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      06-07-2013, 10:48 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baba louey View Post
I believe that there are gov't regulations stating how long a car company is required to keep making parts for a certain model. 10 yrs.? Also don't forget about rebuilt motors. There is usually a good supply of perfectly good blocks and heads available as time goes by. All engine don't explode, some just wear out and get rebuilt.
this. All cars manufacturers are required to continue to make parts for a certain # of years post the vehilce being made. After that then the A/M can pick up the parts as well. The last thing I would worry about is spare engines.
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      06-07-2013, 11:20 PM   #90
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damn. rip m3. good luck getting it fixed bro
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      06-08-2013, 12:21 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by jqsmooth View Post


you're right. i'm sure they gotta have enough to cover people through regular warranty AND people who purchased extended warranty. just curious how they determine how many to keep around or do they make them out of spare parts as needed. that is all. jesus. this forum is tough, no need to get sarcastic. i'm gonna think hard about getting the extended warranty IF I feel I'm gonna keep the car much longer than 4 years. I'm always thinking I will but with the new model coming out, who knows???

.
I am not trying to be hard on you lol. sorry!

but it doesn't matter how they determine how many they need to keep. If you need a new engine and warrnety is still there. You will get a new engine, they will make one if need be. Making one would be very easy also for a huge company like BMW.
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      06-08-2013, 12:37 AM   #92
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Rule of thumb is that manufacturer will produce and make parts available for 10 years after production has ended. Now they will not sell all of it right away so parts usually linger through warehouse and dealer stock years after that. Complete engine, I imagine soon after they stop production there will only be a handful left.

IMO if you drive your M3 (or any high perf cars) hard or has power adder plan on bearings and rings job as a preventive maintenance. You have to pay to play.You also have to stay on top of things. One big downside of not having an oil dipstick is that its that much harder to check your oil. Not only level but condition. I myself change oil after every track event.
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      06-08-2013, 12:53 AM   #93
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IMO if you drive your M3 (or any high perf cars) hard or has power adder plan on bearings and rings job as a preventive maintenance. You have to pay to play.You also have to stay on top of things.
Precisely why I will never SC my engine, leave well enough alone. The car is magnificient in its stock form
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      06-08-2013, 01:39 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezio View Post
I am not trying to be hard on you lol. sorry!

but it doesn't matter how they determine how many they need to keep. If you need a new engine and warrnety is still there. You will get a new engine, they will make one if need be. Making one would be very easy also for a huge company like BMW.
It's cool. I think I found the answers I've been looking for. This information is very useful. I'm just trying to keep informed.

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Originally Posted by baba louey View Post
I believe that there are gov't regulations stating how long a car company is required to keep making parts for a certain model. 10 yrs.? Also don't forget about rebuilt motors. There is usually a good supply of perfectly good blocks and heads available as time goes by. All engine don't explode, some just wear out and get rebuilt.
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Originally Posted by s65e90 View Post
this. All cars manufacturers are required to continue to make parts for a certain # of years post the vehilce being made. After that then the A/M can pick up the parts as well. The last thing I would worry about is spare engines.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edjay View Post
Rule of thumb is that manufacturer will produce and make parts available for 10 years after production has ended. Now they will not sell all of it right away so parts usually linger through warehouse and dealer stock years after that. Complete engine, I imagine soon after they stop production there will only be a handful left.

IMO if you drive your M3 (or any high perf cars) hard or has power adder plan on bearings and rings job as a preventive maintenance. You have to pay to play.You also have to stay on top of things. One big downside of not having an oil dipstick is that its that much harder to check your oil. Not only level but condition. I myself change oil after every track event.
thanks for the reply fellas.
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      06-08-2013, 06:05 AM   #95
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rip best of luck getting things fixed
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      06-08-2013, 06:58 AM   #96
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To address some of the issues raised so far in this important thread:

1. Warranty will definitely not cover this. You will need a new motor and install and will need to pay out of pocket. Period.

2. Do not try to commit fraud. Fraud on this amount of money is just plain stupid. Can you see yourself digging yourself into a deeper and deeper hole.

3. Adding forced induction on a motor not originally designed for it will increase the risk for failure. Period. Accept the risk if you want to go down that road. There are no shortcuts. If you want to do this right, build the motor, lower the compression, add a larger oil pan, larger oil cooler and larger radiator for proper heat management.

4. Understand the concept that no amount of power will ever be enough. The OP upgraded from 600 to 650hp. Why? Isn't 600hp enough? See how this goes. You body adapts physiologically to the forces put on it, and the car just doesn't seem as fast. People who drive a 150hp car will get into a bone stock M3 and say "holy shit!!!" Even if you owned a 1000hp car, if you drove it enough, it would stop feeling as fast as it did initially.

Has anyone moved "down" to a car with less power? I have. In 2004, I sold my highly modded Audi S4 that had 500lb-ft of torque and bought a 350Z. For about the first month it felt slow. After that, it started to feel fast again to my brain. My body and brain actually "de-adapted" from the faster car.

A stock M3 does 0-60 in the low to mid 4's. On an absolute level, this is fast. This was supercar speed not too long ago. The engine in NA form is a masterpiece IMO. Enjoy it for what it is. There are some great tweaks that you can do to extract a little more in NA form with little downside. Thats as far as I would go. If you want big power, start with a factory turbo. The next gen M3/4 will do well in this regard. Of course then people will complain that the engine doesn't have the same "character". And it won't.
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      06-08-2013, 10:48 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by Team Plutonium View Post
I agree with all of your points, but the drive for more power can never be rationalized. I upgraded from the 535 kit - to the 600 kit, then the 625 kit, and right before I sold the car I was talking to Roman about a 700 kit with a build motor. It was fun, but obviously having enough power is all relative. I grew up in Germany, and when I moved from a 45 HP Renault R5 to a Fiat Uno with 75 HP I felt like Senna driving around town.

And I did go from a 650+ monster to the 400 hp 911, and while I adore the 911 for all what is (it is my dream car after all), I do miss the raw power of the supercharged M3 once in a while.

I think the quest for (always and ridiculous) more power is fun, but expensive, nothing wrong with that, but you have to accept the risks, be it engine related, or accident related. The later is something nobody talks about all that much, but the chance of getting into trouble with 600+ horsepower cars is far greater (well, faster really), then their stock counterparts.
I do know what you mean. I still have the memory of my S4. 2.7L twin turbo V6 with 25 lbs of boost. The enormous swell of midrange torque just nailed you into the seat. There is an absolute level of speed capability that is required, but I feel that a stock M3 (and 991S) is well in that range. Beyond that, it is other subjective qualities that become more important. I also agree with what you said about the risk of really high power. I would be able get going so fast on public roads so quickly without realizing it. Part of the fun of driving is the sensory experience of the feedback you get from a car while pushing it. If you can't safely do this, part of the fun is lost.

In that sense, if your goal is truly just to go fast, then a car like the GTR will suit your needs best. It is an instrument for speed and is purpose built for nothing else other than to go super fast in as safe and controlled manner as can be engineered.
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      06-08-2013, 11:15 AM   #98
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Dayuuuuuum. Sorry to hear this OP, hope you get it all worked out.
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      06-08-2013, 11:26 AM   #99
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Wow that sucks, good luck with the repairs...so is this a common problem with all M3's or more so with cars that are tracked?
*No, not at all. This car had been heavily modified with a supercharger and more. Stock M3's can take enormous amounts of hard driving and the S65 is still good for way into 6 figure mileages, by all accounts (mine is only at 32k).

Personally, I only mod the brakes on my M-cars. But that's NOT to say anyone is wrong who does more, as it's there car and they should do to it what makes them happy. But when it comes to engine modifications, caveat emptor is term worth bearing in mind.

OP- hope the fix goes smoothly.

*if this has already been answered, my apologies, but I'm not reading all 5 pages.
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Last edited by Carl L; 06-08-2013 at 12:27 PM. Reason: typo on one word
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      06-08-2013, 12:02 PM   #100
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i think this has been touched upon in this thread, but to be certain....do the 2013s have rod bearing issue addressed?

OP, i truly hope for the best outcome for you on this. whatever you decide to do.

for someone who knows very little about engines, this thread has been an interesting read.
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      06-08-2013, 12:16 PM   #101
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Might be canceling the 2013 order once you get the bill for the new engine. Will car insurance cover this if warranty does not?

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Yea I just hit 38,000 miles last night and this happen. Luckily I just ordered a new 2013 last week for euro delivery so I am not that depressed lol
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      06-08-2013, 12:30 PM   #102
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I did not think so either.

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Not a chance.
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      06-08-2013, 01:00 PM   #103
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When did Ess start including rod bearings in the 650 kit ?
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      06-08-2013, 01:35 PM   #104
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I don't think so. It is also important to realize that the amount of engines with this issue is minuscule! Compared to the amount of M3's sold it is a non-issue.
It's also important to realize Bimmerpost with about 6,000 active members worldwide, represent a miniscule number of BMW owners.

In the last 4 years BMW sold more than a million cars in the U.S. alone. And not all the members advertise their engine problems on here. Most people take their cars to the dealer for warranty work without discussing it here.

And sometimes part of the so called goodwill gestures to fix a legimate work, they make you sign a release form not to discuss the problem on the foruns.
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      06-08-2013, 01:53 PM   #105
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When did Ess start including rod bearings in the 650 kit ?
Didnt know they were doing this. Can anyone confirm?
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      06-08-2013, 02:10 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by US///M3 View Post
It's also important to realize Bimmerpost with about 6,000 active members worldwide, represent a miniscule number of BMW owners.

In the last 4 years BMW sold more than a million cars in the U.S. alone. And not all the members advertise their engine problems on here. Most people take their cars to the dealer for warranty work without discussing it here.

And sometimes part of the so called goodwill gestures to fix a legimate work, they make you sign a release form not to discuss the problem on the foruns.
If a dealer or company said I had to sign a form stating I was not to discuss on forums or elsewhere before they would do the work, I'd walk out of the place and go right to the company's executives (in person or mail or whatever).
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      06-08-2013, 02:39 PM   #107
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Never heard of a dealer requiring you to sign an NDA
I was referring to BMW NA goodwill gestures, buyback etc.
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      06-08-2013, 03:19 PM   #108
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I was referring to BMW NA goodwill gestures, buyback etc.
And where did you obtain such information from?
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      06-08-2013, 03:26 PM   #109
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Didnt know they were doing this. Can anyone confirm?
it's on their website now and the price of the vt2-650 is $500 more than it used to be.
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      06-08-2013, 05:42 PM   #110
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And where did you obtain such information from?
I made it up.
This is what a typical release form reads:

General Release


IN CONSIDERATION OF a one-time goodwill offer, BMW will provide xyz to ...the undersigned releases and fully discharges BMW of North America, LLC (“BMWNA”), BAYERISCHE MOTOREN WERKE AG (“BMW AG”) and each of their predecessors, successors, subsidiaries and affiliated entities, parents, partners, dealers, officers, directors, shareholders, agents, servants, employees, representatives, attorneys, heirs, successors and assigns, past and present, and each of them (hereinafter collectively referred to as the “Releasees”), from any and all claims, demands and causes of action of any and every kind and nature, including, without limitation, claims or fraud, negligent misrepresentation, non-discloser, fraudulent misrepresentation, negligence, personal injuries, product liability, breach damages, attorneys fees, damages, costs and expenses, whether known or unknown, suspected or unsuspected, which the undersigned now owns or holds or at any time heretofore has owned or held against the others arising out of, resulting from, or in any way related to the undersigned’s 2008 BMW M3, vehicle identification number….

The undersigned recognizes that in executing this General Release that this instrument shall be effective as a bar to each and every action, claim, demand or cause of action released hereby.

No action taken by the Releasees, either previously or in connection with this Generation Release shall be deemed or construed to be an admission of the truth, falsity, fault or liability of the matter pertaining to any action, claim, demand, or cause of action referred to herein or relating to the subject matter of this General Release.

The undersigned will keep confidential the existence and terms of this General Release. The undersigned agrees not to reveal the facts leading up to the terms or conditions of this General Release in any communication form including, but not limited to, word-of-mouth, print, broadcast or internet.
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