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      09-23-2013, 10:15 PM   #1
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Exclamation Official S65 Bearing Specification/Clearance Wiki

Table of Contents:
  • Engine and Clearance Specifications
  • Connecting Rod Bearing History and Part Numbers
  • Comparing the S65 Clearances to other BMW Engines
  • Three truths of S65 bearing/side clearance
  • Historical Background of S65 Bearing Issue
  • Discovering S65 Bearing Issue
  • Connecting Rod Side Clearance Issue
  • Crankshaft and Bearing Changes (TBD)
  • Clevite White Paper
  • Confirming S65 Bearing Issue
  • Detonation vs. Bearing Wear: Could this be the cause?
  • Great Bearing Measurements of 2014
  • Bearing Eccentricity
  • Proposed Solutions
    • VAC/Calico Coated Bearings
    • Comparison between Virgin 702/703 bearings and Calico Coated bearings
    • WPC Treated Bearings
    • Thinner Oil
    • Crankshaft Machining
  • S65/S85 Bearing History
  • S65/S85 Bearing Hardness Issues
  • Bearing Photo Database
  • Related Threads

Engine and Clearance Specifications:
EngineS65B40
Cylinders8
Piston Bore92.00 mm3.6220 inch
Crankshaft Stroke75.2 mm2.9606 inch
Displacement3999 cc244.05 sq. inches
CrankshaftForged
Conecting Rod Length140.72 mm5.5402 inch
Connecting Rod Weight621.5 grams21.92 ounces
Piston Weight487.0 grams17.18 ounces
Crankshaft Main Journals & BearingsMetric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Main Journal Dimensions59.9800 mm2.36142 inch
Main Journal Variance59.9744 - 59.9834 mm2.36120 - 2.36155 inch
Bed plate + Bearing Dimensions60.01650 mm2.36285 inch
Bed Plate + Bearing Variance60.0125 - 60.0202 mm2.36270 - 2.36300 inch
Nominal Main Bearing Clearance0.03650 mm0.00144 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance0.0291 - 0.0458 mm0.00115 - 0.00180 inch
Crankshaft Rod JournalsMetric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod Journal Dimensions51.9825 mm2.04655 inch
Rod Journal Variance51.9811 - 51.9836 mm2.04650 - 2.04660 inch
Rod Journal Tolerance-0.00125, +0.00125 mm-0.00005, +0.00005 inch
Connecting Rod DimensionsMetric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod L.E. Bushing Dimensions21.00 mm0.82677 inch
Rod B.E. Bore Dimensions56.0120 mm2.20520 inch
Rod B.E. Variance56.0120 - 56.0146 mm2.20520 - 2.20530 inch
Rod B.E. Tolerance-0.0000, +0.00254 mm-0.00000, +0.00010 inch
Rod B.E. Thickness18.4150 mm0.72500 inch
Rod B.E. Variance18.4010 - 18.4200 mm0.72445 - 0.72520 inch
Rod B.E. Tolerance-0.0140, +0.0051 mm-0.00055, +0.00020 inch
Bearing Dimensions (088/089 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Top, Blue)2.0028 mm0.07885 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Bottom, Red)1.9977 mm0.07865 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Top, Blue)2.0015 - 2.0041 mm0.07880 - 0.07890 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Bottom, Red)1.9964 - 2.0015 mm0.07860 - 0.07880 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Top, Blue)-0.0013, +0.0013 mm-0.00005, +0.00005 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Bottom, Red)-0.0013, +0.0038 mm-0.00005, +0.00015 inch
Con Rod Clearance (088/089 Bearings) (1)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0180 mm2.04795 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance (1)52.0141 - 52.0281 mm2.04780 - 2.04835 inch
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0357 mm0.00140 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance (1)0.0305 - 0.0470 mm0.00120 - 00185 inch
Bearing Clearance Tolerance-0.0051 - +0.0114 mm-0.00020, +0.00045 inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal inch0.00068 inch/inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal Inch Variance (1)0.00059 - 0.00090 inch/inch
Bearing Eccentricity0.0203 mm0.00080 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Variance0.0178 - 0.0216 mm0.00070 - 0.00085 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Tolerance-0.0038, +0.0013 mm-0.00015, +0.00005 inch
Bearing Dimensions (702/703 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Top, Blue)1.9977 mm0.07865 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Bottom, Red)1.9939 mm0.07850 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Top, Blue)1.9977 - 1.9990 mm0.07865 - 0.07870 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Bottom, Red)1.9939 - 1.9952 mm0.07850 - 0.07855 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Top, Blue)-0.0000, +0.0013 mm-0.00000, +0.00005 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Bottom, Red)-0.0000, +0.0013 mm-0.00000, +0.00005 inch
Con Rod Clearance (702/703 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0243 mm2.04820 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance52.0230 - 52.0294mm2.04815 - 2.04840 inch
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0419 mm0.00165 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance0.0394 - 0.0483 mm0.00155 - 0.00190 inch
Bearing Clearance Tolerance-0.0025 - +0.0064 mm-.00010 - 0.00025 inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal inch0.00081 inch/inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal Inch Variance0.00076 - 0.00093 inch/inch
Bearing Eccentricity0.0508 mm0.00200 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Variance0.0445 - 0.0584 mm0.00175 - 0.00230 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Tolerance-0.0064, +0.0076 mm-0.00025, +0.00030 inch
Rod Bearing Alternatives
VAC (Calico) Coated Rod Bearings (2)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod Journal Dimensions51.9825 mm2.04655 inch
Rod Journal Variance51.9811 - 51.9836 mm2.04650 - 2.04660 inch
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0065 mm2.04750 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance52.0052 - 52.0230 mm2.04745 - 2.04815
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0241 mm0.00095 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance0.0216 - 0.0419 mm0.00085 - 0.00165 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Top, Blue)2.0048 mm0.07893 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Bottom, Red)2.0023 mm0.07883 inch
WPC Treated Rod Bearings (3)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod Journal Dimensions51.9825 mm2.04655 inch
Rod Journal Variance51.9811 - 51.9836 mm2.04650 - 2.04660 inch
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0065 mm2.04822 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance52.0040 - 52.0217 mm2.04820 - 2.04825
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0243 mm0.00167 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance0.0203 - 0.0406 mm0.00160 - 0.00175 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Top, Blue)1.9999 mm0.07870 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Bottom, Red)1.9952 mm0.07855 inch
  1. Includes previous measurement results from Van Dyne Engineering
  2. Two VAC bearings were measured, not a complete set. The bearings were not placed in connecting rods and torqued. The clearances were calculated based on comparisons to new factory bearing samples measured at the same time, same temperatures, and same equipment. The dimensions listed above are approximated based on bearing thickness differences compared to the control samples measured at the same time, same temperature, and same measuring equipment.
  3. Two WPC bearings were measured, not a complete set. The bearings were also placed in connecting rods, torqued, and clearances properly measured. The dimensions listed above are actual dimensions and not approximated based on bearing thickness differences.

Crankshaft History and Part Numbers
Crankshaft History
BMW Part NumberDescriptionWeightKgsApplicationProd. StartProd. EndSuperceded By
11 21 0 390 426Crankshaft with Bearings41.8 lb19.0 kgS85B50Apr-04Oct-0711 21 0 390 427
11 21 0 390 427Crankshaft with Bearings41.8 lb19.0 kgS85B50Sep-04Jan-0911 21 7 841 660
11 21 7 841 660Crankshaft with Bearings43.9 lb19.9 kgS85B50Apr-08Jan-0911 21 0 443 602
11 21 0 443 602Crankshaft with Bearings41.0 lb18.6 kgS85B50Jan-09Present
BMW Part NumberDescriptionWeightKgsApplicationProd. StartProd. EndSuperceded By
11 21 7 841 641Crankshaft with Bearings43.9 lb19.9 kgS65B40Jun-07May-0811 21 7 841 658
11 21 7 841 658Crankshaft with Bearings45.0 lb20.4 kgS65B40Jan-08Feb-0911 21 0 443 639
11 21 0 443 639Crankshaft with Bearings41.0 lb18.6 kgS65B40Jan-09Present


Connecting Rod Bearing History and Part Numbers
Connecting Rod Bearing History
BMW Part NumberDescriptionLocationColorStandard Size BearingsApplicationProd. StartProd. EndSuperceded By
11 24 7 835 662Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50Apr-04Apr-0411 24 7 836 288
11 24 7 835 663Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50Apr-04Apr-0411 24 7 836 289
11 24 7 836 288Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50Sep-04Apr-0711 24 7 838 088
11 24 7 836 289Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50Sep-04May-0711 24 7 838 089
11 24 7 838 088Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50, S65B40, S65B44Feb-06Oct-1111 24 7 841 702
11 24 7 838 089Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50, S65B40, S65B44Feb-06Mar-1111 24 7 841 703
11 24 7 841 702Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50, S65B40, S65B44Jun-10Present
11 24 7 841 703Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue52.00 mm (+0.00 mm)S85B50, S65B40, S65B44Jun-10Present
BMW Part NumberDescriptionLocationColorOversize BearingsApplicationProd. StartProd. EndSuperceded By
11 24 7 835 974Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed51.75 mm (+0.25 mm)S85B50Apr-04Apr-0411 24 7 836 290
11 24 7 835 975Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue51.75 mm (+0.25 mm)S85B50Apr-04Apr-0411 24 7 836 291
11 24 7 836 290Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed51.75 mm (+0.25 mm)S85B50Aug-05Dec-0711 24 7 838 090
11 24 7 836 291Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue51.75 mm (+0.25 mm)S85B50Aug-05Dec-0711 24 7 838 091
11 24 7 838 090Connecting Rod BearingBottomRed51.75 mm (+0.25 mm)S85B50, S65B40, S65B44Sep-05Present
11 24 7 838 091Connecting Rod BearingTopBlue51.75 mm (+0.25 mm)S85B50, S65B40, S65B44Sep-05Present


Comparing the S65 Clearances to other BMW Engines
The BMW TIS DVD set is a good source to gather lots of technical data on various BMW engines. Unfortunately, it is missing the data I want most from the S65. The data presented below shows how bearing clearance has changed over time on various BMW engines. It's not enough to just look at bearing clearance unless you also look at journal size. It's the ratio of clearance to journal size that is the all important piece of information we want out of this.

Some people also want to know how the clearance and maxRPM match up. So I've included a column to calculate the RPM to Clearance ratio.

Columns are as follows:
  • Model
  • Engine
  • Max RPM
  • Min Clearance (mm)
  • Nominal Clearance (mm)
  • Max Clearance (mm)
  • Min Clearance (SAE)
  • Nominal Clearance (SAE)
  • Max Clearance (SAE)
  • Journal Size (mm)
  • Clearance-to-Journal Size Ratio (mm)
  • Journal Size (SAE)
  • Clearance-to-Journal Size Ratio (SAE)
  • RPM to Clearance Ratio

There's a few things that jump out from this data.
  1. Around E36 and beyond, BMW switched to using much wider clearances to journal size ratio, and better RPM-Clearance ratio.
  2. E46 M3 after the recall went to the industry standard 0.001" per journal-inch clearance specification.
  3. S65 has the second worst clearance to journal size ratio, and by far the worst RPM to Clearance ratio. It's pretty clear that for whatever reason, the S65 sticks out like a sore thumb in this list.

BMW ///M Engines (Main Bearings)
Sorted by Model
ModelEngine
Max RPM
Oil
Min(mm)
Avg(mm)
Max(mm)
Min(SAE)
Avg(SAE)
Max(SAE)
Size(mm)
Ratio(mm)
Size(SAE)
Ratio(SAE)
RPM-Clr Ratio
E28 M5S38B35 (Main)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
59.987
0.0006
2.362
0.00055
1254
E30 M3S14 (Main)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
59.987
0.0006
2.362
0.00055
1254
E30 M3S14 (Main)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
55.000
0.0009
2.165
0.00091
759
E34 M5S38B35 (Main)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
59.987
0.0006
2.362
0.00055
1254
E34 M5S38B35 (Main)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
59.985
0.0008
2.362
0.00083
828
E34 M5S38B36 (Main)
7200
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
59.987
0.0006
2.362
0.00055
1309
E34 M5S38B36 (Main)
7200
0-30 to 5W40
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
59.985
0.0008
2.362
0.00083
864
E34 M5S38B38 (Main)
7200
0-30 to 5W40
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
59.965
0.0008
2.361
0.00083
863
E36 M3S50B30 (Main)
7280
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
59.964
0.0006
2.361
0.00055
1323
E36 M3S50B32 (Main)
7600
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
59.964
0.0006
2.361
0.00055
1381
E36 M3 VertS52 (Main)
6800
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.039
0.058
0.00079
0.00154
0.00228
59.987
0.0007
2.362
0.00065
1046
E39 M5S62 (Main)
7000
10W60 (-02/2000)
0.025
0.038
0.050
0.00098
0.00148
0.00197
69.964
0.0005
2.754
0.00054
1306
E39 M5S62 (Main)
7000
5W30 (+03/2000
0.025
0.038
0.050
0.00098
0.00148
0.00197
69.964
0.0005
2.754
0.00054
1306
E46 330iM54 (Main)
6500
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.039
0.058
0.00079
0.00154
0.00228
59.942
0.0007
2.360
0.00065
999
E46 M3S54 (Main)
8000
10W60 (-02/2000)
0.019
0.036
0.052
0.00075
0.00140
0.00205
59.964
0.0006
2.361
0.00059
1351
E46 M3S54 (Main)
8000
5W30 (+03/2000)
0.019
0.036
0.052
0.00075
0.00140
0.00205
59.964
0.0006
2.361
0.00059
1351
E60 550iN62 (Main)
6500
0-30 to 5W40
0.024
0.038
0.052
0.00094
0.00150
0.00205
69.984
0.0005
2.755
0.00054
1197
E60 M5S85 (Main)
8250
10W60
0.029
0.037
0.046
0.00115
0.00144
0.00180
59.984
0.0006
2.362
0.00061
1353
E92 335N54 (Main)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
55.996
0.0006
2.205
0.00059
1188
E92 335N55 (Main)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
64.996
0.0005
2.559
0.00051
1379
E92 M3 (2007-2013)S65 (Main)
8400
10W60
0.029
0.037
0.046
0.00115
0.00144
0.00180
59.984
0.0006
2.362
0.00061
1378
F10 550iN63 (Main)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
64.977
0.0005
2.558
0.00051
1378
F10 M5S63 (Main)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.033
0.046
0.00079
0.00130
0.00181
64.977
0.0005
2.558
0.00051
1378
Ferrari 328 GTS3.2L (Main)
7700
10W40
0.013
0.032
0.051
0.00051
0.00126
0.00201
62.986
0.0005
2.480
0.00051
1516


BMW ///M Engines (Rod Bearings)
Sorted by Model
ModelEngine
Max RPM
Oil
Min(mm)
Avg(mm)
Max(mm)
Min(SAE)
Avg(SAE)
Max(SAE)
Size(mm)
Ratio(mm)
Size(SAE)
Ratio(SAE)
RPM-Clr Ratio
E28 M5S38B35 (Rod)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.038
0.055
0.00079
0.00148
0.00217
48.983
0.0008
1.928
0.00077
901
E30 M3S14 (Rod)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.038
0.055
0.00079
0.00148
0.00217
47.983
0.0008
1.889
0.00078
883
E34 M5S38B35 (Rod)
6900
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.038
0.055
0.00079
0.00148
0.00217
48.983
0.0008
1.928
0.00077
901
E34 M5S38B36 (Rod)
7200
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.038
0.055
0.00079
0.00148
0.00217
47.983
0.0008
1.889
0.00078
921
E34 M5S38B38 (Rod)
7200
0-30 to 5W40
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
48.983
0.0010
1.928
0.00102
705
E36 M3S50B30 (Rod)
7280
0-30 to 5W40
0.028
0.049
0.070
0.00110
0.00193
0.00276
49.983
0.0010
1.968
0.00098
743
E36 M3S50B32 (Rod)
7600
0-30 to 5W40
0.026
0.047
0.068
0.00102
0.00185
0.00268
48.983
0.0010
1.928
0.00096
792
E36 M3 VertS52 (Rod)
6800
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.038
0.055
0.00079
0.00148
0.00217
44.983
0.0008
1.771
0.00083
816
E39 M5S62 (Rod)
7000
10W60 (-02/2000)
0.029
0.048
0.067
0.00114
0.00189
0.00264
48.983
0.0010
1.928
0.00098
714
E39 M5S62 (Rod)
7000
5W30 (+03/2000
0.029
0.048
0.067
0.00114
0.00189
0.00264
48.983
0.0010
1.928
0.00098
714
E46 330iM54 (Rod)
6500
0-30 to 5W40
0.020
0.038
0.055
0.00079
0.00148
0.00217
44.983
0.0008
1.771
0.00083
780
E46 M3S54 (Rod)
8000
5W30 (-02/2000)
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
48.983
0.0010
1.928
0.00102
784
E46 M3S54 (Rod)
8000
10W60 (+03/2000
0.030
0.050
0.070
0.00118
0.00197
0.00276
48.983
0.0010
1.928
0.00102
784
E60 550iN62 (Rod)
6500
0-30 to 5W40
0.028
0.049
0.070
0.00110
0.00193
0.00276
53.983
0.0009
2.125
0.00091
716
E60 M5S85 (Rod)
8250
10W60
0.025
0.048
0.070
0.00098
0.00187
0.00276
51.984
0.0009
2.047
0.00091
903
E92 335N54 (Rod)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.025
0.048
0.070
0.00098
0.00187
0.00276
49.978
0.0010
1.968
0.00095
737
E92 335N55 (Rod)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.025
0.048
0.071
0.00098
0.00189
0.00280
49.978
0.0010
1.968
0.00096
729
E92 M3 (2007-2010)S65 (Rod)
8400
10W60
0.030
0.036
0.047
0.00120
0.00140
0.00185
51.984
0.0007
2.047
0.00068
1228
E92 M3 (2011-2013)S65 (Rod)
8400
10W60
0.030
0.042
0.047
0.00120
0.00165
0.00185
51.984
0.0008
2.047
0.00081
1042
F10 550iN63 (Rod)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.025
0.048
0.070
0.00098
0.00187
0.00276
53.981
0.0009
2.125
0.00088
796
F10 M5S63 (Rod)
7000
0-30 to 5W40
0.025
0.048
0.070
0.00098
0.00187
0.00276
53.981
0.0009
2.125
0.00088
796
Ferrari 328 GTS3.2L (Rod)
7700
10W40
0.046
0.068
0.089
0.00181
0.00266
0.00350
43.628
0.0015
1.718
0.00155
498

Last edited by regular guy; 04-04-2014 at 12:47 AM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:15 PM   #2
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Historical Background of S65 Bearing Issue

Three truths of S65 bearing/side clearance
There are three things we seem to know for a fact:
  1. There is a long standing clearance-to-journal ratio best practice rule that factory and racing engine builders alike have followed for 50+ years. This best practice clearance ratio is well documented in many of web sites, and recommended by Clevite, the maker of three years worth of S65 engine bearings. The S65 clearance ratio for 2008 - ~2010 engines is smaller than this minimum recommended best practice value. (1, 2)
  2. Most of the bearing wear patterns we're seeing all seem to match the Clevite online/interactive bearing failure diagnosis web site, example #12 "Oil Starvation / Marginal Oil Film Thickness." The first of many causes mentioned by Clevite for this type of failure is "too little bearing oil clearance." (3)
  3. There is also a long standing rod side clearance best practice rule that factory and racing engine builders alike have followed for quite some time. Best practice clearance ratio is well documented in many of web sites. The S65 engine cuts that clearance significantly.

Notes:
1. Artitle: Clevite Bearing Clearance White Paper, Pages 16-18
2. Article: Geometrical parameters of engine bearings
3. Interactive: Clevite online/interactive bearing failure diagnosis web site

Historical Background of S65 Bearing Issue
It was very easy to ignore the very first blown motors because most seemed to originate from highly modified cars. Very early there was one blown NA motor from a guy in Thailand "custom tuned" by a local tuner. His motor blew and it cost a lot of money to replace it. Tuning by a local, unknown tuner was another reason to ignore this blown motor.

But about the same time, the first one or two blown motors showed up on bone stock M3's as well. These cars were totally stock with very low mileage. As time went on, more and more blown motors showed up, again NA motors with low miles. It seemed if you made it past 25,000 miles, then your motor would likely survive the warranty period.

Various theories were discussed to explain this phenomena. The theories ranged from inferior oil pump design to bearing clearance issues. But nobody had any data to support one argument over the other.

Discovering S65 Bearing Issue
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8


The bearings shown above came from a supercharged stroker motor. The engine was 4.6L and ran a very modest 6.0 PSI boost. After 24,000 miles, the engine was disassembled in July 2010 to rebuild as a low comperssion 4.7L motor. The bearings were photographed and stashed away. I always thought the bearings looked pretty "ratty" but at the time, nobody thought anything else about it. Today these photos might be ground-zero, exhibit-one in the discussion of rod bearing clearance.

By September 2011, the engine was ready to be reassembled when the race shop made the discovery. Van Dyne Engineering in Huntington Beach called to explain that the engine couldn't be reassembled because the bearing clearance was too small. They measured as little as 0.0011 inch rod bearing clearance, which Van Dyne said would lead to oil starvation and potentially catastrophic engine failure. To confirm these measurements we gathered one more factory crankshaft, and samples of two sets of connecting rods from different engines. Van Dyne confirmed the measurements all matched, and the factory BMW clearance was dangerously too small.

Van Dyne explained that the industry standard clearance should be 0.001" clearance per inch of journal diameter. The BMW factory measurements were approximately half those standard values. Van Dyne proposed a solution to send the crankshaft out for machining to have the journals resized to allow proper clearance. By November 2011, the machining had been completed, and the engine was ready for reassembly. During the engine assembly process, the clearances were all checked and verified to ensure the clearance problem was fixed.

Connecting Rod Side Clearance Issues

Discovering rod bearing clearance issues wasn't the only adverse discovery we made while assembling this motor. In addition to measuring bearing clearances, Van Dyne also measures connecting rod side play, crankshaft end play, valve opening/closing angles, valve spring seat pressure, and many other things. Connecting rod side clearance is measured by sticking a feeler gauge between the connecting rods to see how much space is between them. Engine builders like to see the connecting rod side clearance in a very specific measurement range. The measurement is taken when the bottom end is mostly assembled: the crankshaft is in place, and the pistons and connecting rods are attached and torqued down. If the side clearance is too little, then oil cannot escape and extra heat is generated by the friction of the connecting rods colliding against each other.

The crankshaft itself can be damaged as well. When the rod side clearance is too tight, as the engine heats up, the rods will swell and the crank will shrink. The tight clearance gets smaller and smaller until the rods collide and start riding against the crankshaft journal fillet. The fillet can be worn down, and damaged by this process, and the metal shavings it produces will damage the connecting rod bearings and other engine parts as well.



To measure the connecting rod side clearance, Van Dyne instinctively grabbed the feeler gauge for the normal, industry-accepted side clearance measurement. The feeler gauge wouldn't fit. Van Dyne grabbed the next feeler gauge half the thickness of the first: it still wouldn't fit. He then grabbed the next feeler gauge half that size: it still wouldn't fit. After four different tries, Van Dyne finally found the feeler gauge that fit. The side clearance was approximately 1/4 the size of industry expected clearance. The clearance was the thickness of two human hairs.

Without hesitation, Van Dyne grabbed our spare set of Carrillo rods that had been in the motor previously. He grabbed them as if he expected to find evidence of possible damage. Within a split second, Van Dyne pointed to the side of the Carrillo rod and said:
See that tiny blue spot? That's caused by heat from these two rods rubbing together because they are so tight. See that scrape mark? That's also caused by these two rods rubbing together.
As Van Dyne (and kawasaki00) explained, proper rod side clearance is essential to allow oil to escape. As the engine heats up, the connecting rods grow and the crankshaft shrinks until the connecting rods are touching each other. The oil can't escape, and extra heat is generated by the friction of the connecting rod collisions. The side of the crankshaft journal could also be damaged by the collisions as well. To me, the situation sounded pretty serious, and I thought it was going to mean another multi-week setback for the project.

Van Dyne deemed the situation so serious that he asked if we could go 60-minutes across town and bring back a factory BMW crankshaft (ours was a billet "stroker" crankshaft) and some factory BMW connecting rods (we were working with two sets of Carrillos). Van Dyne wanted to measure the factory journal width, and factory connecting rod thickness to see if the stroker crankshaft or Carrillo connecting rods were to blame.


Measuring Connecting Rod Side Clearance

Almost in disbelief, Van Dyne started taking measurements. First he measured with a set of calipers. Then when he realized the measurement didn't lie, Van Dyne knew he had to take accurate measurements with micrometers so he could make the necessary calculations to fix the problem.



To make sure the measurements are accurate, first the micrometers were calibrated to a known good thickness.



Van Dyne then started to measure both crankshafts: our billet crankshaft, and the factory crankshaft. The journal thickness measurements both matched. Next, we need to check the connecting rods to see if the Carrillo's were machined thicker than factory rods.



Following the crankshaft measurements, Van Dyne measured the connecting rods to see how they compared. Van Dyne measured both Carrillo and factory connecting rods.



The measurements showed the Carrillo and factory connecting rods are the same thickness. This is positive proof that the factory BMW crankshafts are machined without enough rod side clearance AND without enough rod bearing clearance. It's a double-whammy against proper engine oiling and operation.



Finally, Van Dyne set out to "fix" the clearance issue. I was relieved when Van Dyne said he could fix the issue immediately – as I feared project would suffer another long delay. Without hesitation, Van Dyne pulled out the bottle of DYKEM and started color coating one side of the connecting rods. This would be the side he planned to machine, and the DYKEM would serve as a visual reminder which connecting rods were finished, and which ones weren't.




Van Dyne's machine shop was able to grind down each connecting rod to the exact specification he wanted. When he reassembled the bottom end a few hours later, the measurements all agreed. The rod side clearance issue was now fixed.

What does this mean to you?

To get second opinion of the seriousness of this issue, I emailed kawasaki00 and I shared the actual specs with him (I'm not sharing them here). I asked if this was a big issue or not. Without hesitation, kawasaki00 agreed with Van Dyne that this was indeed a big issue, and he thought I was lucky to have an engine shop capable enough to measure and fix this problem. As he said, we really dodged a bullet.

I'm not an engine builder -- so I'll let kawasaki00 and BMRLVR chime in to answer questions on this topic. But I can put the pieces of the puzzle together and tell you what they mean to me. BMW gave you the thickness of two human hairs to let the oil squeeze out of the connecting rods. I don't think it takes an engine builder to realize that oil can't escape with side clearance that small. It makes me wonder how heated that trapped oil might get and how fast it might wear out my bearings -- bearings that already suffer from too little clearance of their own. Then with the connecting rods scraping against each other after they swell and the crankshaft shrinks, I can also see how metal shavings could get generated to destory the bearings and other engine components.

Here's some photos of the micro "blue marks" and abrasive scuff marks left on my Carrillo connecting rods from the previous engine build with improper side clearance.

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7
8
8


A few of the photos above are recreations because I didn't take actual photos of the calibration process, nor the actual scuff marks on the day of the engine build. I took those photos today to show what the process looks like. The scuff marks are the actual scuff marks on the same Carrillo connecting rods.

Complete photo library on this issue:

More photos are available at the following links.
Instrument Calibration and Connecting Rod Measurements
Side Play Clearance Measurements
Side Play Clearance Adjustments
Side Play Scuffing Evidence

Mahle-Clevite White Paper on Bearing Clearance Issues

This quote comes directly from a Mahle-Clevite white paper on bearing clearance, then I'll summarize at the end.
For most applications .00075 to .0010” (three quarters to one thousandth of an inch) of clearance per inch of shaft diameter is a reasonable starting point.

...

Using this formula will provide a safe starting point for most applications. For High Performance engines it is recommended that .0005” be added to the maximum value determined by the above calculation. The recommendation for our 2.000” shaft would be .0025” of clearance.

...

High Performance engines on the other hand, typically employ greater bearing clearances for a number of reasons. Their higher operating speeds result in considerably higher oil temperatures and an accompanying loss in oil viscosity due to fluid film friction that increases with shaft speed. Increased clearance provides less sensitivity to shaft, block, and connecting rod deflections and the resulting misalignments that result from the higher levels of loading in these engines. Use of synthetic oils with their better flow properties
can help to reduce fluid film friction.

...

Use of these coated bearings may result in slightly less clearance than the uncoated CLEVITE 77® high performance parts for the same application. This will typically be in the range of .0005.” This is because the coating, although expected to remain in place during service, is considered to be somewhat of a sacrificial layer. Some amount of the coating will be removed during break-in and operation, resulting in a slight increase in clearance.
Here's what this means to you. If you run high horsepower and high RPM, then you need extra bearing clearance, not less of it. The coated bearings are great, but you have to size your journals for them; and as Alekshop mentioned in a previous thread, you shouldn't have coated parting lines. If you have coated parting lines you must remove the coating in this area before using these bearings.

Mahle-Clevite recommends adding an extra 0.0005 for good measure for high horsepower, high RPM, and coated bearing applications. To see some numbers in real life, please see the following examples.

Factory clearance: 0.00125
Factory clearance with Calico coated bearings: 0.00085 - 0.00105 (16-32% smaller).
Factory clearance with TriArmor coated bearigns: 0.00075 - 0.00095 (24-40% smaller).

Recommended clearance for mains (60mm journal):
0.00100/inch + 0.0005 = 0.00286
0.00075/inch + 0.0005 = 0.00182

Recommended clearance for rods (52mm journal):
0.00100/inch + 0.0005 = 0.00205
0.00075/inch + 0.0005 = 0.00153

So there you have it: ideal mains should be 0.0018 - 0.0029 and ideal rods should be 0.00153 - 0.00205. You're given 0.00125 clearance from the factory and some may be thinking of reducing it another 16-40% with coated bearings without sizing the journals because they believe it gives them extra protection. The extra protection is true if you kept all things the same including the bearing clearance; but reducing the bearing clearance by 16-40% to get the extra protection of the coating is not recommended.

Some Photo Evidence of Oil Starvation

Time to add some pictures to the discussion to see what a bearing looks like due to lack of clearance. The first few pictures come straight from Mahle-Clevite. Thanks to BMRLVR for posting the B&W version of the Clevite bearing failure guide. I found the color version of the same thing. It looks like the color version has better pictures, but the B&W version might have some better illustrations and explanations. So here's both versions for reference.

B&W: http://www.wilmink.nl/Clevite/Clevit..._tech_info.pdf
Color: http://catalog.mahleclevite.com/bearing

Using the color bearing failure guide, see example #12 "Oil Starvation / Marginal Oil Film Thickness." The two pictures below come from this example. According to Mahle-Clevite, the number-one cause of failure of this type is too little oil clearance.





Next, let's compare these reference photos to some actual S65 bearings from various engines. Where possible, the mileage and circumstances will be mentioned. These photos are all found in other threads on this forum.


Engine-1: Modifications unknown, stock internals, Mileage: 24,000.




Engine-2: Bone Stock, stock internals. Mileage: ~4,000

This bone stock engine suffered from main bearing failure. Notice the wear spot on the main bearing and the appearance of a channel the oil made to get around it. The connecting rod bearings aren't much better. Many of the connecting rod bearings show signs of excessive wear due to oil starvation (too little clearance).













Engine-3: Upgraded internals, supercharged, Mileage: 24,000






Engine-4: Stock internals, supercharged, Mileage: 72,000




Engine-5: Stock internals, supercharged, Mileage: 90,000



The connection between these pictures and the reference Mahle-Clevite pictures is obvious. Even though there can always be multiple causes of oil starvation and bearing failure, the number one cause of the damage shown in these pictures is listed by Mahle-Clevite as too little bearing clearance.

I have more photos that I will post in the Bearing Photo Database. I've got at least one set, maybe two sets of photos of broken (snapped) S65 connecting rods with the big end of the connecting rod turned blue due to excessive heat (oil starvation due possible bearing clearance).

I hope these photos have been helpful to see with your own eyes what this problem looks like, and why it's happening.

Last edited by regular guy; 01-08-2014 at 01:46 AM.
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Confirming S65 Bearing Issue

Confirming the S65 Bearing Issue

For the next two years, word of the bearing clearance issue began to spread slowly, and understandably met some resistence. Since the 2011 discovery, many more engine failures have occurred, and many of them are on low mileage engines. Now that many engines are outside of warranty, the number of failures is beginning to accelerate on higher mileage engines. When bearings photos are posted, they seem to have all the same tell-tale signs seen in the photos above -- signs of oil starvation due to inadequate journal/bearing clearance.

With a few upcoming engine builds in planning or already in process, I thought it would be a good idea to confirm the original 2011 findings. I would take two factory crankshafts, two sets of connecting rods, fresh factory bearings, and two sets of used bearings from disassembled engines. We would convene at Van Dyne Engineering and see if we could duplicate the results.

Testing Methodology:
Tests would be conducted in the Van Dyne engine clean room, at room temperatures (approximately 74 degrees). To ensure measurement consistency, all crankshafts, rods, and measuring equipment sat in this environment for two hours before any measurements were taken. Three micrometers were calibrated using a 2-inch x 1/2-inch calibration block. All three micrometers would test the same crankshaft journals. All micrometers confirmed the same measurements. Each measurement was taken three times each to eliminate any possible variance due to equipment position, angle, etc. Once the three micrometers each validated the crank journals, the rod bearing "bore gauge" was calibrated to the micrometer. Each rod and bearing combination was torqued to exact factory specifications with new rod bolts, and proper rod bolt lubrication. Each rod bore was measured and verified three times to eliminate possible variance.



The Confirmed Results:
We confirmed the following results with the used bearings (same bearings removed from the engine with the same crankshaft). Keep in mind, these are the exact bearings that came out of this engine. This is what the clearance measured on the running engine with 30,000 miles.

Cyl-1
Cyl-2
Cyl-3
Cyl-4
Cyl-5
Cyl-6
Cyl-7
Cyl-8
Crank-1, Rod Journals
2.04655
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
Crank-1, Rod/Bearing Bore
2.04800
2.04780
2.04835
2.04780
2.04780
2.04780
2.04835
2.04780
Crank-1 Bearing Clearance
0.00145
0.00130
0.00180
0.00120
0.00130
0.00125
0.00175
0.00130


Notice Cylinder #3 and Cylinder #4. These two are at the opposite ends of the clearance spectrum. As a verification process, we swapped the bearings between these two rods, retorqued them to factory specifications, and took the measurements again. This would guarantee whether or not we had an anomaly with rod journal bore, or bearing thickness. Our measurements after swapping the bearings showed the same exact values and proved the rod bearing bore and not bearing thickness was causing these clearance variances.

In our next test, we replaced the Cylinder #4 rod with a brand new factory bearing. We re-torqued and remeasured. Then using our measurements, generated this table of clearances as if all cylinders had new bearings.

Cyl-1
Cyl-2
Cyl-3
Cyl-4
Cyl-5
Cyl-6
Cyl-7
Cyl-8
Crank-1, Rod Journals
2.04655
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
Crank-1, Rod/(New) Bearing
2.04800
2.04800
2.04800
2.04800
2.04800
2.04800
2.04800
2.04800
Crank-1 Bearing Clearance
0.00145
0.00150
0.00145
0.00140
0.00150
0.00145
0.00140
0.00150


Still using Crank #1, next we tested Carrillo connecting rods and another set of used bearings. This test is much less scientific than the previous one, but it provides a good cross reference to see if the Carrillo's have a similar bore size variance as the factory connecting rods. Since the Carrillo rod bolts are different, we made sure to follow the Carrillo torque specifications and use the exact thread/head lubricant they recommended.

Cyl-1
Cyl-2
Cyl-3
Cyl-4
Cyl-5
Cyl-6
Cyl-7
Cyl-8
Crank-1, Rod Journals
2.04655
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
Crank-1, Carrillo Rod/Bearing
2.04790
2.04780
2.04775
2.04780
2.04780
2.04780
2.04780
2.04795
Crank-1 Bearing Clearance
0.00135
0.00130
0.00120
0.00120
0.00130
0.00125
0.00120
0.00145


For completeness and redundancy, here's the same measurements with Crankshaft #2.

Cyl-1
Cyl-2
Cyl-3
Cyl-4
Cyl-5
Cyl-6
Cyl-7
Cyl-8
Crank-2, Rod Journals
2.04655
2.04650
2.04660
2.04650
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
Crank-2, Rod/Bearing Bore
2.04800
2.04780
2.04835
2.04780
2.04780
2.04780
2.04835
2.04780
Crank-2 Bearing Clearance
0.00145
0.00130
0.00175
0.00130
0.00130
0.00125
0.00175
0.00130


Cyl-1
Cyl-2
Cyl-3
Cyl-4
Cyl-5
Cyl-6
Cyl-7
Cyl-8
Crank-2, Rod Journals
2.04655
2.04650
2.04660
2.04650
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
Crank-2, Carrillo Rod/Bearing
2.04790
2.04780
2.04775
2.04780
2.04780
2.04780
2.04780
2.04795
Crank-2 Bearing Clearance
0.00135
0.00130
0.00115
0.00130
0.00130
0.00125
0.00120
0.00145


Detonation vs. Bearing Wear: Could this be the cause?
By Kawasaki00

Regular Guy sent me a complete set of rods bearings and pistons to document out of a STOCK engine.

The purpose of this post is to address the detonation. What was found is that there is no significant detonation leading to bearing wear on this engine. Not saying some engines may not have it but this engine does not.

Examples of bearing wear due to detonation:
The first two pictures are reference from another type of engine that has too much timing and detonation. The shiny spots on the rod and silver specs on the back of the bearings are what happens to a rod bearing when it is moving around in the rod under load. The bearing actually lifts off the rod, oil gets behind it and then when it is slammed back down again this is what causes the silver specs from fretting.





Comparing to this motor:
You can see the picture of the complete set of rods that the oil stain has not penetrated the back side of the bearing and discolored the rod. This means that at no time has the rod bearing deformed to the point that is lifts out of the rod itself. The back of the rod bearing also shows the same thing, there is also no fretting on the back of the bearing.





Where does detonation show?
The first place that detonation will show up is in the pin bore of the piston and the bushing of the rod.





There is no evidence of heat in the pin bores nor rainbow effect in the bushings. What I have circled on the rod pinbore is the area where when the engine is detonating it will beat the brass out the side like mushing the filling out of a doughnut. There is nothing to show this engine has been detonating to the point that is would cause any type of rod bearing wear.

Do the piston tops show detonation?
As far as the piston tops, well they have alot of build up. This can be from one of two things, too much blowby due to loose rings or on a street engine from the emission system dumping oil back into the intake side. Without having the entire engine to look at it is hard to say. I have noticed in the past that certain oils also do this. I wont place judjment on that as that will certainly erupt a brand war on here.



The second ring shows very good seal as it is only worn about 1/4 of the ring. When there is poor sealing that second ring will wear all the way across the face.



Conclusions:
In conclusion there is no detonation in this engine. Failure analysis and teardown documentation is something we do regularly. The findings are conclusive with other people and they are what they are to put it into a nutshell.

In the next couple days i will post the specs from the older rod bearings and will also post the numbers from a fresh set of bearings that are fit up ready to run.

Great Bearing Measurements of 2014

Preparation for clearance measurements

I wanted the clearance measurements to be as controlled as possible. To me, this meant following the manufacturer’s specification and maintaining a proper and controlled temperature environment. Each bearing was installed in the rod and the rod bolts were properly stretched. The fitted rods were placed out on an open table along with the measuring equipment for two hours before measuring. The room temperatures were set to approximately 74-77 degrees Fahrenheit to match the conditions at Van Dyne Engineering during the original tests. (To be honest, I didn't have my portable weather gauge with me at Van Dyne during the original tests, so I'm only guestimating the original temperature.) I am hoping these procedures will gain uniformity between all of the temperatures, measurements, and measuring equipment.

Selecting bearing pairs to match rod bearing bores

I wanted to simulate the possible effects of tolerance stack up. So before beginning to assemble the rods and bearings, I had previously measured all of the rod bearing bores. These measurements were as follows:

R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Rod B.E. Bore
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20520
0.00000
0.00010
Rod B.E. Thickness
0.72505
0.72515
0.72445
0.72500
0.72480
0.72520
0.72465
0.72450
0.72445
0.72520
0.72500
-0.00055
0.00020


To simulate the tolerance stack up, I wanted to select bearings as described below. Since it might not be possible to simulate all combinations, the following table describes my order of preference.
  • Small rod bore + thicker bearings
  • Small rod bore + nominal bearings
  • Nominal rod bore + nominal bearings
  • Large rod bore + thicker bearings
  • Large rod bore + nominal bearings
  • Nominal rod bore + thicker bearings

Using these criteria above, I came up with the following rod/bearing combinations.

702/703 Stack Up
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Rod B.E. Bore
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20520
0.00000
0.00010
Top (Blue)
0.07870
0.07870
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07870
0.07865
0.00000
0.00005
Bottom (Red)
0.07855
0.07855
0.07850
0.07850
0.07850
0.07855
0.07850
0.07850
0.07850
0.07855
0.07850
0.00000
0.00005
Combined Thickness
0.15725
0.15725
0.15715
0.15715
0.15715
0.15720
0.15715
0.15715
0.15715
0.15725
0.15715
0.00000
0.00010
Bore - CT
2.04805
2.04795
2.04805
2.04815
2.04815
2.04800
2.04805
2.04805
2.04795
2.04815
2.04805
-0.00010
0.00010
Bearing ID's (top/bottom)
V08/V02
V03/V05
V01/V01
V02/V03
V04/V04
V05/V06
V06/V07
V07/V08



088/089 Stack Up
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Rod B.E. Bore
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20520
0.00000
0.00010
Top (Blue)
0.07890
0.07890
0.07885
0.07880
0.07885
0.07885
0.07885
0.07885
0.07880
0.07890
0.07885
-0.00005
0.00005
Bottom (Red)
0.07875
0.07880
0.07860
0.07860
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07860
0.07880
0.07865
-0.00005
0.00015
Combined Thickness
0.15765
0.15770
0.15745
0.15740
0.15750
0.15750
0.15750
0.15750
0.15740
0.15770
0.15750
-0.00010
0.00020
Bore - CT
2.04765
2.04750
2.04775
2.04790
2.04780
2.04770
2.04770
2.04770
2.04750
2.04790
2.04770
-0.00020
0.00020
Bearing ID's (top/bottom)
V03/220.07
V01/220.03
V02/Z03
V08/Z07
V04/Z02
V05/Z04
V06/Z05
V07/Z06



Stretching rod bolts and installing bearings

Both sets of bearings (702/703 and 088/089) were given new rod bolts so the tests would be as equal as possible. New S65 rod bolts must be stretched before use. The stretching procedure is very specific. You must torque and release two times prior to final torque and use. The following procedure is documented in the BMS TIS guide for building the S65 engine.

Replace screws Screws washed and oiled
1. Jointing torque6 Nm
2. Setting torque20 Nm
3. Angle of rotation130-Degrees
Important 4. Release connecting rod bolts.
5. Jointing torque6 Nm
6. Setting torque20 Nm
7. Angle of rotation130-Degrees
Important 8. Release connecting rod bolts.
9. Jointing torque6 Nm
10. Setting torque20 Nm
11. Angle of rotation130-Degrees


This procedure would normally require two different tools. First you would need to use the torque wrench to torque to 6 NM then 20 NM. Second you would need to change to the torque angle gauge. The pictures below show the procedure with a normal (albeit electronic) torque wrench + torque angle gauge.



The normal procedure shown above is good, but is prone to minor errors. That type of torque angle gauge is can slip a little -- making the torque angle less accurate. This error happened to me repeatedly while stretching the rod bolts. So before the final rod bolt stretch, I decided it was time to upgrade my torque wrench anyways. I bought the all-in-one electronic Snapon ATECH3FR250B TECHANGLE torque wrench/torque angle gauge. This is a very nice torque wrench that is capable of switching between torque and torque angle. The electronics in the device make it possible to switch between units of torque at the press of a button (ft-lbs, in-lbs, Nm, dNm, Kcgm, and torque angle). The wrench supports different pre-sets too. So I was able to set the 20 Nm on one setting, then hit the button and switch to 130 degree torque angle. With this tool, there is no need to switch between two different devices.

Before the final stretch, all the rod bolts were completely removed. Each bolt was re-oiled, and the rod bolt under-cap was re-oiled as well. This ensures no galling could take place and an accurate final setting. The vice is also fitted with hard rubber boots to prevent damage to the connecting rods when they are clamped in.











Final Preparations

I'm almost ready to begin measuring. There's just a few more things I need to do. I promised to provide eccentricity measurements, so I need to mark the connecting rods at 5, 45, 90, 135, and 175 degrees.





Before measuring, I let all of the rods sit for two hours in the open air room temperature with thermostat set to ~76 degrees. The measuring equipment sits at the same location at the same temperatures. The Kestrel 4500 portable weather station is the small green device sitting on the lower left near rod #5 in the first photo, and upper left near rod #1 in the second photo. You see these on TV shows like Deadliest Catch. They are very nice and very accurate. This particular model will data log all environmental conditions and allows me to take individual snapshots in addition to a continuous data logs.



Last but not least, after letting everything sit for a few hours, I re-measured the crankshaft journals. No surprises here, they measured exactly the same as before, although in a different order. By that I mean, the measurement spread was identical to before, but the measurements seemed to change order on the journals. When you're talking about measuring tenths (0.00010 inch) and half-tenths (0.00005 inch), I'm told this is quite normal. Just to make sure, I called Van Dyne for advice. Van Dyne told me: "If you try to understand it and don't ignore it, you'll never get anything done."

Crank Journals
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
New
2.04655
2.04660
2.04660
2.04655
2.04655
2.04655
2.04655
2.04650
2.04650
2.04660
2.04655
-0.00005
0.00005
Old
2.04655
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
2.04655
2.04660
2.04650
2.04650
2.04660
2.04655
-0.00005
0.00005


The Results:
088/089 Bearing Clearances

Calibration and set up:







088/089 Results
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Rod B.E. Bore
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20520
0.00000
0.00010
Top (Blue)
0.07890
0.07890
0.07885
0.07880
0.07885
0.07885
0.07885
0.07885
0.07880
0.07890
0.07885
-0.00005
0.00005
Bottom (Red)
0.07875
0.07880
0.07860
0.07860
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07860
0.07880
0.07865
-0.00005
0.00015
Combined Thickness
0.15765
0.15770
0.15745
0.15740
0.15750
0.15750
0.15750
0.15750
0.15740
0.15770
0.15750
-0.00010
0.00020
Bore - CT
2.04765
2.04750
2.04775
2.04790
2.04780
2.04770
2.04770
2.04770
2.04750
2.04790
2.04770
-0.00020
0.00020
Bearing Measurements
2.04785
2.04790
2.04795
2.04795
2.04800
2.04795
2.04800
2.04800
2.04785
2.04800
2.04795
-0.00010
0.00005
Nominal Bearing Clearance
0.00130
0.00135
0.00140
0.00140
0.00145
0.00140
0.00145
0.00145
0.00130
0.00145
0.00140
-0.00015
0.00010
Min Stack Up Clearance
0.00125
0.00130
0.00135
0.00135
0.00140
0.00135
0.00140
0.00140
0.00125
Max Stack Up Clearance
0.00135
0.00140
0.00145
0.00145
0.00150
0.00145
0.00150
0.00150
0.00150
Bearing ID's (top/bottom)
V03/220.07
V01/220.03
V02/Z03
V08/Z07
V04/Z02
V05/Z04
V06/Z05
V07/Z06
Bearing ID Photos
Clearance Photos


Official 088/089 Bearing Thickness and Clearance Specifications

EngineS65B40
Bearing Dimensions (088/089 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0180 mm2.04795 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance (1)52.0141 - 52.0281 mm2.04780 - 2.04835 inch
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0357 mm0.00140 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance (1)0.0305 - 0.0470 mm0.00120 - 00185 inch
Bearing Clearance Tolerance-0.0051 - +0.0114 mm-0.00020, +0.00045 inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal inch0.00068 inch/inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal Inch Variance (1)0.00059 - 0.00090 inch/inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Top, Blue)2.0028 mm0.07885 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Bottom, Red)1.9977 mm0.07865 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Top, Blue)2.0015 - 2.0041 mm0.07880 - 0.07890 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Bottom, Red)1.9964 - 2.0015 mm0.07860 - 0.07880 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Top, Blue)-0.0013, +0.0013 mm-0.00005, +0.00005 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Bottom, Red)-0.0013, +0.0038 mm-0.00005, +0.00015 inch


Notes: (1) Includes previous measurement results from Van Dyne Engineering

When comparing to the original Van Dyne measurements, there seem to be no surprises here. The crankshaft journals measured within the same ranges, as did the connecting rod + bearing assemblies. With the addition of the newer virgin 089 bearings, I have changed the "official" estimate of 0.00125 inch clearance to 0.00140 inch clearance. That's a 0.00015 inch increase over the previous nominal measurements. That increases the nominal clearance-to-journal/inch ratio from 0.00061 inch/inch to 0.00068 inch/inch, which is still lower than the minimum Clevite recommendation of 0.00075 inch/inch.

702/703 Bearing Clearances

Calibration and set up:





702/703 Results
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Rod B.E. Bore
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20530
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20520
2.20530
2.20520
0.00000
0.00010
Top (Blue)
0.07870
0.07870
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07870
0.07865
0.00000
0.00005
Bottom (Red)
0.07855
0.07855
0.07850
0.07850
0.07850
0.07855
0.07850
0.07850
0.07850
0.07855
0.07850
0.00000
0.00005
Combined Thickness
0.15725
0.15725
0.15715
0.15715
0.15715
0.15720
0.15715
0.15715
0.15715
0.15725
0.15715
0.00000
0.00010
Bore - CT
2.04805
2.04795
2.04805
2.04815
2.04815
2.04800
2.04805
2.04805
2.04795
2.04815
2.04805
-0.00010
0.00010
Bearing Measurements
2.04830
2.04815
2.04840
2.04820
2.04835
2.04830
2.04820
2.04820
2.04815
2.04840
2.04820
-0.00005
0.00020
Nominal Bearing Clearance
0.00175
0.00160
0.00185
0.00165
0.00180
0.00175
0.00165
0.00165
0.00160
0.00185
0.00165
-0.00010
0.00025
Min Stack Up Clearance
0.00170
0.00155
0.00180
0.00160
0.00175
0.00170
0.00160
0.00160
0.00155
Max Stack Up Clearance
0.00180
0.00165
0.00190
0.00170
0.00185
0.00180
0.00170
0.00170
0.00190
Bearing ID's (top/bottom)
V08/V02
V03/V05
V01/V01
V02/V03
V04/V04
V05/V06
V06/V07
V07/V08
Bearing ID Photos
Clearance Photos


Official 702/703 Bearing Thickness and Clearance Specifications

EngineS65B40
Bearing Dimensions (702/703 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0243 mm2.04820 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance52.0230 - 52.0294mm2.04815 - 2.04840 inch
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0419 mm0.00165 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance0.0394 - 0.0483 mm0.00155 - 0.00190 inch
Bearing Clearance Tolerance-0.0025 - +0.0064 mm-.00010 - 0.00025 inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal inch0.00081 inch/inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal Inch Variance0.00076 - 0.00093 inch/inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Top, Blue)1.9977 mm0.07865 inch
Nominal Bearing Thickness (Bottom, Red)1.9939 mm0.07850 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Top, Blue)1.9977 - 1.9990 mm0.07865 - 0.07870 inch
Bearing Thickness Variance (Bottom, Red)1.9939 - 1.9952 mm0.07850 - 0.07855 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Top, Blue)-0.0000, +0.0013 mm-0.00000, +0.00005 inch
Bearing Tolerance (Bottom, Red)-0.0000, +0.0013 mm-0.00000, +0.00005 inch


For me, there were no surprises here as well. Kawasaki00 had measured a full set of 702/703 rods with better equipment and detected a 0.00030 inch increase in clearance. The measurements above confirm that, and found a 0.00025 inch increase in clearance (effectively the same thing as kawasaki00's findings).

Conclusions

This was an enormous amount of work. I tried to be as meticulous as possible. I was willing to let the data show, what the data shows. There are some slight inconsistencies and deviations from the previous measurements, but those deviations are in the noise (0.00005 differences). All in all, everything turned out the same.

Putting together the charts and tables is very time consuming work. There was a lot of cut-paste from one table to another. Even though I tried to cross reference very data entry with photos, it's very possible I made some mistakes here when I cut-paste some entries. If any such errors are found, please point them out and I will fix them.

Last edited by regular guy; 04-04-2014 at 12:46 AM.
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Proposed Solutions: VAC Bearings

Bearing Eccentricity

Article: Geometrical parameters of engine bearings
Article: Hydrodynamic Bearings
Article: Fundamentals of Fluid Film Journal Bearing Operation and Modeling


I've got to be honest, I didn't know anything about bearing eccentricity when I created this thread, and I doubt I'll be able to add any insight into the subject. As I learned, the bearing is not round, it is slightly oval shaped. The bearing clearance is the smallest at 90 degrees to the parting line, and largest at the parting line. This ratio between the two is called "eccentricity" and as I understand it is designed to allow oil to escape and be replenished. If there is too little eccentricity, it would be harder for oil to esscape. If the oil doesn't escape then the trapped oil can become super heated and cause both bearing and connecting rod damage. This could be one explanation why connecting rods such as the ones below shows signs of super heating that lead to catastrophic failures.





According to the first article above, these are values one could expect to measure for bearing eccentricity:
For passenger cars: 0.0002 - 0.0008” For high performance cars: 0.0006 - 0.0012”
The values above represent a fixed value, not a ratio of rod journal diameter or surface area. So to me, that spec above doesn't make sense. I would expect it to be more of a ratio of journal surface area instead of a fixed value. Regardless, the information above is valuable for our understanding.

Where to measure

According to the article above, I should measure eccentricity at 3/8 inch above the parting line for journals between 1.6 - 3.4 inch diameter. At first, this is not what I did. I had completed the measurements and I had already written 90% of this article and prepared 100% of the charts and graphs. But the perfectionist in me wouldn't let it go. The 702/703's were still installed in the rods, so I quickly took the measurements. The following night, I replaced the 702/703's with the 088/089's and took those measurements too.

Marking and Measuring

For this article, I had measured at 5, 45, 90, 135, and 175 degrees on 088/089 and 702/703 bearings. To capture the "official" eccentricity measurements according to the abovementioned article, I also measured at 20 and 160 degrees as well. Before taking any measurements, I did some quick calculations and marked the connecting rod locations as shown below.





088/089 Bearing Eccentricity (while measuring)






702/703 Bearing Eccentricity (while practicing)







Data Results
088/089 Bearing Results

Bearing Bore Measurements by Angle

088/089 Ecc. Meas.
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
005 Degrees
2.05070
2.05040
2.05035
2.05055
2.05060
2.05050
2.05035
2.05050
2.05035
2.05070
2.05049
-0.00014
0.00021
020 Degrees
2.04860
2.04860
2.04880
2.04880
2.04880
2.04885
2.04885
2.04885
2.04860
2.04885
2.04877
-0.00017
0.00008
045 Degrees
2.04815
2.04800
2.04840
2.04815
2.04830
2.04805
2.04835
2.04830
2.04800
2.04840
2.04821
-0.00021
0.00019
090 Degrees
2.04785
2.04790
2.04795
2.04795
2.04800
2.04795
2.04800
2.04800
2.04785
2.04800
2.04795
-0.00010
0.00005
135 Degrees
2.04800
2.04820
2.04820
2.04840
2.04820
2.04810
2.04840
2.04820
2.04800
2.04840
2.04821
-0.00021
0.00019
160 Degrees
2.04860
2.04860
2.04880
2.04870
2.04885
2.04880
2.04870
2.04885
2.04860
2.04885
2.04874
-0.00014
0.00011
175 Degrees
2.05060
2.05100
2.05035
2.05060
2.05055
2.05015
2.05050
2.05055
2.05015
2.05100
2.05054
-0.00039
0.00046


Bearing Clearance Measurements by Angle

088/089 Ecc. Clr.
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
005 Degrees
0.00285
0.00250
0.00240
0.00260
0.00260
0.00255
0.00235
0.00250
0.00235
0.00285
0.00254
-0.00019
0.00031
020 Degrees
0.00075
0.00070
0.00085
0.00085
0.00080
0.00090
0.00085
0.00085
0.00070
0.00090
0.00085
-0.00015
0.00005
045 Degrees
0.00030
0.00010
0.00045
0.00020
0.00030
0.00010
0.00035
0.00030
0.00010
0.00045
0.00026
-0.00016
0.00019
090 Degrees
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
135 Degrees
0.00015
0.00030
0.00025
0.00045
0.00020
0.00015
0.00040
0.00020
0.00015
0.00045
0.00026
-0.00011
0.00019
160 Degrees
0.00075
0.00070
0.00085
0.00075
0.00085
0.00085
0.00070
0.00085
0.00070
0.00085
0.00079
-0.00009
0.00006
175 Degrees
0.00275
0.00310
0.00240
0.00265
0.00255
0.00220
0.00250
0.00255
0.00220
0.00310
0.00259
-0.00039
0.00051


Complete 088/089 Bearing Specifications with Eccentricity

EngineS65B40
Bearing Dimensions (088/089 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0180 mm2.04795 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance (1)52.0141 - 52.0281 mm2.04780 - 2.04835 inch
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0357 mm0.00140 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance (1)0.0305 - 0.0470 mm0.00120 - 00185 inch
Bearing Clearance Tolerance-0.0051 - +0.0114 mm-0.00020, +0.00045 inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal inch0.00068 inch/inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal Inch Variance (1)0.00059 - 0.00090 inch/inch
Bearing Eccentricity0.0203 mm0.00080 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Variance0.0178 - 0.0216 mm0.00070 - 0.00085 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Tolerance-0.0038, +0.0013 mm-0.00015, +0.00005 inch


702/703Bearing Results

Bearing Bore Measurements by Angle

702/703 Ecc. Meas.
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
005 Degrees
2.05280
2.05290
2.05290
2.05280
2.05250
2.05260
2.05270
2.05290
2.05250
2.05290
2.05276
-0.00026
0.00014
020 Degrees
2.05045
2.05035
2.05035
2.05020
2.05010
2.05020
2.05035
2.05035
2.05010
2.05045
2.05029
-0.00019
0.00016
045 Degrees
2.04900
2.04880
2.04880
2.04920
2.04870
2.04890
2.04880
2.04890
2.04870
2.04920
2.04889
-0.00019
0.00031
090 Degrees
2.04830
2.04815
2.04840
2.04820
2.04835
2.04830
2.04820
2.04820
2.04815
2.04840
2.04820
-0.00005
0.00020
135 Degrees
2.04900
2.04890
2.04900
2.04885
2.04900
2.04890
2.04890
2.04885
2.04885
2.04900
2.04893
-0.00007
0.00008
160 Degrees
2.05035
2.05045
2.05035
2.05020
2.05040
2.05040
2.05035
2.05020
2.05020
2.05045
2.05034
-0.00014
0.00011
175 Degrees
2.05280
2.05300
2.05270
2.05280
2.05285
2.05290
2.05285
2.05300
2.05270
2.05300
2.05286
-0.00016
0.00014


Bearing Bore Measurements by Angle

702/703 Ecc. Clr.
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
005 Degrees
0.00450
0.00475
0.00450
0.00460
0.00415
0.00430
0.00450
0.00470
0.00415
0.00475
0.00450
-0.00035
0.00025
020 Degrees
0.00215
0.00220
0.00195
0.00200
0.00175
0.00190
0.00215
0.00215
0.00175
0.00220
0.00215
-0.00040
0.00005
045 Degrees
0.00070
0.00065
0.00040
0.00100
0.00035
0.00060
0.00060
0.00070
0.00035
0.00100
0.00063
-0.00027
0.00037
090 Degrees
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
0.00000
135 Degrees
0.00070
0.00075
0.00060
0.00065
0.00065
0.00060
0.00070
0.00065
0.00060
0.00075
0.00066
-0.00006
0.00009
160 Degrees
0.00205
0.00230
0.00195
0.00200
0.00205
0.00210
0.00215
0.00200
0.00195
0.00230
0.00200
-0.00005
0.00030
175 Degrees
0.00450
0.00485
0.00430
0.00460
0.00450
0.00460
0.00465
0.00480
0.00430
0.00485
0.00460
-0.00030
0.00025


Complete 702/703 Bearing Specifications with Eccentricity

EngineS65B40
Bearing Dimensions (702/703 Bearings)Metric DimensionsSAE (Inch) Dimensions
Rod + Bearing Dimensions52.0243 mm2.04820 inch
Rod + Bearing Variance52.0230 - 52.0294mm2.04815 - 2.04840 inch
Nominal Rod Bearing Clearance0.0419 mm0.00165 inch
Bearing Clearance Variance0.0394 - 0.0483 mm0.00155 - 0.00190 inch
Bearing Clearance Tolerance-0.0025 - +0.0064 mm-.00010 - 0.00025 inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal inch0.00081 inch/inch
Bearing Clearance per Journal Inch Variance0.00076 - 0.00093 inch/inch
Bearing Eccentricity0.0508 mm0.00200 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Variance0.0445 - 0.0584 mm0.00175 - 0.00230 inch
Bearing Eccentricity Tolerance-0.0064, +0.0076 mm-0.00025, +0.00030 inch


Even in this manner, it's hard to get a feel for the data. So graphing is the only way to look at it to see what's really going on. Even though the charts and specifications all say there's a difference, just what does it look like on a graph?

Graphs and Conclusions

I created the graphcs as a scatter plot with a "best fit" polynomial line to follow the contour of the measurements. That's when the results really jumped out and you could visually see for the first time how these bearings have changed. Not only did the bearing clearance change between 088/089 and 702/703, but so did the eccentricity. The eccentricity didn't change by a little, it seems to have changed by a LOT! See for yourself.

"Common" Eccentricity


Conclusions and my $0.02

When I was asked to measure bearing eccentricity, I had no idea what I would find. I guess I presumed that 088/089 bearings would both follow the same guidelines and show the same eccentricity. Even when I was measuring and looking at the numbers, I was making that presumption and didn't notice any differences. It wasn't until I looked at the graph that it became very obvious that something radical had changed.

The bearing eccentricity changed from 0.00085 inch on the 088/089 bearings to 0.00200 inch on the 702/703 bearings. That's a 2.5 times increase in eccentricity clearance which will allow the oil to escape the rods that much better.

It wasn't too long ago that I thought there was only one bearing part number. But that proved wrong! Between the S85 and S65 lifespan there were a total of FOUR different bearing designs, but I believe only two of those ever saw production on the S65. The older designs are long gone and we'll never get a fresh set of those bearings to test and see how they differ from these (I already tried).

After I discovered the new bearing designs (702/703's), I thought they shared the same dimensions as the originals (088/089's). But that proved wrong too. These new measurements proved that the 702/703 bearings changed material, clearance, and pretty radically changed eccentricity.

By now I think I have a much clearer picture than when I started. Some will say (and have already said) that the 702/703 bearings changed dimensions because of the materials change. I've got to be honest, that sounds very compelling on the surface but there's one thing about it that really bugs me. Nobody has explained why the harder material would require extra clearance when 1) the bearing is never supposed to touch the journal, and 2) it would seem that it has less friction than the older lead/copper design. So to me, the dimensional changes of the new bearing weren't based on a simple materials change, but were much more deliberate.

The S65 started production with 088/089 bearings. But something was wrong: relatively new engines were puking connecting rods. The clearances were too tight, the side clearance was too tight, the eccentricity was too tight, and the oil was too thick. As a result, it seems like tolerance stack up with a bad luck of the draw, and your engine might end up looking like the photos shown above. So BMW decided to do something about it.

When BMW designed the newer 702/703 bearings to comply with lead-free regulations, they made changes. I believe they took steps to mitigate these problems. BMW increased the rod bearing clearance, and they increased the eccentricity by 250%. Those changes mean two of the four possible "trouble spots" I mentioned above have now been addressed.

In August 2013, BMW-NA made a specification change to the oil allowed in the S85/S65. After five years of only allowing 10W60, BMW relaxed the specifications and is now allowing LL-01 approved 0W40, 5W30, and 5W40 weight oils. Three of the four potential trouble areas we identified in the S65 have now been addressed. The only thing that remains is the rod side clearance. With the help of some buddies down the road, I might be able to take measurements on a wide range of BMW S65 crankshafts to see if the rod side clearance has changed throughout the three different crankshafts manufactured for the S65. If that comes to pass, I'll be sure to post the results either way (changed side clearance or not).

Van Dyne identified two of the four potential problems (journal clearance, rod side clearance), Kawasaki00 and BMWLVR were advocates for thinner oils, and we really kind of backed in to the eccentricity discussion and discovered a big change eccentricity clearances.

Some will say it's all a coincidence. They are just as entitled to their opinion as I am mine. I don't think it's a coincidence. For whatever reason, BMW changed (coincidence or not), BMW had three years with old bearing; then three years with new bearings; then changed to allow thinner oils. Sure it may all be a coincidence, but to me, it seems like they were chasing something and were making incremental changes to mitigate what they saw as a problem.

Blast away.

VAC/Calico Coated Bearings


One popular solution recently being discussed is use of the VAC/Calico coated bearings. Many engine builders frown upon the use of coated bearings because they add to the bearing thickness, and the coating wears quickly and unevenly. The Calico web site specifies the added thickness between 0.00020 - 0.00040 inch. For the S65 with a potential bearing clearance issue, this could be the wrong approach. On the flip side, hot rodders love them because they decrease the bearing surface friction. But until now, no data was available to know one way or the other.

On my recent data gathering trip, Tom @ EAS was gracious enough to allow me to measure some VAC/Calico coated bearings he was installing on their shop/track car. I didn't measure all of the bearings; I only measured two. I also didn't have a chance to a proper clearance test on these bearings.. However I did measure the bearing thickness and compared it to a reference sample of factory bearing. Using the factory bearing as reference, it's easy to see whether or not the bearings are thicker, thinner, or relatively the same as factory. These are my measurements exactly as I wrote them down.

Factory Reference
VAC-1
VAC-2
Top (Blue)
0.07885
0.07880
0.07885
Bottom (Red)
0.07865
0.07890
0.07895


First thing to notice are the VAC Uppers are thinner than VAC Lowers. It looks very clearly like the bearing shells are reversed becaused the uppers are supposed to be thicker than the lowers. But in these sample measurements, the lowers were thicker than the uppers. This is why I concluded the bearings were mislabled. In the chart below, I corrected the measurements to correctly correspond with the BMW upper and lower bearing shells.

Factory Reference
VAC-1
VAC-2
Top (Blue)
0.07885
0.07890
0.07895
Bottom (Red)
0.07865
0.07880
0.07885


Next thing to notice are the bearings are indeed thicker than factory bearings. Using these two examples, the extra thickness ranges between 0.00020 - 0.00030 inch, exactly where Calico specifications say they should be. Even though I didn't have a chance to place these bearings into a connecting rod and measure the clearance, using these measurements above, it's fairly clear to see how the clearance would be affected. I know this isn't a scientific test as the measurements are a mere approximation. Once actual measurements become available, the data below will be replaced with actual clearance measurements.

Best Case FCT+VAC
Worst Case FCT+VAC
Best Case CARR+VAC
Worst Case CARR+VAC
Crank Journal
2.04650
2.04660
2.04650
2.04660
Rod Bore
2.04815
2.04750
2.04760
2.04745
Bearing Clearance
0.00165
0.00090
0.00110
0.00085


Before leaving, I was able to talk to Tom and Steve at EAS. I told them my findings. At first I thought the bearings were relatively unchanged versus factory. But after closer inspection, I could clearly see they were approximately 0.00010 - 0.00015 thicker than stock. Add the two half bearings shells together and you get the exact Calico specification of 0.00020 - 0.00040 thickness of their coating. I also alerted Tom and Steve to what I believed were the mislabeled bearing shells: uppers marked as lowers, and visa versa. Therefore as one final test, we put one of the VAC/Calico bearings into a factory connecting rod I brought with me. We measured 0.00290 inch clearance, which is far larger than anything I measured before; in fact it's too large. I'm still perplexed by this result, but it may have been because we didn't have time to remove the coating from the parting lines on the bearing shells -- which I'm told will invalidate the results. So until I get a full set of VAC/Calico bearings to measure, the full set of VAC results are somewhat inconclusive.

Thanks to Tom and Steve @ EAS for letting me take these measurements and share them with the community.


Comparison between Virgin 702/703 bearings and Calico Coated bearings

702/703 Results
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Top (Blue)
0.07870
0.07870
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07865
0.07870
0.07870
-0.00005
0.00000
Bottom (Red)
0.07855
0.07855
0.07850
0.07850
0.07850
0.07855
0.07850
0.07850
0.07850
0.07855
0.07850
0.00000
0.00005
Calico Results
R1
R2
R3
R4
R5
R6
R7
R8
MIN
Max
Official
Min Dev.
Max Dev.
Top0.078500.078600.078550.078500.078600.078600.078500.07855
0.07850
0.07860
0.07860
-0.00010
0.00000
Bottom0.078700.078750.078850.078750.078700.078750.078850.07885
0.07870
0.07885
0.07880
-0.00010
0.00005


Notes:
  • Calico coated bearings start life as 702/703 factory BMW bearings. An anti-friction coating is applied on top of the bearing surface.
  • Top table are virgin 702/703 bearings as measured in the "Official Bearing Wiki" Thread.
  • Bottom table are a full set of Calico bearings with approximately 16k miles on them.
  • Virgin 702/703 bearings have thicker upper (red), and thinner lower (blue) bearings.
  • Calico bearings have thinner upper and thicker lower bearings (opposite of OEM).
  • Assuming bearings were swapped, the average thickness of the Calico coated bearings is 0.00010 inch thicker PER SHELL than OEM.

Last edited by regular guy; 04-04-2014 at 12:47 AM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:17 PM   #5
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Proposed Solutions: WPC Treated Bearings

WPC Treated Bearings

Pictures show factory bearings (left) compared to WPC treated bearings (right).

Here's a possible solution I haven't yet seen discussed. The idea was first pitched to me by Auto Talent in Los Angeles. I forgot all about that, but then re-pitched by m3post user 'e92zero.' WPC has a micro shot peening process that they say reduces friction without changing dimensions of the treated surface. WPC uses this treatment on many surfaces including engine bearings. It's hard to imagine engine bearing thickness wouldn't be affected by the WPC treatment because we're looking at clearances in the ten-thousandths of an inch. E92Zero proposed to send my reference bearings to WPC for treatment then let me take proper measurements when they returned. But as pure luck would have it, Auto Talent had already sent out a complete set of bearings for the WPC treatment and they arrived while I was in the area collecting all of the data for this article.

While on my way to EAS to measure the VAC coated bearings, Auto Talent was gracious enough to allow to measure two sets of bearing shells (two uppers, two lowers). I documented and photographed the results as follows:

Factory Reference
WPC-1
WPC-2
Top (Blue)
0.07885
0.07875
0.07870
Bottom (Red)
0.07865
0.07860
0.07850


Just as I had hoped, the bearings were thinner than stock. After collecting the measurements, Auto Talent allowed me to take the same two specimens to Van Dyne Engineering for our much more thorough bearing measurement tests. While at Van Dyne Engineering, we put the WPC coated bearings in our factory connecting rods to obtain proper clearance measurements. I torqued the WPC treated bearings into two factory connecting rods to obtain the data listed below.

WPC-1
WPC-2
Crank Journal
2.04655
2.04660
Rod Bore
2.04825
2.04820
Bearing Clearance
0.00170
0.00160


Thanks to Sam and Zolti @ Auto Talent for letting me take these measurements and share them with the community. And another shout out to e92zero for bringing the WPC treatment back to my attention.

Last edited by regular guy; 09-24-2013 at 01:31 AM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:18 PM   #6
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Proposed Solutions: Thinner Oil

Proposed Solutions: Thinner Oil

I'll be first to tell you that I'm not an oil expert, but I'm very impressed with the information that kawasaki00 and BMRLVR have contributed to this discussion. I'll try to collect some of their best posts and weave it into a cohesive discussion.
I am looking at the Rotella T6 for my car on the next oil change. The T6 must be a stout oil since it has the JASO MA rating on the back...... Not many passenger car/ diesel engine oils meet motorcycle certifications which is a testament to the base stock it is blended from. Motorcycles throw a whole different curve at oils since they have to deal with lubricating a transmission and a wet clutch as well as an engine that can spin upwards of 15000RPM......... But judging by your username I don't need to tell you anything about motorcycles! -- BMRLVR
You are correct on the rotella in the motorcycles, along with my full-time job I also raced a zx-10r for a couple years. There have been some complaints over the last year or so about the t6 though, some of the high power bikes are having a touch of clutch chatter. The zinc and phosphorous levels have dropped from 1600 to about 13-1400 in the new t6. For engine bearings, flat tappet cams and the like that number is still plenty high. The tws oil is about 16-1700 on zinc numbers. BUT although it is higher that doesn't mean it is superior. Mobil 1 racing 4t is being sold as a motorcycle oil but it is really a normal engine oil with about 1500ppm of zinc and phosphorous. The problem is that it is a 10-30 so not really picking up much as far as our clearance problem. -- kawasaki00
Ok, then someone edumacate me. 10w-60 means SAE viscosity of "10" when cold, right? and "60" when at temp, right? soooo, what am I doing wrong here? -- Transfer
http://www.upmpg.com/tech_articles/motoroil_viscosity/

This explains it.
For this problem we have if there were a 5w-60 that would be the ultimate for us. Unfortunately there is no such grade. The 5w would help a ton at start up but still protect like a 60 weight at temp. This is why the rotella 5-40 is a trade off. It is better at low temps and flows better but the untimate high temp shear strength is not as much as a 60.
The second number is the protection factor not the weight. A 10w-30 and a 10w 60 is till the same weight at cold temp. -- kawasaki00
According to the lubrication system schematic for the S65 on BMW TIS it appears as though the engine uses a pressure compensated variable displacement main oil pump. (There is a signal passage off of the main oil gallery in the schematic which is shown as a dotted line...... In my industry, heavy equipment, dotted lines almost always symbolize signal oil in hydraulic schematics). The fact that the pump is variable flow (variable displacement) it would lead me to believe that pump volume should not be an issue in the S65. Variable displacement pumps are used to ensure that max pump volume is available regardless of engine speed. To me this is great news for any of us looking to run additional clearance or lighter oil. This also helps to explain why VCM power claims that the pressure stays constant from 2000RPM on up to redline........ with a pressure compensated pump pressure can remain nearly constant and the system will never have to go over relief except in the event of a system malfunction. -- BMRLVR
The 0w50 is a fantastic oil. The reason I dont bring it up is you need to be catless and be prepared to replace o2 sensors much quicker than normal. Although for most if the car has a supercharger on it they are not worried about a couple hundred bucks for sensors.

Why does the 0w 50 oil cause 02 sensors to go?

Because the 0w-50 that he is talking about is a racing only oil. It has over twice the zinc around 1850ppm I believe. That much zinc will burn coverters up and leave deposits on o2 sensors that skew the data. Kind of like running leaded fuel, but it just doesnt happen as fast. -- kawasaki00
The German castrol 0w30 is almost a 40 wt. however it is not a sn oil. The new belgium castrol 0w40 is really good and is a sn. The mobil 1 0w40 is the best of the bunch really. It is the heaviest of the 40 wt oils I have tested. I checked the 5w50 castrol has and it is higher in zinc but it will shear quickly to a 40 wt.
it really is a lot to go through but thinnest to thick is as follows
Castrol 5w30
German castrol 0w30
Belgium 0w40. This oil is replacing the current 5w40 on shelves
Mobil 1 0w40
Rotella t6
Mobil 1 0w50
Castrol5w50

Multiple 10w40s can go here
Castrol tws
Liquid moly 10w60

I would definitely not run the liquid moly because it does not have the cold flow properties as the tws but is equal hot.
I will do my best to answer questions on other oil if someone has some.
From what I have gathered from some other tests is that the mobil is better hot and thicker with higher viscosity index but is still thinner cold. Really better all around. Only question is do we have enough oil pressure to run the 0-40. But, I know a couple guys already running it so I am going to put a gauge in the car. I have asked on a couple occasions for a pressure graph to be posted but no one wants to do it. So I am working on it.

The redline is a really good oil but if going off the premise that the oil is too thick for us non track users then I would not run it.
The redline is thicker cold and hot than the tws oil. -- kawasaki00
kawasaki00,

Setting aside bearing clearance discussions for the moment, do you have any thoughts on other aspects of oil delivery? For example, during extreme acceleration, especially in 1st gear where the rate of change is the highest, is it possible there are oil delivery problems out the bore in the connecting rod? I would assume there is a negative pressure gradient along that path, and if the momentary pressure falls low enough in the extreme case of rapid rod acceleration (coupled with its high peak velocity), any entrained air could possibly be released? I would think that even a one-time situation that results in bearing film violation and cavitation could be enough to cause need to replace the bearings?

Stating the obvious, lol, I'm not an engine designer or anything. Just an old, emphasis on old, mechanical engineer with a lot of interest in the subject. -- CSBM5
One would more than likely see a pressure drop if that happens. Most gauges really dont react fast enough to see these drops in pressure. A logging system with a 100hz record rate might pick it up.

That being said it is usually never a problem with street engines. The oiling system is USUALLY way overkill for what it needs to acomplish. The only way to get a idea is to install a flow meter to measure oil flow inline but it is hard to do in a wet sump engine. That and the fact a good meter is usually a thousand dollars and then you have to have the aquisition system. This engine makes no torque anyway, it is a short stroke motor so there is not going to be much bore deformation with the NA stuff. FI might be different but I cant say for sure.

If you want my take on what is happening it is this. Imagine a garden hose that you pinch the end of it off. Still have plenty of pressure but no flow. I believe this is what is happening with the rod problem. Until it gets to full operating temp and maybe even not then, because the clearance is so tight you always have pressure but the system has a hard time pushing the thick oil through the tight rod clearance. This results in cavitation because there is no flow. When bearing shells show the typical bottom shell looks ok top shell is bad worn that is the number one indication of just a plain lack of lubrication.

It has been tested to death and there is no denying that the tws is a fantastic oil. If it were available in a 0-40/50 or a 5-40 option I would still run it. BMW and there infinite wisdon says it is ok to run the oil 15k miles no matter how hard you drive it. The only way to make this happen it to run a robust oil such as the tws. That doesnt mean it is the best option though for us street drivers. Also remember this car was designed in 2006, much has changed over the last 7 years in regards to the quality of oil available. I am currently running a 0wt but I am also changing it every 4k miles because I dont drive it all the time. I would never try to run the 0wt for even 10k miles let alone 15k miles but that s just me. -- kawasaki00
Thank you for all of your contributions. Any opinions on Red Line Synthetic Oil and which would you recommend based upon "their" techincal properties? I've listed their 10W60 as well:




10W60

TYPICAL PROPERTIES


API Service Class SN/SM/SL/CF
SAE Viscosity Grade (Motor Oil) 10W60
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 25.9
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 170.4
Viscosity Index 187
CCS Viscosity, Poise, @*C 65@-25
Pour Point, °C -45
Pour Point, °F -49
Flash Point, °C 234
Flash Point, °F 454
NOACK Evaporation Loss,1hr @ 482°F (250°C), % 6
HTHS Vis, cP 150°C, ASTM D4741 5.8



5W50

TYPICAL PROPERTIES


API Service Class SN/SM/SL/CF
SAE Viscosity Grade (Motor Oil) 5W50
Vis @ 100°C 21.0
Vis @ 40°C 130
Viscosity Index 186
CCS Viscosity, Poise, @*C 60@-30
Pour Point, °C -45
Pour Point, °F -49
Flash Point, °C 232
Flash Point, °F 450
NOACK Evaporation Loss,1hr @ 482°F (250°C), % 6
HTHS Vis, cP 150°C, ASTM D4741 5.0




0W40

TYPICAL PROPERTIES


API Service Class SN/SM/SL/CF
Viscosity Grade SAE 0W40
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 15.4
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 86
Viscosity Index 190
CCS Viscosity, Poise, @*C 57@-35
Pour Point, °C -60
Pour Point, °F -76
Flash Point, °C 230
Flash Point, °F 446
NOACK Evaporation Loss,1hr @ 482°F (250°C), % 9
HTHS Vis, cP 150°C, ASTM D4741 4.0




5W30

TYPICAL PROPERTIES


API Service Class SN/SM/SL/CF
Viscosity Grade SAE 5W30
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 11.9
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 71
Viscosity Index 166
CCS Viscosity, Poise, @*C 60@-30
Pour Point, °C -45
Pour Point, °F -49
Flash Point, °C 232
Flash Point, °F 450
NOACK Evaporation Loss,1hr @ 482°F (250°C), % 6
HTHS Vis, cP 150°C, ASTM D4741 3.7



5W40

TYPICAL PROPERTIES


API Service Class SN/SM/SL/CF
Viscosity Grade SAE 5W40
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 15.6
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 97
Viscosity Index 174
CCS Viscosity, Poise, @*C 58@-30
Pour Point, °C -45
Pour Point, °F -49
Flash Point, °C 232
Flash Point, °F 450
NOACK Evaporation Loss,1hr @ 482°F (250°C), % 6
HTHS Vis, cP 150°C, ASTM D4741 4.4
-- Fsarc
BMRLVR, Kawasaki00, and others, I'm sure I missed many important posts of yours. If there's some more relevant posts, then please send me links and I'll add them to the discussion (or feel free to add them yourselves).

Thanks to all the oil experts.

Last edited by regular guy; 11-26-2013 at 02:02 AM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:18 PM   #7
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Crankshaft Machining

S65/S85 Bearing History:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GIdriver View Post
Hmmm. I was under the impression these parts were the same since 2008. Good to know. Do you know in what month and year they changed these parts. Sorry if this has been discussed before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonardo629 View Post
crankshaft bearings have been different since 2008/10, but conn rod bearings are still the same...at least that's what realoem.com tells me.
We all thought the same thing and many arguments have been fought over this topic. But a few weeks ago, I got to the bottom of it. Realoem removed the old part number from their database, and this is why we all thought the rod bearing part number had not changed.

Got a lot more information. There have apparently been three different S65 crankshafts, and two sets of connecting rods. Maybe somebody with better BMW connections (hint, hint, Tom@EAS) can fill in the blanks. You will be surprised, I even found +.001 bearings and they are currently available!

BTW, this wasn't easy to track down. Had to look in catalogs out of country, etc. Called local dealer and confirmed they are all valid part numbers, and +size bearings are still available using these part numbers.

Crankshafts:
11 21 7 838 641 Crankshaft, Ended (no date given), no weight given
11 21 7 841 658 Crankshaft, Ended (October 2008), 20.400 kg
11 21 0 443 639 Crankshaft, Current production, 23.840 kg

Main Bearings:
11 21 7 841 488 Main Bearing Top, Yellow, Ended (October 2008)
11 21 7 841 609 Main Bearing Top, Yellow, Replaced 488 bearing
11 21 7 841 489 Main Bearing Top, Green, Ended (October 2008)
11 21 7 841 610 Main Bearing Top, Green, Replaced 489 bearing
11 21 7 841 490 Main Bearing Top, Violet, Ended (October 2008)
11 21 7 841 611 Main Bearing Top, Violet, Replaced 490 bearing
11 21 7 841 483 Main Bearing Bottom, Yellow, Ended (October 2008)
11 21 7 841 605 Main Bearing Bottom, Yellow, Replaced 483 bearing
11 21 7 841 484 Main Bearing Bottom, Green, Ended (October 2008)
11 21 7 841 606 Main Bearing Bottom, Green, Replaced 484 bearing
11 21 7 841 485 Main Bearing Bottom, Violet, Ended (October 2008)
11 21 7 841 607 Main Bearing Bottom, Violet, Replaced 485 bearing

Rod Bearings:
11 24 7 838 089 Rod Bearing Blue, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, Ended (no date given, but hints at July '08)
11 24 7 841 703 Rod Bearing Blue, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, Replacement for 089 bearing.
11 24 7 838 091 Rod Bearing Blue, 52.750 mm, +0.250 mm, Currently available

11 24 7 838 088 Rod Bearing Red, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, Ended (no date given, but hints at July '08)
11 24 7 841 702 Rod Bearing Red, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, Replacement for 088 bearing.
11 24 7 838 090 Rod Bearing Red, 52.750 mm, +0.250 mm, Currently available

I have verbal confirmation that some bearings replaced at another SoCal shop have 088/089 stamped on the back. So this would be pretty strong evidence along with information posted by Tom & B767capt that the rod bearings have indeed been superseded since production began. Most likely they were superseded in October 2008 when the crankshaft and main bearings were superseded. I will take pictures when I see these bearings in person.

Since I posted this, I ordered and received samples of each of these rod bearings including the oversized bearings. Yesterday, I measured and photographed all of the rod bearings.

Rod Bearings:
11 24 7 838 089 Blue, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, 0.07890" Thick, Ended
11 24 7 841 703 Blue, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, 0.07890" Thick, Replacement for 089 bearing
11 24 7 838 091 Blue, 52.750 mm, +0.250 mm, 0.08370" Thick, Currently available

11 24 7 838 088 Red, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, 0.07875" Thick, Ended
11 24 7 841 702 Red, 53.000 mm, +0.000 mm, 0.07875" Thick, Replacement for 088 bearing
11 24 7 838 090 Red, 52.750 mm, +0.250 mm, 0.08370" Thick, Currently available

Here's a photo of the old and new bearings side-by-side with part numbers shown. As seen in the photo, the bearing surfaces are quite different. More Photos Here.


S65/S85 Bearing Hardness Issues:

From Kawasaki00:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...&postcount=246

Regular Guy was gratious enough to send me bearings to look at and measure and hardness test.
What has been observed is the original 088/089 bearings are a copper/lead content while the 702/703 bearings are of an aluminized tin/silicon compound.
Measurements with my mic are as follows, I am in no way saying what is right or wrong but there is always a tenth or two between different people, just because I measure one way is not to say another measurement is incorrect. What matters is the same guy measuring the crank and the clearance for the final outcome.
088 .07875
089 .07885
091 .0837
090 .0836
702 .07855
703 .07875
Measurements are pretty much in line with what others have documented up until they get polished.
What is a MASSIVE change is the hardness of the bearings. I will not get into the difference of what is right or wrong here but just know the new 702/703 bearings are a huge jump in hardness
The average hardness for the 088/089 bearings are the same at 16.2B Scale
The average hardness for the 702-703 bearings are the same at 61.8B Scale

This puts to rest the theory that one bearing is harder than the other relative to the old vs new ones.
We can work bearings to get a few tenths when needed at our shop. The big one here is not only are we gaining on the average .0002-.0003 by going to the 702/703 but we are also gaining .0003 more by our polishing method. In essence a rod that was .001 clearance before with 088-089 can now be installed with the newer polished bearings and be AROUND .0016. Bearings that were in at .0013 should be able to get to .0019. It is not the end all be all but it will help.
Also remember I have one smaple of each bearing. From our experience ther can be +-.0001 from shell to shell. Not every bearing will turn out the same as these measurements. Here are some pics for comparison. I did not do pictures of the before polishing sizes, they were measured but not photographed.





















----

I have noticed this before also. The last time I changed the tws I only had 3k miles on it and it came out very black and smelled really bad. Couple thoughts I have are it is the high Ester package in the oil that breaks down pretty quick and turns black or maybe there is more to the rod side clearance thing and it really is baking the oil inside the rod bearings. The evidence is all over the place that they are cavitating. I am still looking into it.
Here is a little teaser pic of a rod bearing I have been working on...I have multiple bearings that I am hardness testing and doing some processes that we do to our race bearings.

Last edited by regular guy; 01-15-2014 at 04:00 PM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:19 PM   #8
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Bearing Photo Database

S65, 4000 Miles, Bone Stock, 2009. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 03-Mild
Description: When this engine opened to build stroker, main bearing failure was imminent.


S65, 24000 Miles, Naturally Aspirated, 2009 More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 06-Med-Heavy
Description: No other details given.


S65, 24000 Miles, Supercharged, Built Internals, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 04-Moderate
Description: Supercharged Stroker motor with built internals. 22000 miles NA, 2000 mile supercharged.
NOTE: This engine has aftermarket crank, rods, and pistons. They are different designs from stock, have different mass and moments of inertia, possibly different materials, different manufacturing process, different tolerances, and different fasteners. Each of these key difference contribute to the overall stiffness in the connecting rod bore holding the bearing and may affect the observed bearing wear in the following photos.


S65, 30000 Miles, Bone Stock, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 04/05-Moderate
Description: Bone stock engine disassembled to make stroker motor.


S65, 31000 Miles, Naturally Aspirated, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 04-Moderate
Description: 27,000 Miles Naturally Aspirated, 4000 Miles Supercharged


S65, 33000 Miles (30k) Naturally Aspirated, 3000 Miles Supercharged, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 06-Medium/Heavy
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S65, 40000 Miles, Bone Stock, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 09-Catastrophic
Description: This engine suffered complete engine failure. No holes in the block, but all internals caked in metal shavings.


S65, 47000 Miles, Naturally Aspirated, 1.8k Miles Supercharged, 2008
More Photos

Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 05-Moderate
Notes: The #3 bearing was not wiped to copper when it was removed from the engine. The shop replacing the bearings sanded it to copper for testing purposes.


S65, 60000 Miles (55k) Naturally Aspirated, 5000 Miles Supercharged, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 08-Near Catastrophic
Description: Auto Talent estimates this engine had less than one week to live with the bearings found in this condition
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S65, 72000 Miles, Supercharged, 2008 More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 06-Med-Heavy
Description: Owner opted for rod bearing replacement at 72000 Miles during Supercharger Upgrade.


S65, 90000 Miles, Supercharged, 2008 More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 06-Moderate
Description: Owner opted for rod bearing replacement at 90000 Miles during Supercharger Upgrade. 1000 Miles later, oil line burst and motor suffered severe, but non-fatal damage.


S65, 106000 Miles (92k) Naturally Aspirated, 14000 Miles Supercharged, 2008. More Photos
Factory Bearings: 088/089
Category: 08-Near Catastrophic
Description: Part of the EAS Ongoing Rod Bearing Journal Thread

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Last edited by regular guy; 01-13-2014 at 10:16 PM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:19 PM   #9
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Related Articles & Threads

Here's the latest BMW oil recommendations per engine. This data was downloaded from BMW ISTA program, database: December 2013. This is about as recent as it gets. I omitted diesel engine oils from the list.

The S65/S85 conundrum still exists. The S85 recommends LL-04 light weight break in oil for the first 2000 Km, but the S65 has no such recommendation.

Enclosure 3 to SI 11 07 96 (138)

3.1 Specified engine oils for BMW Group engines

3.2 Specified engine oils for petrol engines:

EngineLonglife-04Longlife-04Longlife-01Longlife-01 FELonglife-98 Special oilSAE 10W- 60
2 Cylinder :
W20
X (2)
X
X
4-cylinder:
M43TU
X (2)
X
X
X M43/CNG (1)
X (2)
N40
X (2)
X
X
N42
X (2)
X
X
N43
X (2)
X
X
N45
X (2)
X
X
N45N
X (2)
X
X
N46
X (2)
X
X
N46T
X (2)
X
X
N12
X (2)
X
X
N13
X (2)
X
X
N14
X (2)
X
X
N16
X (2)
X
X
N18
X (2)
X
X
N20
X (2)
X
X
W10
X (2)
X
X
W11
X (2)
X
6-cylinder:
N51
X (2)
X
X
N52
X (2)
X
X
N52K
X (2)
X
X
N52N
X (2)
X
X
N53
X (2)
X
X
N54
X (2)
X
X
N54T
X (2)
X
X
N55
X (2)
X
X
N56
X (2)
X
X
M52TU
X (2)
X
X
M54
X (2)
X
M56
X (2)
X
S54
X
8-cylinder:
N62
X (2)
X
X
N62S
X (2)
X
X
N62TU
X (2)
X
X
N63
X (2)
X
X
M62LEV
X (2)
X
X
S62 (E39) up to 02/00
X
S62 (E39) from 03/00
X
S62 (E52)
X
S63
X (2)
X
X
S63T
X (2)
X
X
S65
X
10-cylinder:
S85
X (3)
X
12-cylinder:
M73 (E31) from 9/1997
X (2)
X
X
X
M73 (E38) 9/97-8/98
X (2)
X
X
X
M73LEV
X (2)
X
X
N73
X (2)
X
X
N74
X (2)
X
X
Other Engines:
Other AG engines (4)
X
X
X
X
Other M engines (5)
X
X
X
X
X


Notes:
  1. Engine oil M610 may also be used so long as it is available.
  2. Longlife-04 oils are only approved for petrol engines in Europe (EU plus Switzerland, Norway and Liechtenstein). They must not be used outside this area as problems are often encountered with fuel grade.
  3. Only use 5W-30 running-in oil (part number 83 21 0 398 507/508) for the first 2000 km. After this, change to 10W60.
  4. "Other" includes all AG engines/models not specified in the above table, e.g. M10, M20, M30, M40, M42, M43, M44, M50, M52, M60, M62, M70, M73, etc.
  5. ”Others” includes all Motorsport engines/models which are not listed in the above table, for example S14, S38, S50, S50U, S52, S70, etc.


Enclosure 4 to SI 11 07 96 (138)

4.1 ”Longlife-04”

Approved for the following BMW engines: Please refer to Enclosure 3.
Longlife‐-04 oils are only approved for petrol engines in Europe (EU plus Switzerland, Norway and Liechtenstein). They must not be used outside this area as problems are often encountered with fuel grade.

4.2 Longlife‐-04 engine oils available from BMW Parts:

Longlife-04 engine oil SAE 0W-40



Longlife-04 engine oil SAE 5W-30



4.3 Names of approved Longlife-04 oils:

Trade nameViscosityManufacturer
05000 DPF Engine Oil 5W-30 Premium Synthetic C3SAE 5W-30MPM Int. Oil Company B.V.
4CT-SSAE 5W-30Wako Chemical Co. Ltd.
4CT-SSAE 5W-40Wako Chemical Co. Ltd.
77 ENGINE Oil LESAE 5W-3077 Lubricants B.V.
77 ENGINE Oil LESAE 5W-4077 Lubricants B.V.
77 ENGINE Oil LXSAE 5W-3077 Lubricants B.V.
AD MDXS MEGA PLUSSAE 5W-40AD PARTS, S.L.
AD SC3SAE 5W-30AD PARTS, S.L.
AD SCCSAE 5W-30AD PARTS, S.L.
Adamol Multitop LonglifeSAE 5W-30Adamol Mineralöl‐ handelsgesellschaft mbH
Adamol Multitop VSISAE 0W-40Adamol Mineralöl‐ handelsgesellschaft mbH
Addinol Extra Power MV 0538 LESAE 5W-30Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
Addinol Giga Light MV 0530 LLSAE 5W-30Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
ad-High Tech 5W-30 Longlife IIISAE 5W-30CARAT GmbH & Co.
ad-High Tech 5W-40 DPFSAE 5W-40CARAT GmbH & Co.
Adnoc Voyager GoldSAE 5W-30Adnoc Distribution
Adnoc Voyager GoldSAE 5W-40Adnoc Distribution
Agip 7008SAE 5W-30Eni R&M Divisione
Agip Formula FutureSAE 5W-30ENI S.p.A. Refining & Marketing Division
Agip Formula MS B04SAE 5W-30ENI S.p.A. Refining & Marketing Division
Agip Formula PrestigeSAE 5W-40ENI S.p.A. Refining & Marketing Division
Akron SpitzenSAE 5W-30Mexicana de Lubricantes S.A. de C.V.
Akron SpitzenSAE 5W-40Mexicana de Lubricantes S.A. de C.V.
Alpine Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
Alpine RSL 5W30 LASAE 5W-30Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
AMSOIL European Car FormulaSAE 5W-40AMSOIL INC
Aral SuperTronicSAE 0W-40Aral
Aral SuperTronic DieselSAE 0W-40Aral
Aral SuperTronic Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Aral
Ardeca Syn-Tec BMSAE 5W-30Vroman n.v.
Ardeca Syn-Tec DXSAE 5W-30Vroman n.v.
Astris DPF Plus C3SAE 5W-30Astris SA
Avia Synth 5W-30 Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Avia Mineralöl AG
AVIA Synth LSSAE 0W-40Avia Mineralöl AG
Aviasynth 5W-40 LSSAE 5W-40Avia France
Aviasynth DPF Plus C3SAE 5W-30Avia cooperative for lubricants
Aviasynth LSP PlusSAE 5W-30Avia Mineralöl AG
Aviaticon Unique BMSAE 5W-30Finke Mineralölwerk GmbH
Avilubsynth LSP PlusSAE 5W-30Avia Mineralöl AG
Bel-Ray Longlife-04SAE 5W-30Krafft S.L. (Unipersonal)
BG SAE 5W-30 Synthetic Engine OilSAE 5W-30BG Products Inc.
Biloxxi 5W-30 IIISAE 5W-30MCC Trading Deutschland GmbH
Biloxxi 5W-40 HCSAE 5W-40MCC Trading Deutschland GmbH
Bizol New GenerationSAE 5W-30BITA Trading GmbH
Blu Synthetic - Technician Series LS- FSSAE 5W-30Blu Canada Limited.
Blu Synthetic 5W-40 Technician Series LS-FSSAE 5W-40Blu Canada Limited
BP Visco 5000 CSAE 5W-40BP Oil International
BP Visco 5000 MSAE 5W-30BP Oil International
BP Visco 7000SAE 0W-40BP Oil International
BP Visco 7000SAE 5W-30BP Oil International
BP Visco 7000 CSAE 5W-40BP Oil International
Caltex Havoline Ultra VSAE 5W-30Chevron Global Lubricants
Car Jack GPDSAE 5W-40SIG GmbH
Cartechnic Engine Oil 5W-30 MSSAE 5W-30Auto‐Teile‐Ring GmbH
Cartechnic engine oil SAE 5W-30 MFSAE 5W-30Auto‐Teile‐Ring GmbH
Cartechnic engine oil SAE 5W-30 MultiSAE 5W-30Auto‐Teile‐Ring GmbH
Castrol EdgeSAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol EdgeSAE 0W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol EdgeSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol EdgeSAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge 5W-40 A3/B4SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge 5W-40 C3SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional A3SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional BMW LL04SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional C3SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional LL04SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional OESAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional OE-XSAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Turbo DieselSAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Turbo DieselSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec 5W-30 C3SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec 5W-40 C3SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Diesel 5W-40 B4SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Diesel 5W-40 C3SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Diesel 5W-40 DPFSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Professional C3SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Professional C3SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Professional MPSAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Professional OESAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional BMW LL- 04SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional BMW LL- 04SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional OESAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional Powerflow C3 TDSAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Centro Engine Oil 5W-30 SpezialSAE 5W-30Centro Handelsgesellschaft mbH
& Co. KG
Centro Motoröl Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Centro Handelsgesellschaft mbH
& Co. KG
Cespa Star Megatech LSSAE 5W-30Cespa Lubricantes S.A.
Cespa XTAR TDI 5W-40 50501SAE 5W-40Cespa Lubricantes S.A.
CHAMPION OEM SPECIFIC 5W30 C3SAE 5W-30CHAMPION CHEMICALS N.V.
CHAMPION OEM SPECIFIC 5W30 LL IIISAE 5W-30CHAMPION CHEMICALS N.V.
CHIRATECH MAXIMA SYNTECH ULTRASAE 5W-30The Siam Fine Chemicals Co., LTD
Classic Meduna PT 530 Longlife III LASAE 5W-30Christian Lümann GmbH & Co. KG
Concep-Tech DXSAE 5W-30Con Lubricants Duisburg GmbH
Concep-Tech Synth.SAE 5W-40Con Lubricants Duisburg GmbH
DBV – LL SAPS Super UniversalSAE 5W-30DBV Würzburg GmbH
Delkol Motorsynth FESAE 5W-30Delek The Israel Fuel Corporation Ltd.
Diesel OneSAE 5W-30ERG Petroil spa
Divinol Syntholight DPFSAE 5W-30Zeller+Gmelin
DS 5W30 PERFORMANCE LONGLIFE IIISAE 5W-30Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
DynoCat Neutron CXSSAE 5W-30Norsk‐Pennsylvansk Oijekompani A/S
Econo Veritas DPSAE 5W-30Ölwerke Julius Schindler
Econo Veritas KombiSAE 5W-30Ölwerke Julius Schindler
Elaion Full PerformanceSAE 5W-40YPF S.A.
Elf Evolution Full-Tech C3SAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Evolution Full-Tech MSXSAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Excellium C3SAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Excellium C3SAE 5W-40TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Excellium LSXSAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Excellium TDISAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Solaris LLXSAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Solaris LSXSAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Solaris LSXSAE 5W-40TOTAL Lubrifiants
Elf Solaris MSXSAE 5W-30TOTAL Lubrifiants
Eneos Premium HyperSAE 5W-30JX Nippon Oil & Energy Europe Ltd
Engine Oil Longlife-III SyntheticSAE 5W-30Transnational Blenders B.V.
eni i-sint 5W-30SAE 5W-30eni S.p.A.
eni i-Sint MSSAE 5W-30eni S.p.A.
eni i-Sint MSSAE 5W-40eni S.p.A.
Enoc Protec GreenSAE 5W-40Emirate National Oil Cy
Enviro PlusSAE 5W-30Penrite Oil Company Pty Ltd.
Enviro PlusSAE 5W-40Penrite Oil Company Pty Ltd
Eurol OptenceSAE 5W-30Eurol B.V.
Eurol Turbo DISAE 5W-40Eurol B.V.
Eurolub CleantecSAE 5W-30Hunold Schmierstoffe GmbH
EUROLUB WIV ECOSAE 5W-30Eurolub GmbH
Evolution OEM Series-04SAE 5W-30Top Oil 1 Products Company
Evolution OEM Series-04SAE 5W-40Top Oil 1 Products Company
Fairline Motorenöl SAE 5W-40SAE 5W-40Goldhand Vertriebsgesellschaft GmbH
Fastron GoldSAE 5W-30Pt. Pertamina
Feu Vert Multi NormesSAE 5W-40Feu Vert
Feu VertC3SAE 5W-30Total
Fina First 500SAE 5W-30Total
Fully Synthetic Engine Oil API SN/CFSAE 5W-30Power International Chemical & Corp
Galp Active 3000 M-LSSAE 5W-30Petrogal SA
Galp Energy Ultra LSSAE 5W-40Petrogal SA
GECCO 5W-30 engine oil MZBSAE 5W-30ZEUS Zentrale für Einkauf und Service GmbH & Co. KG
GECCO engine oil SYSAE 5W-40ZEUS Zentrale für Einkauf und Service GmbH & Co. KG
G-Energy Service Line WSAE 5W-30Gazpromneft-lubricants italia S.p.A.
GHAF PLATINUMSAE 5W-30WOQOD
GTE Special Edition 5W-30 Longlife IIISAE 5W-30CARAT Systementw.- und Marketing GmbH & Co. KG
Gulf Formula GVXSEA 5W-30Gulf Oil International
Gulf Formula ULESAE 5W-30Gulf Oil International
Gulf Formula ULESAE 5W-40Gulf Oil International
Gulf Formula XLESAE 5W-30S.A. Espanola de Lubrificantes
Gulf Progress EfficiencySAE 5W-40Total
Gulf Progress ExtendedSAE 5W-30S.A. Espanola de Lubrificantes
Gulf Progress IntensiaSAE 5W-30Total
Havoline Fully SyntheticSAE 5W-40Chevron Global Lubricants
Havoline Ultra SSAE 5W-30Chevron Global Lubricants
Havoline Ultra SSAE 5W-40Chevron Global Lubricants
Havoline Ultra VSAE 5W-30Chevron Global Lubricants
Helar SP 5W-30 LL-03SAE 5W-30Kroon Oil B.V.
HEM Longlife IIISE 5W-30Deutsche Tamoil GmbH
HPR5SAE 5W-40Penrite Oil Company Pty Ltd.
Igol Process Compact MSAE 5W-30Igol France, S.A.
Igol Profive DiamantSAE 5W-40Igol France, S.A.
Igol Profive EmeraudeSAE 5W-30Igol France, S.A.
Igol Profive GoldSAE 5W-40Igol France, S.A.
Igol Profive PlatiniumSAE 5W-30Igol France, S.A.
Igol Profive SilverSAE 5W-30Igol France, S.A.
INA StarSAE 5W-40INA Rafinerija Rijeka
Jet Top LevelSAE 0W-40Conoco Phillips GmbH
Jomo DreamerSAE 5W-40Japan Energy Corporation
K-Classic engine oil 5W-30 LASAE 5W-30Kaufland Warenhandel GmbH & Co.KG
K-Classic engine oil 5W-30 Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Kaufland Warenhandel GmbH & Co.KG
Kendall GT-1® Full Synthetic Euro Engine OilSAE 5W-30Phillips 66 Company
Kendall GT-1® Full Synthetic Euro Engine OilSAE 5W-40Phillips 66 Company
KIXX PAO LL04SAE 5W-30GS Caltex Corporation
KIXX PAO LL04SAE 5W-40GS Caltex Corporation
Krafft Longlife-04SAE 5W-30Krafft S.L. (Unipersonal)
Liqui Moly Longtime High TechSAE 5W-30Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly Nachfüll-ÖlSAE 5W-40Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly Pro‐Engine M 400SAE 5W-40Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly Pro‐Engine M 500SAE 5W-30Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly TopTec 4100SAE 5W-40Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly TopTec 4200SAE 5W-30Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly TopTec 4600SAE 5W-30Liqui Moly
Liqui Moly TopTec 4605SAE 5W-30Liqui Moly
Longlife Ultra SP 1SAE 5W-30Müller Mineralöle GmbH & Co. KG
Lotos Quazar 5W40SAE 5W-40Lotos Oil
Lotos Quazar C3SAE 5W-30Lotos Oil
Lotos Quazar LLIIISAE 5W-30Lotos Oil
Lubrax ValoraSAE 5W-30Petrobras
Lukoil Genesis PremiumSAE 5W-30OKK "LLK-International"
Lukoil Genesis PremiumSAE 5W-40OKK "LLK-International"
Mabanol Xenon Alpha LASAE 5W-30Mabanol GmbH & Co. KG
Mabanol Xenon Ultra Synth LonglifeSAE 5W-30Mabanol GmbH & Co. KG
MAPO Fulltec C3SAE 5W-30MAPO-Schmierstofftechnik Handel GmbH
Marly Gold Ultra 5W30 LL-04SAE 5W-30N.V. Marly S.A.
Master Oil WIV 5W-30 LonglifeSAE 5W-30EPRO GmbH
masteroil c-tec Power 5W-30 LL3SAE 5W-30Interparts Autoteile GmbH
MB-Tronic PlusSAE 5W-30Kuttenkeuler GmbH
Mega StarSAE 5W-30Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
megol Motorenoel CompatibleSAE 5W-30Meguin GmbH & Co.KG
megol Motorenoel EfficiencySAE 5W-30Meguin GmbH & Co.KG
megol Motorenoel New GenerationSAE 5W-30Meguin GmbH & Co.KG
megol Motorenöl Low EmissionSAE 5W-40Meguin GmbH & Co.KG
Meisteröl RPFSAE 5W-40EPRO GmbH
Midland (R) Crypto-3SAE 5W-30Oel-Brack AG
Midland (R) SynovaSAE 5W-30Oel-Brack AG
Midland (R) SynovaSAE 5W-40Oel-Brack AG
Minerva TSHSAE 5W-40Minerva Oil
Mobil 1 ESPSAE 0W-30ExxonMobil
Mobil 1 ESPSAE 0W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil 1 ESP FormulaSAE 5W-30ExxonMobil
Mobil Super 3000 XESAE 5W-30ExxonMobil
Mobil Super 3000 XE1SAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Syst S Special VSAE 5W-30ExxonMobil
MOL Dynamic GoldSAE 5W-30MOL-LUB Lubricant Ltd.
MOL Dynamic PrimaSAE 5W-40MOL-LUB Lubricant Ltd.
Monza GP Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
Morris Multilife SyntheticSAE 5W-30Morris Lubricants
Motor Oil LESAE 5W-30Transnational Blenders B.V.
Motor Oil LESAE 5W-40Transnational Blenders B.V.
Motorex Profile V-XLSAE 5W-30Bucher AG
Motorex Select LA-XSAE 5W-30Bucher AG
Motorex Select SP-XSAE 5W-30Bucher AG
Motorex Select SP-XSAE 5W-40Bucher AG
Motul 8100 X-CleanSAE 5W-30Motul S.A.
Motul 8100 X-CleanSAE 5W-40Motul S.A.
Motul 8100 X-Clean +SAE 5W-30Motul S.A.
Motul Expert LLSAE 5W-30Motul S.A.
Motul Specific LL-04SAE 5W-40Motul S.A.
M-Tronic ExtraSAE 5W-30Kuttenkeuler GmbH
multilub 5W-40 DPFSAE 5W-40Globus Fachmärkte GmbH & Co. KG
Neste City ProSAE 5W-40Neste Markkinointi Oy
Nordlub V-Kombi LL3SAE 5W-30Nordlub Deutschland GmbH
Nordlub V-PDSAE 5W-30Nordlub Deutschland GmbH
Oest Gigant LS PlusSAE 5W-30Georg Oest Mineralölwerk
Oilfino Via Ultra LLSAE 5W-30Carl Harms
Olibya accel fusionSAE 5W-40Libya Oil
OMV BIXXOL special C3SAE 5W-30OMV Refining & Marketing GmbH
OMV Bixxol Special UPSAE 5W-30OMV Refining & Marketing GmbH
OMV BIXXOL special V7SAE 5W-30OMV Refining & Marketing GmbH
OMV eco plusSAE 5W-30OMV Refining & Marketing GmbH
Opaljet FuturaSAE 5W-40Unil Opal
Opaljet Longlife 3SAE 5W-30Unil Opal
Optima EcoSAE 5W-30Oil Refinery Modrica
OWS Grandsprt DPFSAE 5W-30OWS Our Workshop System (S) PTE LTD
Panolin Avanis C3SAE 5W-30Panolin AG
PAZ Extreme LL-04SAE 5W-30PAZ Lubricants & Chemicals
Pennzoil Platinum European Ultra DieselSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Pennzoil Platinum Low SAPSSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Pennzoil Platinum VXSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Pennzoil Ultra Euro LSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Pento High Performance IISAE 5W-40Deutsche Pentosin-Werke
Pento Super Performance IIISAE 5W-30Deutsche Pentosin-Werke
Pentosynth HCSAE 5W-40Deutsche Pentosin-Werke
Petronas Syntium 5000 AVSAE 5W-30Petronas Base Oil
Petronas Syntium 5000 AVSAE 5W-30Petronas Lubricants International
Petronas Syntium 5000 LLSAE 5W-30Petronas Lubricants International
Petronas Syntium 5000 XSSAE 5W-30Petronas Lubricants International
Platinum MaxEnergy Euro4SAE 5W-30Orlen Oil Sp. z o.o.
PO Maxima Diesel LASAE 5W-30Petrol Ofisi A.S
PractitionerSAE 5W-30Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
Presteza MSPSAE 5W-30Kroon-Oil
Prista Ultra PlusSAE 5W-40Prista Oil EAD
Q Diesel PlusSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Q European Engine Ultra DieselSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Q8 Formula M Long LifeSAE 5W-40Kuwait Petroleum
Q8 Formula SpecialSAE 5W-30Kuwait Petroleum
Q8 Formula Special G Long LifeSAE 5W-30Kuwait Petroleum
Q8 Formula V Long LifeSAE 5W-30Kuwait Petroleum
QS Q Diesel PlusSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
QS Ultimate Durability European LSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Quaker State Synquest Low SAPSSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Quantum PlatinumSAE 5W-40Quantum
Ravenol HLSSAE 5W-30Ravensberger Schmierstoffvertrieb GmbH
Ravenol VMPSAE 5W-30Ravensberger Schmierstoffvertrieb GmbH
real,- Quality GPDSAE 5W-40real,- Handels GmbH
Repsol Elite EvolutionSAE 5W-40Repsol YPF
Repsol Elite Evolution Long LifeSAE 5W-30Repsol YPF
ROWE HIGHTEC Multi FormulaSAE 5W-40Rowe Mineralölwerk GmbH
ROWE HIGHTEC SYNT RS DLSSAE 5W-30Rowe Mineralölwerk GmbH
Rowe Multi Synth DPFSAE 5W-30Rowe Mineralölwerk GmbH
Rowe Synth RS 5W-30 DLSSAE 5W-30Rowe Mineralölwerk GmbH
Rowe Synth RS 5W-30 HC-FESAE 5W-30Rowe Mineralölwerk GmbH
RYMCO Orpheus LL-IISAE 5W-30VPS International B.V.
Selenia K Pure EnergySAE 5W-40Petronas Lubricants International
Selenia Multipower C3SAE 5W-30Petronas Lubricants International
Shell Helix Diesel Ultra AB-LSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Diesel Ultra ExtraSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX7 CSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX7 ESAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AM-LSAE 0W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AM-LSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AM-LSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra APSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AT-LSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AXSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ECTSAE 0W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ECTSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ExtraSAE 0W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ExtraSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra Extra XSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra LXSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra Professional AB-LSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra Professional AM-LSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Sintolux Force 3SAE 5W-30Fuchs Lubrifiants SA
Sorotec 2 + PDiSAE 5W-40Kuttenkeuler GmbH
Specialsynth GoldSAE 5W-40PHI OIL GmbH
Specialsynth GoldSAE 5W-30PHI Oil GmbH
Specialsynth MSPSAE 5W-40Kroon Oil B.V.
Speed Master Special Stage 5W-40 SM/CFSAE 5W-40Speed Master Co. Ltd.
SRS VIVA 1 SLV plusSAE 5W-30SRS Schmierstoff Vertrieb GmbH
SRS VIVA 1 topsynth alpha LASAE 5W-30SRS Schmierstoff Vertrieb GmbH
Startol Vita AlphaSAE 5W-30Müller Mineralöle GmbH & Co. KG
Statoil LazerWay CSAE 5W-40Statoil Lubricants
Statoil LazerWay LLSAE 5W-30Statoil Lubricants
Superpower C3SAE 5W-30EMKA Schmiertechnik GmbH
swd Primus DXMSAE 5W-40Swd Lubricants GmbH&Co. KG
Swd Rheinol Primus DXSAE 5W-30Swd Lubricants GmbH&Co. KG
Swd Rheinol Primus LLXSAE 5W-30Swd Lubricants GmbH&Co. KG
Syneco UltrasyntSAE 5W-40Syneco S.p.A.
SynPower MSTSAE 5W-30Valvoline EMEA
SynPower MST C3SAE 5W-30Valvoline EMEA
SynPower MST C3SAE 5W-40Valvoline EMEA
SynPower Xtreme intake air temperature C3SAE 5W-30Valvoline EMEA
SynPower Xtreme XL-III C3SAE 5W-30Valvoline EMEA
SynPulsar-NSAE 5W-30Bahrdahl Asia Pacific Pte Ltd
Synt 2 + PDISAE 5W-40Müller Mineralöle GmbH & Co. KG
Tamoil Sint Future EnergySAE 5W-30Tamoil Italia SpA
Tamoil Sint Future ExtraSAE 5W-40Tamoil Italia SpA
TB Elatus BMSAE 5W-30Triangle Business Ltd.
Teboil DiamondSAE 5W-40LLK Finland Oy
Teboil Diamond DieselSAE 5W-40LLK Finland Oy
Tecar Leichtlauf engine oilSAE 5W-40TECHNO-EINKAUF GmbH
TECAR Special DX2SAE 5W-30TECHNO-EINKAUF GmbH
TECAR Special DXII engine oilSAE 5W-30TECHNO-EINKAUF GmbH
Tectrol Speed 530SAE 5W-30BayWa
Tectrol Speed LL 530SAE 5W-30BayWa
Texaco Havoline Ultra VSAE 5W-30Chevron Global Lubricants
Titan GT1SAE 5W-30Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan GT1SAE 5W-40Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan GT1 Pro C-3SAE 5W-30Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan GT1 Pro FlexSAE 5W-30Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan GT1 Pro GasSAE 5W-30Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan GT1 Pro GasSAE 5W-40Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan Supersyn BSAE 5W-30Fuchs Petrolub AG
Tor Extendo NFSAE 5W-30De Oliebron
Tor Prolong LSPSAE 5W-30De Oliebron
Tor Specialsynth 5W-40 NFSAE 5W-40De Oliebron BV
Tor Specialsynth NFSAE 5W-30De Oliebron BV
Total Activa INEO Long LifeSAE 5W-30Total
Total Quartz Ineo EfficiencySAE 0W-30Total
Total Quartz INEO Long LifeSAE 5W-30Total
Total Quartz INEO MC3SAE 5W-30Total
Total Quartz INEO MC3SAE 5W-40Total
Triathlon Endurance IIISAE 5W-30Adolf Würth GmbH & Co. KG
Triathlon PerformanceSAE 5W-40Adolf Würth GmbH & Co. KG
TSHSAE 5W-40Minerva Oil SAS
TURVO SUPER X-1SAE 5W-40Turvo Oil
Ultra TronicSAE 5W-30Kuttenkeuler GmbH
Ultron RaceSAE 5W-40Petron Corporation
UPOIL SYN 98SAE 5W-40Fest Enterprise Oil Pte Ltd
Valvoline SynPower MSTSAE 5W-30Valvoline
Valvoline SynPower MSTSAE 5W-40Valvoline
Valvoline SynPower XL-IIISAE 5W-30Valvoline
Veedol Powertron UltraSAE 5W-40Veedol International Limited
Veedol Sintron C3SAE 5W-30Veedol International Limited
Velox Ultra SXSAE 5W-30Aegean Oil SA
Vita AlphaSAE 5W-30Müller Mineralöle Handels‐ und Beratungsges. mbH
Vita ExtraSAE 5W-30Müller Mineralöle GmbH & Co. KG
Voltronic Engine Oil 5W-30 MDPFSAE 5W-30Voltronic & Act GmbH
Voltronic Engine Oil MDPFSAE 5W-30Voltronic & Act GmbH
Wave Power LESAE 5W-30North Sea Lubricants B.V.
Wave Power LLSAE 5W-30North Sea Lubricants B.V.
Wibosport Longlife IIISAE 5W-30Wibo Schmierstoffe GmbH
Wolf Masterlube Synflow C3SAE 5W-30Wolf Oil s.a.
Wolf Masterlube Synflow IIISAE 5W-30Wolf Oil s.a.
WOLF OFFICILTECH 5W30 C3SAE 5W-30WOLF OIL CORPORATOIN N.V.
WOLF OFFICILTECH 5W30 LL IIISAE 5W-30WOLF OIL CORPORATOIN N.V.
Wynn´s Longlife 04SAE 5W-30Krafft S.L.
XF Longlife C3SAE 5W-30Millers Oli Ltd.
Yacco Lube DESAE 0W-30Yacco S.A.S.
Yacco Lube DESAE 5W-30Yacco S.A.S.
Yacco VX 1000 FAPSAE 5W-40Yacco S.A.S.
Yacco VX 1703 FAPSAE 5W-30Yacco S.A.S.
Yacco VX 1703 FAPSAE 5W-40Yacco S.A.S.
York 848SAE 5W-40Ginouves SAS
York 948SAE 5W-30Ginouves SAS
ZIC A PlusSAE 5W-30SK Lubricants Co., Ltd
ZIC A+SAE 5W-30SK Lubricants Co., Ltd
ZIC RVSAE 5W-30SK Lubricants Co., Ltd
ZIC XQ RVSAE 5W-40SK Lubricants Co., Ltd
ZIC XQLSSAE 5W-30SK Lubricants Co., Ltd


Enclosure 5 to SI 11 07 96 (138)

5.1 ”Longlife-01”

Approved for the following BMW engines: Please refer to Enclosure 3.

5.2 BMW Longlife-01 oils available from BMW Parts:

BMW Quality Longlife-01 SAE 0W-40 (fully synthetic) ACEA: A3/B3, EC II



MINI Quality Longlife-01 SAE 5W-30 (fully synthetic) ACEA: A3/B3, EC II



Note:
Discontinued from Parts Catalogue. Superseded by Longlife‐-04 SAE 5W-30

5.3 Names of approved Longlife-01 oils:

Trade nameViscosityManufacturer/Supplier
76 Pure Synthetic Motor OilSAE 5W-4076 Lubricants Company
77 ENGINE Oil SMSAE 5W-4077 Lubricants B.V.
ADDINOL Eco lightSAE 5W-40Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
ADDINOL Super light MV 0546SAE 5W-40Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
ADDINOL Super power MV 0537SAE 5W-30Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
Adnoc ImageSAE 5W-30Abu Dhabi National Oil Co.
Agip Sint 2000 EvolutionSAE 5W-40ENI S.p.A.Refining and Marketing Division
Agip TECSINT SLSAE 5W-40ENI S.p.A.Refining and Marketing Division
ALPINE LonglifeSAE 5W-30Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
Alpine RSSAE 0W-30Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
Alpine RSSAE 0W-40Mitan Mineralöl GmbH
Aral High Tronic MSAE 5W-40Aral AG
Aral SuperSynthSAE 0W-40Aral AG
Aral SuperTronic GSAE 0W-30Aral AG
Astro Boy Super Racing Original high- performance engine oilSAE 5W-30Kawada Holdings Co LTD
Avia SynthSAE 5W-40Avia Mineralöl AG
Aviaticon Unique DCSAE 5W-30Finke Mineralölwerk GmbH
AXCL S-Class Motor OilSAE 5W-30AXCL Gulf FZE
BiloxxiSAE 5W-30MCC Trading Deutschland GmbH
BOOSTER 600 PLUSSAE 5W-40Fuel Additive Products (M) Sdn Bhd
BP Super V PlusSAE 5W-40BP Oil International
BP Visco 5000SAE 5W-30BP Oil International
BP Visco 5000SAE 5W-40BP Oil International
Castrol Edge 0W-30 A3/B4SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge 0W-40 A3/B4SAE 0W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge 5W-30 A3/B4SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge 5W-40 SNSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Pick upSAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional A3SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional A3SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional A3SAE 0W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional A3SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional BMW LL01SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional BMW LL01SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional BMW LL01SAE 0W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge Professional OESAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge SAE 5W-40 US versionSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge TitaniumSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge with SPTSAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Edge with SPTSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol GTX 5W-40 A3/B4SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol GTX High MileageSAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec 5W-30 A3/B4SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec 5W-40 A3/B4SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Professional A3SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol Magnatec Professional A3SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX LongtecSAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional Longtec BMW LL01SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional Longtec BMW LL01SAE 5W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX Professional Longtec BMW LL01SAE 5W-40Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX ProfessionalA3SAE 0W-30Castrol Limited
Castrol SLX ProfessionalA3SAE 0W-40Castrol Limited
Cepsa Star Mega SyntheticSAE 0W-30Cepsa Lubricantes S.A.
Drive Power 37+SAE 5W-40Fuel Additive Products (M) Sdn Bhd
Econo Veritas OM ExtraSAE 0W-30Ölwerke Julius Schindler
Elf EvolutionSAE 5W-40Total
Elf Evolution TurboSAE 5W-40Total
Elf ExcelliumSAE 0W-30Total
Elf Excellium Full-TechSAE 0W-30Total
Elf Excellium Full-TechSAE 5W-40Total
eni i-SintSAE 5W-40eni S.p.A
Enoc Protec XtremeSAE 5W-40Emirates National Oil Cy
Esso UltronSAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Esso Ultron Turbo DieselSAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Eurol Super LiteSAE 5W-40Eurol BV
Evolution OEM Series-01SAE 5W-30Top Oil 1 Products Company
Evolution OEM Series-01SAE 5W-40Top Oil 1 Products Company
Fina First 600SAE 0W-30Total
Galp Active 3000 MSAE 5W-40Petrogal SA
Galp Energy PlusSAE 5W-40Petrogal SA
Galp Formula XLDSAE 5W-40Petrogal SA
GD 7.1SAE 5W-40Fuel Additive Products (M) Sdn Bhd
G-Energy F SynthSAE 5W-30Gazpromneft-lubricants Ltd.
G-Energy F SynthSAE 5W-40Gazpromneft-lubricants Ltd.
G-Energy Service Line MSSAE 5W-30Gazpromneft-lubricants Ltd.
GHAF PLATINUM 5W40 – LL01SAE 5W-40WOQOD (QATAR FUEL)
Gulf Formula ExtremeSAE 0W-30S.A. Espanola de Lubrificantes
Gulf Formula GXSAE 5W-30S.A. Espanola de Lubrificantes
Gulf Formula GXSAE 5W-40S.A. Espanola de Lubrificantes
Gulf Formula SSAE 5W-40S.A. Espanola de Lubrificantes
Havoline SyntheticSAE 5W-40Chevron Lubricants
Havoline Synthetic Engine OilSAE 5W-40Chevron Lubricants
Havoline UltraSAE 5W-40Chevron Lubricants
High StarSAE 5W-40Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
INA Futura MBSAE 5W-30INA Maziva Rijeka
IP Sintiax Motor Oil ExcelSAE 5W-40Italiana Petroli
Kendall GT‐1 Full Synthetic Motor OilSAE 5W-40Kendall Motor Oil
KIXX PAO LL01SAE 5W-30GS Caltex Corporation
KIXX PAO LL01SAE 5W-40GS Caltex Corporation
Liqui Moly Leichtlauf High TechSAE 5W-40Liqui Moly GmbH
Liqui Moly Pro-Engine M300SAE 5W-30Liqui Moly GmbH
Liqui Moly Special Tec LLSAE 5W-30Liqui Moly GmbH
Lotos Syntetic PlusSAE 5W-40Lotos Oil S.A.
Lotos Syntetic Turbodiesel PlusSAE 5W-40Lotos Oil S.A.
Lukoil Luxe SyntheticSAE 5W-40OOO "LLK-International"
Masteroil v-tec PremiumSAE 0W-40Interparts Autoteile GmbH
MBMSAE 5W-40BaoMa (TianJin) Petroleum Product Corp. Ltd.
MDX Mega PlusSAE 5W-40AD Parts
Megol Motorenoel High ConditionSAE 5W-40Meguin GmbH & Co.KG
Megol Motorenoel QualitySAE 5W-30Meguin GmbH & Co.KG
Meisteröl LLSAE 5W-30EPRO GmbH
Midland(R) SynqronSAE 5W-40Oel-Brack AG
Mobil 1SAE 0W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil 1 ArcticSAE 0W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil 1 New LifeSAE 0W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil 1 Turbo DieselSAE 0W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Formula X2SAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Oil SMSAE 5W-40Translation Blenders B.V.
Mobil Super 3000 X1SAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Super 3000 X1 DieselSAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Super 3000 X2SAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Super 3000 X2 Turbo DieselSAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mobil Synt SSAE 5W-40ExxonMobil
Mol Dynamic SyntSAE 5W-30MOL-LUB Lubricant Ltd.
Motul 8100 X-cessSAE 5W-40Motul S.A.
Motul 8100 X-maxSAE 5W-30Motul S.A.
Motul Expert MSAE 5W-40Motul
Motul SynergieSAE 5W-40Motul S.A.
National SyntheticSAE 5W-40Pinnacle Oil, Inc.
Omera Lube 1SAE 5W-40MJL Bangladesh Ltd.
OMV Bixxol special BMSAE 5W-30OMV AG
OMV Bixxol special GSAE 5W-30OMV AG
Orlen star synt SSAE 5W-40Orlen
PAZ Extreme LL-01SAE 5W-30PAZ Lubricants & Chemicals
Pennzoil European Formula UltraSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Pennzoil Platinum European Formula UltraSAE 5W-30Pennzoil Quaker State
Pennzoil Ultra EuroSAE 5W-40Pennzoil Quaker State
Pennzoil Ultra Euro 5W-40 Full Synthetic Motor OilSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Co.
Pento High PerformanceSAE 5W-30Deutsche Pentosin-Werke
Petronas Syntium 3000SAE 5W-40Petronas Lubricants International
Petronas Syntium 3000 LLSAE 5W-30Petronas Lubricants International
Power Oil High-Tech-Schmierstoffe Vollsynth.SAE 0W-40Power Oil e.K.
PractitionerSAE 5W-40Addinol Lube Oil GmbH
Prista UltraSAE 5W-30Prista Oil AD
Q Horsepower Full SyntheticSAE 5W-40Pennzoil Quaker State
Q8 Formula ExcelSAE 5W-40Kuwait Petroleum
Q8 Formula SpecialSAE 0W-30Kuwait Petroleum
QS Ultimate Durability EuropeanSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Co
QS Ultimate Durability EuropeanSAE 5W-40Pennzoil Quaker State
QS Ultimate Durability European 5W-40 Full Synthetic Motor OilSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Quaker State DeLux SyntheticSAE 5W-40Pennzoil Quaker State
Quaker State SynquestSAE 5W-40Pennzoil Quaker State
Quaker State Ultimate Durability Euro 5W- 40 Motor OilSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Quaker State Ultimate Durability European EngineSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Quaker State Ultimate Durability European Full Synthetic Motor OilSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Quantum Synta ED 0W-30SAE 0W-30Quantum
Ravenol HCLSAE 5W-30Ravensbuger Schmierstoffvertrieb GmbH
real,- Quality GSRSAE 5W-30real,- Handels GmbH
Repsol Elite Common RailSAE 5W-30Repsol YPF
Repsol Elite CompeticionSAE 5W-40Repsol YPF
Shell Helix Diesel UltraSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Diesel UltraSAE 0W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Diesel UltraSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Diesel Ultra ESAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX6SAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX7SAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX7 CSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX8SAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix HX8 CSAE 0W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix UltecSAE 0W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix UltraSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix UltraSAE 0W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix UltraSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ABSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ALSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AMSAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra AMSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra CSAE 0W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra ESAE 5W-30Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell Helix Ultra Extra PolarSAE 0W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
Shell MSO-DSAE 5W-40Shell International Petroleum Company
SINOPEC JUSTAR J600FSAE 5W-40SINOPEC
SINOPEC JUSTAR J700FSAE 5W-40SINOPEC
SPC Syn AceSAE 5W-40Singapore Petroleum Company Ltd.
SPC SYN ACE SUPREME API SNSAE 5W-40Singapore Petroleum Company Limited
SRS VIVA 1 LonglifeSAE 5W-30SRS Schmierstoff Vertrieb GmbH
Statoil LazerWay BSAE 5W-30Statoil Lubricants
SynPower engine oilSAE 5W-30Valvoline
SynPower engine oilSAE 5W-40Valvoline
Synthetic PCSAE 5W-30eni S.p.A.
Synthetic PCSAE 5W-40eni S.p.A.
Titan Supersyn LonglifeSAE 5W-30Fuchs Petrolub AG
Titan Supersyn LonglifeSAE 5W-40Fuchs Petrolub AG
TNK Magnum UltratecSAE 5W-40TNK Lubricants, LLC
Tor HypersynthSAE 5W-40De Oliebron
Tor Synthetic LLSAE 5W-30De Oliebron
Total Activa 9000SAE 5W-40Total
Total Activa 9000 DieselSAE 5W-40Total
Total Activa 9000 EssenceSAE 5W-40Total
Total Activa Energy 9000SAE 0W-30Total
Total quartz 9000SAE 5W-40Total
Total Quartz 9000 EnergySAE 5W-40Total
Total Quartz Energy 9000SAE 0W-30Total
Triathlon Formula LLSAE 5W-30Adolf Würth GmbH & Co.KG
Ultra GoldSAE 5W-30Greatwall Lube Oil Co. SINOPEC
United 1SAE 5W-40United Oil Company Pte. Ltd.
Valvoline SynPowerSAE 5W-30Valvoline
Valvoline SynPower HSTSAE 5W-30Valvoline
Valvoline SynPower HSTSAE 5W-40Valvoline
Valvoline SynPower MXLSAE 5W-30Valvoline
Veritas SyntolubeSAE 0W-40Ölwerke Julius Schindler GmbH
VR 7.1SAE 5W-40Fuel Additive Products (M) Sdn Bhd
WAVE POWER SMSAE 5W-40North Sea Lubricants B.V.
Weco TXI SyntolubeSAE 5W-40Weco
Westfalen GigatronSAE 0W-40Westfalen AG
Westfalen MegatronSAE 5W-40Westfalen AG
Yacco VX 1000SAE 5W-40Yacco S.A.S.
Yacco VX 1000 LLSAE 5W-40Yacco S.A.S.
ZIC XQSAE 5W-30SK Lubricants Co., Ltd.
ZIC XQSAE 5W-40SK Lubricants Co., Ltd.


Links on m5board complements of jcolley:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcolley View Post
A few minutes of searching over there yields a few more:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...lp-advice.html

Here's the UK failure:
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...hese-v10s.html

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...wn-engine.html

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...ml#post1782187

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...se-advice.html

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...ml#post2270701

as well as the registry I was trying to start:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...-registry.html

Again, I'll be the first to state that not all were strictly bearing failures without cause. So I don't know that it's the "cornerstone" of the theory for the S65, the S85 certainly has its additional complexity to thank for some of those failures.

But to assume that BMW engineers (or any for that matter) never make mistakes or apply enough margin for error in the design fails to explain the VANOS pump redesign (insufficient tooth profile) or VANOS line failures or any other number of recalls and design changes.

Take it as you will, most engines will probably last well over 100k. Just as the S62 cars are now well understood with their "unique problems", the S85 is now coming of that age, and the S65 will in a couple of more years.

Anyway, enough of

More data please.
Others:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=906732

Last edited by regular guy; 01-24-2014 at 09:44 PM.
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      09-23-2013, 10:53 PM   #10
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did i misread the numbers? on the WPC bearings, the thickness is bigger than the VAC ones under metric but it's smaller under SAE?
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      09-24-2013, 12:12 AM   #11
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      09-24-2013, 12:16 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e92zero View Post
did i misread the numbers? on the WPC bearings, the thickness is bigger than the VAC ones under metric but it's smaller under SAE?
Should be fixed now. Thanks. Let me know if you catch any more.

Done for the night.

Engine and Clearance Specifications
Historical Background of S65 Bearing Issue
Discovering S65 Bearing Issue
Confirming S65 Bearing Issue
Proposed Solutions: VAC/Calico Coated Bearings
Proposed Solutions: WPC Treated Bearings

Still to come:
Clevite White Paper
Proposed solutions: Thinner Oil
Proposed solutions: Crankshaft Machining
Bearing Photo Database
Related Threads

Last edited by regular guy; 09-24-2013 at 01:21 AM.
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      09-24-2013, 01:23 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regular guy View Post
Should be fixed now. Thanks. Let me know if you catch any more.

Done for the night.

Engine and Clearance Specifications
Historical Background of S65 Bearing Issue
Discovering S65 Bearing Issue
Confirming S65 Bearing Issue
Proposed Solutions: VAC/Calico Coated Bearings
Proposed Solutions: WPC Treated Bearings

Still to come:
Clevite White Paper
Proposed solutions: Thinner Oil
Proposed solutions: Crankshaft Machining
Bearing Photo Database
Related Threads


Thank you so much so much for taking the time to gather, record all the info and letting us all know. Very interesting to see that using new bearings, the rod/bearing combo were all 2.04800. When I was contacting WPC, they mention that only the side of the bearing contacting the journal will be treated. Is that correct? I couldn't tell from the picture for sure.

Last edited by e92zero; 09-24-2013 at 01:31 AM.
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      09-24-2013, 01:36 AM   #14
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Thank you so much so much for taking the time to gather, record all the info and letting us all know. Very interesting to see that using new bearings, the rod/bearing combo were all 2.04800. When I was contacting WPC, they mention that only the side of the bearing contacting the journal will be treated. Is that correct? I couldn't tell from the picture for sure.
Yes that is correct, only the side touching the journal appeared to have any treatment to it. The WPC process was very nicely done.
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      09-24-2013, 02:47 AM   #15
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Amazing thread.
Leave it to AutoTalent to be up on this stuff.

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      09-24-2013, 03:44 AM   #16
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How does the size between the parting lines compare to a regular lower revving BMW motor such as an M54?

The S65 shells only give a .0016" clearance across the smallest point ie 90 degrees to part line. The clearance across the part line is at least .002" greater, thus giving an oval bore with .0035" - .004"clearance at the widest point.

From this I'm assuming that BMW did some stress analysis at 8,400rpm and found the rod bore stretched by .001". This would mean the bearing bore would be perfectly round at 8,400rpm resulting in a clearance of approx .0025" all around the bearing?

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      09-24-2013, 03:53 AM   #17
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Awesome thread! Thank you for putting it up.
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      09-24-2013, 03:59 AM   #18
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Excellent write up! Thank you for taking the time.

I was a little confused on why the WPC treatment would be thinner since it sounded like a coating at first, but after a quick google search it makes sense.

Looking forward to the rest.
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      09-24-2013, 05:56 AM   #19
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Quote:
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Yes that is correct, only the side touching the journal appeared to have any treatment to it. The WPC process was very nicely done.
Regular Guy, awesome job! Thank you very much for taking the time to put together the above.
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      09-24-2013, 06:46 AM   #20
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Thanks for the info, I will keep a watch on this thread for sure.
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      09-24-2013, 08:13 AM   #21
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This to me is the post of the year. Thank you for the work and time you have put into this for the benefit of all S65/S85 owners. Knowledge is power
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      09-24-2013, 08:33 AM   #22
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Wow. Awesome work getting all of this together in one place!
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