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      04-29-2013, 07:40 PM   #1
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Dual Purpose Coils for ~ 3K....AST, TCK, Ohlins, JRZ...?

Hey guys,

I realize i have a 1M, but it is very similar to the m3 in terms of suspension setup.

I use my 1M as a DD but also for HPDE events, probably about 8 or so per year. Currently I have KW v3 and the lack of suspension control over bumps is bothersome to me. I want higher quality dampers that can control the car over rough and bumpy pavement.

That said, i want a higher end coilover setup, and am not averse to using camber plates, that can be used for a comfortable DD and also be capable at the track.

I am considering the following....

TCK D/A with vorshlag camber plates (unsure of spring rates)
AST 4100 with vorshlag camber plates (unsure of spring rates)
Ohlins RT
to a lesser extent, jrz

I dont want to have to worry about constantly rebuilding these and fitment issues or much noise since this is my DD.

Anyone have any feedback? Leaning towards ohlins at the moment.
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      04-29-2013, 07:44 PM   #2
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Been leaning toward the Ohlins as my car is primarily street driven, but also want the good track performance. Curious to hear others input.
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      04-29-2013, 09:11 PM   #3
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Ohlins RT should be first on your list
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      04-29-2013, 10:13 PM   #4
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I too have been investigating the Ohlins offering. I haven't gotten a solid grasp of things to fully say I am committed to that route, and would also appreciate input from other owners!
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      04-30-2013, 08:43 AM   #5
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yes it seems that the TCK D/A and the Ohlins both have excellent (yet limited) feedback to this point

still struggling with this decision
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      04-30-2013, 10:01 AM   #6
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Honestly I don't think you can go wrong with any of the options you mentioned. You are really comparing quite different setups. Do you feel the need for a D/A shock? Most won't be able to take advantage of all of that adjust ability.

One thing to consider when making this decision is customer service. The Ohlins/JRZ will likely require more frequent rebuilds which could be a pain in the ass. Find a shop in Houston, and see what they think would offer the most convenience for you. From my research, the Ohlins/JRZ are really great compromise shocks. They are very capable for most on the track and still offer a certain level of comfort on the street. I think the TCKs will likely be the easiest to service when/if you need to.

Another thing to consider is "upgrading" the V3s. Again, find a shop in Htown that is well versed with suspensions and start playing with different linear spring rates (instead of the progressive springs that come with the kit) and shock settings. You may find that with a little bit of tweaking, the V3s are more than up to the task and you have saved a little bit of money.

The Ohlins kit is the hot new flavor and I am sure it is great. That said, TCK has been in the game for quite a while and really know what they are doing. But my $0.02 is to take what you read on here with a grain of salt. If you really want to dial in the suspension talking with honest industry professionals is really the next step.
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      04-30-2013, 10:49 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lcrain View Post
Honestly I don't think you can go wrong with any of the options you mentioned. You are really comparing quite different setups. Do you feel the need for a D/A shock? Most won't be able to take advantage of all of that adjust ability.

One thing to consider when making this decision is customer service. The Ohlins/JRZ will likely require more frequent rebuilds which could be a pain in the ass. Find a shop in Houston, and see what they think would offer the most convenience for you. From my research, the Ohlins/JRZ are really great compromise shocks. They are very capable for most on the track and still offer a certain level of comfort on the street. I think the TCKs will likely be the easiest to service when/if you need to.

Another thing to consider is "upgrading" the V3s. Again, find a shop in Htown that is well versed with suspensions and start playing with different linear spring rates (instead of the progressive springs that come with the kit) and shock settings. You may find that with a little bit of tweaking, the V3s are more than up to the task and you have saved a little bit of money.

The Ohlins kit is the hot new flavor and I am sure it is great. That said, TCK has been in the game for quite a while and really know what they are doing. But my $0.02 is to take what you read on here with a grain of salt. If you really want to dial in the suspension talking with honest industry professionals is really the next step.
I appreciate the insight. Something that really impresses me with TCK is their exclusive (and successful) work within the BMW community. Equally as much is Ohlins lineage within suspension systems, and coveted reputation within a wide-array of markets.
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      04-30-2013, 05:10 PM   #8
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I really like my AST 4200's. Only issue I'm having is the rear mount is making some noise now, but that is fixable. Functionality wise they are the bees knees. I daily my car 60 miles each day, and track around 6 times per year. Super adjustable, and the ride is nice and smooth when you back the adjustments down.
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      04-30-2013, 05:25 PM   #9
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I would also consider KW Clubsports and/or KW Clubsport 3-way's. I have been very happy with mine on the street. I can't comment on track performance yet... A track day will be happening soon.
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      04-30-2013, 05:35 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
I would also consider KW Clubsports and/or KW Clubsport 3-way's. I have been very happy with mine on the street. I can't comment on track performance yet... A track day will be happening soon.
One thing worth noting (and it's probably just me), is the knowledge required to properly adjust dampers with multiple adjustments. I had KW V3's and was always intimidated to adjust them because of compression and rebound adjustments. 3-way sounds even more daunting. I'm just learning how suspension changes affect the car at the track and the single adjustment on the ohlins has made it a much better learning experience for me. Not saying one adjustment is better than multi, but it's just worth noting for those who don't know a lot about suspension tuning.
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      04-30-2013, 05:42 PM   #11
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FYI, the Ohlins RT manual says the shocks should be serviced every 10 hours of racing or 30,000 km of street driving. Not sure what the the service life of the V3's are.

These dampers are worlds better than the V3's, but that's all I have to compare with. I don't have experience with the other setups.
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      04-30-2013, 05:46 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiantm3 View Post
FYI, the Ohlins RT manual says the shocks should be serviced every 10 hours of racing or 30,000 km of street driving. Not sure what the the service life of the V3's are.

These dampers are worlds better than the V3's, but that's all I have to compare with. I don't have experience with the other setups.
That is very surprising news to me....that is very often for me since I dd my car.

Anyone know if this is the case for tck d/a?
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      04-30-2013, 06:24 PM   #13
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KW V3s are designed to last about 60K miles before rebuilding. That shortens with frequent track use and of course your road conditions.

Most high end suspension systems feel great but require more frequent servicing. They aren't designed with daily driving as a top priority.
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      04-30-2013, 07:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiantm3 View Post
FYI, the Ohlins RT manual says the shocks should be serviced every 10 hours of racing or 30,000 km of street driving. Not sure what the the service life of the V3's are.

These dampers are worlds better than the V3's, but that's all I have to compare with. I don't have experience with the other setups.
You comparison between the two, how have you come to that conclusion?
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      04-30-2013, 07:34 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sterile stork View Post
You comparison between the two, how have you come to that conclusion?
Yes more detail on the comparison would be excellent!
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      05-01-2013, 09:43 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sterile stork View Post
You comparison between the two, how have you come to that conclusion?
I'm no suspension expert so just going by what I feel:

1) I get way more suspension travel with the ohlins. I learned this by doing my first track session in a street setting. I was amazed by the amount and smoothness of the body roll.

2) It keeps the wheels on the ground over bumps way better than the v3's even at race stiffness. There's a part of the track where you can cut through a bunch of rumble strips for a faster exit speed and whenever I did that with the V3's I couldn't be on the gas very hard through them because I had very little traction. With the ohlins I was able to be on the gas. It felt great.

3) The springs are way stiffer than the V3's, but the dampers still absorb shock much better so even though the ride feels stiffer than the V3's, it's also more compliant on the street and still comfortable.

4) The ohlin dampers are quite a bit lighter than the V3's. I didn't put them on scales, but there was a huge difference holding them both in each arm.

Hope that helps a bit.
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      05-01-2013, 11:00 AM   #17
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MCS singles would be highest on my list if I was in your shoes. Probably the best customer support in the industry.
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      05-01-2013, 05:08 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiantm3 View Post
I'm no suspension expert so just going by what I feel:

1) I get way more suspension travel with the ohlins. I learned this by doing my first track session in a street setting. I was amazed by the amount and smoothness of the body roll.

2) It keeps the wheels on the ground over bumps way better than the v3's even at race stiffness. There's a part of the track where you can cut through a bunch of rumble strips for a faster exit speed and whenever I did that with the V3's I couldn't be on the gas very hard through them because I had very little traction. With the ohlins I was able to be on the gas. It felt great.

3) The springs are way stiffer than the V3's, but the dampers still absorb shock much better so even though the ride feels stiffer than the V3's, it's also more compliant on the street and still comfortable.

4) The ohlin dampers are quite a bit lighter than the V3's. I didn't put them on scales, but there was a huge difference holding them both in each arm.

Hope that helps a bit.
Thank you for the insight. It certainly does!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrimeBMW View Post
MCS singles would be highest on my list if I was in your shoes. Probably the best customer support in the industry.
Now you've gone and thrown a wrench into the whole mix! MCS has quite the promise, however I cannot find any first hand experience that might help shed some light onto the whole ordeal
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      05-01-2013, 07:14 PM   #19
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If you want to stay in that range and not have huge rebuild costs...go w/ TCK DA and never look back. (350lb or 450lb frt and 600lb or 700lb rear springs). If you are more of a track guy and play around, go heavier springs, but if you want super smooth ride and great handling go softer. Also if you're stuffing a 10 or 10.5 wide rim on the front go with the heavier spring rates because there is so much grip with that size tire up front.
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      05-01-2013, 08:13 PM   #20
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JRZ RS1 and be done with it. Don't even compare KW CS or KW V3 to JRZ or Ohlins, not in the same league, I know cause I have had them.
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      05-02-2013, 12:29 AM   #21
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Quote:
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JRZ RS1 and be done with it. Don't even compare KW CS or KW V3 to JRZ or Ohlins, not in the same league, I know cause I have had them.
you wouldnt say ohlin is in the same league as JRZ?
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      05-02-2013, 06:14 AM   #22
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Quote:
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you wouldnt say ohlin is in the same league as JRZ?
I'm running the JRZ RS1s on my M3s and the Ohlins R&T on my R56 Mini Cooper S. I've also used TCK and Moton on my M3s.

The Ohlins R&T is a great street damper whereas the RS1s are a great dual-purpose damper. You can feel the change in handling response with each "click" of the RS1s. With the Ohlins it takes multiple "clicks" to feel a change. Also, the RS1s can handle a very wide range of spring rates; based on reviews of, and the questions I've asked vendors, the Ohlins R&T apparently have a more limited range of rates (more street biased).

If you want a more track-biased setup with streetability I'd get the MCS SA damper (not out yet when I bought my sets of RS1s). Similar to the RS1 but more biased to the track. Also, you can upgrade the MCS SA dampers to other MCS damper options; e.g., have them converted to 2-way remote-reservoir dampers
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