'flagship' sedans are they not?
That is because the 7-series is by far the worst car in the segment.
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      03-17-2014, 03:28 AM   #11
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They all better watch out for Audi. Audi's goal is to become the world’s top-selling luxury car brand by 2020. They have plans to invest 11 billion euros between 2013 and 2015 in its bid to become the global No. 1 premium brand. Audi AG will start with introducing 17 new or revamped models in 2014.
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      03-17-2014, 04:15 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blipit_ View Post
They all better watch out for Audi. Audi's goal is to become the world’s top-selling luxury car brand by 2020. They have plans to invest 11 billion euros between 2013 and 2015 in its bid to become the global No. 1 premium brand. Audi AG will start with introducing 17 new or revamped models in 2014.
Audi is already a World powerhouse. Lexus is an American Powerhouse.Audi make some good cars but it will take a miracle for Audi to catch Lexus or BMW in America within 5-7 years.

I never got why Audi didn't take off in America the way Lexus did, especially since they got the entire line up from A4-A8+Performance/SUV segments to boot.
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      03-17-2014, 04:19 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R N M View Post
Once the New NX crossover SUV comes out and the RC coupe - Lexus sales will go up a lot.
I did some research on that NX. This could be a potential mega hit for Lexus, the only issue with this is if they price it at 35,000 MSRP.......(which is the most likely range) that will eat away at the RX sales.

If you are able to walk away with a new NX with around 38,500(everything included), why buy a RX for 45,000?

Maybe Lexus will just do a 'CLA', but the company have traditionally made the IS their entry model and I don't see it changing.
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      03-17-2014, 05:57 AM   #14
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Mercedes is looking VERY alive these days. The new c-class is a faaaar more appealing car than the horribly polarizing 'is'. I cannot imagine Lexus overtaking MB especially with the new CLA and the upcoming C class. In fact I reckon MB is poised to pass BMW in sales very shortly.....

Lexus has sort of lost their identity. they are trying to appeal to younger buyers but in turn have sabotaged their designs to such a degree that either people like them or hate them.
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      03-17-2014, 11:01 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IEDEI View Post
Mercedes is looking VERY alive these days. The new c-class is a faaaar more appealing car than the horribly polarizing 'is'. I cannot imagine Lexus overtaking MB especially with the new CLA and the upcoming C class. In fact I reckon MB is poised to pass BMW in sales very shortly.....

Lexus has sort of lost their identity. they are trying to appeal to younger buyers but in turn have sabotaged their designs to such a degree that either people like them or hate them.
The only people that matter are the ones willing to pay for 40k+ cars. Not online posters dreaming about BMW'S or driving Civics.

Keep in mind the IS is NOT Lexus's volume seller. The IS is simply a 'niche' lineup in Lexus's overall scheme of things. Now check these stats out:

2013 July-2014 February
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html


Now are these numbers BMW 3 or Class competitive? Of course not. It's not meant to be. The answers to those lineups are from the Lexus ES and RX.

But what we do see with the new IS(Lexus's third selling line) is that it have outsold the extremely highly rated ATS and have kept pace with Infiniti's primary volume seller(Q50). It also have beaten Audi's volume seller in the A4 despite massive incentives from Audi during July-December.




2013 July-2014 February
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html

http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2013/09...sa-canada.html



http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html




We will see how IS sales are for March. At the rate it's going,it will probably hit over 50k units(taking into consideration Lexus's massive Decembers).

50K Units is no BMW 3 Series, but that is a legitimate 'volume' seller for any Luxury Brand.
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      03-17-2014, 11:08 AM   #16
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If Lexus is going to be aggressive, then be aggressive. The lame carry-over engines just aren't going to cut it. They appear to have the looks and the handling down, they just need a little bit more of an edge in the motor dept.
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      03-17-2014, 12:04 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfJericho View Post
If Lexus is going to be aggressive, then be aggressive. The lame carry-over engines just aren't going to cut it. They appear to have the looks and the handling down, they just need a little bit more of an edge in the motor dept.
Yup, if they want to be more aggressive. Lexus has to develop some new engines, they are far behind in that department.
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      03-17-2014, 12:06 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarReviewBMW View Post
Audi is already a World powerhouse. Lexus is an American Powerhouse.Audi make some good cars but it will take a miracle for Audi to catch Lexus or BMW in America within 5-7 years.
That miracle is called money. They have it and will spend it.
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      03-17-2014, 12:14 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfJericho View Post
If Lexus is going to be aggressive, then be aggressive. The lame carry-over engines just aren't going to cut it. They appear to have the looks and the handling down, they just need a little bit more of an edge in the motor dept.
Agreed but new engines are coming.

NX will have a 2.0 turbo 4 cyl that will also replace the old 2.5 v6 in the IS.

Turbo 6 and 8 are prob 2yrs out at least.
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      03-17-2014, 12:17 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfJericho View Post
If Lexus is going to be aggressive, then be aggressive. The lame carry-over engines just aren't going to cut it. They appear to have the looks and the handling down, they just need a little bit more of an edge in the motor dept.
This is a great point but Lexus is trying to keep both their 'established' consumer base and add in new ones. That's tough to do. Right now there are already some Lexus owners saying they rather have comfort and luxury over 'wild looks' and 'driver car feels' in regards to the IS and GS. Lexus will lose some and gain some. It is impossible to get the best of both. BMW never got a huge consumer base because of their 'luxury' they got it because of their performance(despite the fact that BMW do have good luxury in a lot of their cars).
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      03-17-2014, 12:19 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarReviewBMW View Post
If you are able to walk away with a new NX with around 38,500(everything included), why buy a RX for 45,000?

Maybe Lexus will just do a 'CLA', but the company have traditionally made the IS their entry model and I don't see it changing.
CT200h is the entry level model that competes with A3, 1series, CLA.
It sells well considering its a hybrid only model.
If it had a gas engine, it would sell even better.

RX is due for a redesign - it will move up in size and price to make room for NX.
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      03-17-2014, 12:30 PM   #22
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The new Lexus RC lineup coming in is something special. This could be Lexus's greatest creation. They essentially created a M3/M4 fighter and than a smaller entry coup 4 Series fighter.
The RC-F(going against M3/M4) matches BMW. Of course full testings will be done later on this year as both models hit, but it should be very very close.
The RC-350 might not be quite as good as the 4-SERIES in terms of overall performance, but it undercuts the 4 in price and it have a unique style/design. To a lot of people the 4 Series is still just a 'two door 3 Series'. The RC-350 is NOT a two door IS.
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