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      03-29-2013, 05:21 PM   #89
Mss396
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P-rex View Post
I guess our history's are opposing...

Nonetheless... Agent orange was chemical warfare.... Just like the a-bomb.... Over million civilians died and/ or suffered extreme pain and suffering....
Yes it was weed killer used in a war time environment and about "Over million civilians died and/ or suffered extreme pain and suffering...." From the use of the bomb to end WWII. Sorry try less than 1/4 of your number died from those events.

Hint.. Try looking things up before opening yourself up.
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      03-29-2013, 05:32 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by Mss396 View Post
Yes it was weed killer used in a war time environment and about "Over million civilians died and/ or suffered extreme pain and suffering...." From the use of the bomb to end WWII. Sorry try less than 1/4 of your number died from those events.

Hint.. Try looking things up before opening yourself up.
According to Vietnamese Ministry of Foreign Affairs, 4.8 million Vietnamese people were exposed to Agent Orange, resulting in 400,000 people being killed or maimed, and 500,000 children born with birth defects.
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      03-29-2013, 06:13 PM   #91
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Sorry I was being modest to those affect...

You would think that the government would test their chemical agents before dumping it on innocent civilians and animals..
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      03-29-2013, 06:17 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by MrRoboto View Post
According to Vietnamese Ministry of Foreign Affairs, 4.8 million Vietnamese people were exposed to Agent Orange, resulting in 400,000 people being killed or maimed, and 500,000 children born with birth defects.
And 39,000 US servicemen were exposed, along with 30,000 servicemen in Korea (it was used at the DMZ during the Korean Conflict). Agent Orange was also used as a defoliant in Canada, Brazil, and other parts of the world. A Vietnamese group sued in US courts in 2005, but the case was dismissed because AO was used as a defoliant, not against the people, and there was no violation of international law in using it as a defoliant.
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      03-29-2013, 06:32 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by P-rex View Post
Going back on topic....

Question is... Was in adding Iraq post 9/11 unilaterally without UN approval a win for America?

Consider costs and benefits...
It's not over yet. By showing US military "might" in the region, did we hold other attacks at bay? Did we provide stabilization in the region from other dictators and US enemies? Perhaps if Obama had shown less weakness in the subsequent years, would Islamic religious regimes not have taken over as many countries in the middle east?

I would also pose the question - should Canada have assisted the US in the Iraq war, as one of the "15 other nations...do not wish to be named, but will be supporting the Coalition of the Willing", per Colin Powell? Did the Canadian government and military see that it was needed, but not wish to go against the public sentiment of the Canadian people?

On March 25, 2003, during the “shock and awe” bombardment of Iraq, then US Ambassador Paul Cellucci admitted that “… ironically, Canadian naval vessels, aircraft and personnel... will supply more support to this war in Iraq indirectly... than most of those 46 countries that are fully supporting our efforts there.”

Was it worth it to Canada?
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      03-29-2013, 08:00 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by kmarei View Post
Saddam Hussein was an asshole
so are pretty much all the arab leaders, african leader, some south american leaders
some asian leaders
so why did we only get rid of him?
why not make a list, and check them off one by one?
what made iraq more worthy of regime change than the others?
and why not north korea, who already have a nuclear weapon.
The very fact that the US does not want to mess with north korea, because they have the bomb, is the very same reason iran wants to get the bomb.
because once you get that, you are safe from, the US bombers, then the americans wonder why these countries are trying to get the bomb?

Or perhaps it has to do with the USD and how it reigns supreme as oil HAS to be traded in US dollar's...Few countries have tried to trade oil in non-US dollar's and you can guess what happened to them.

Wonder why Saddam and Osama Bin Laden was on the US govt payroll at one time but all of a sudden they are seen as pure evil devil worshippers?...you think many americans know that the CIA had them on the payroll at one time?...hmmm.

Wonder why we invaded Iraq?..you dont really think we went to war because of stupid WMD's do you...think people...its always about the US dollar and oil...we went to get the oil and their oil reserves...Alan Greenspan even said as such...wonder why Paul Oneil the dept Secretary of Treasury was fired by Bush II?...cause Oneil said that Bush was talking about invading Iraq way before 9/11 and Oneils kept questining him on it...Bush Sr started it and Bush Jr wanted to finish it cause its always about money and oil.

BTW guys, please look all this up for yourselves....dont believe me thats for sure.

It doesnt matter what military men say...99.99% of them dont know why we went to war either or dont want to believe it...we are all just pawns in their game...they get us to believe what they want us to believe cause the media is owned by them and 99% of us are sheep are we not?
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      03-29-2013, 08:01 PM   #95
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The honourable Paul Martin who was prime minister during the invasion opposed all war efforts and aggression joining France and Germany among NATO members...

Canada now is run by a mere nitwit ... Stevie Harper.... And jonny Baird who are a disgrace to the country and don't represent most Canadians

Canada has an army of 40k strong.... We are a non factor globally and member to NATO....

So no... It's not worth it for Canada... But for good faith to Uncle Sam... Our hands are tied...
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      03-29-2013, 08:15 PM   #96
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it's the law of large numbers of geopolitics and strategy. america stumbled into ww2 and profited immensely through brute force and some very ethically questionable moves (saving/bribing key war criminals both in germany and japan).

live by the jump shot, die by the jump shot. since ww2, america's stuck to this same strategy of brute force and backdoor dealing. it worked once, but it's an unsound strategy. america left vietnam (after getting its ass handed). korea was a big waste of time. and the middle east, battles may have been won, but overall another waste of money. and now it's a quasi civil war as politicians are all about pork and misappropriation of funds (more taxes!). the rise in homeland shootings: can you smell the desperation? the working class gets taxed more and kids become fighters who don't even know what they're fighting for.

key point is this senseless pride that america never loses... like a crack whore that just can't let it go. the sun is setting for america as the world's cop, and i really don't think it's a bad thing. [THG]


Last edited by amanda hor$t; 03-29-2013 at 08:41 PM.
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      03-29-2013, 09:01 PM   #97
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USA is the worlds largest corporation... The CEO is the most powerful man
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      03-29-2013, 09:35 PM   #98
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Keep it rolling guys. Teaching a Canadian proper US Military history is making my day.
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      03-29-2013, 09:45 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Templar
Keep it rolling guys. Teaching a Canadian proper US Military history is making my day.
Huh? Eh?
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      03-29-2013, 10:51 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by R Grubba Balls View Post
it's the law of large numbers of geopolitics and strategy. america stumbled into ww2 and profited immensely through brute force and some very ethically questionable moves (saving/bribing key war criminals both in germany and japan).

live by the jump shot, die by the jump shot. since ww2, america's stuck to this same strategy of brute force and backdoor dealing. it worked once, but it's an unsound strategy. america left vietnam (after getting its ass handed). korea was a big waste of time. and the middle east, battles may have been won, but overall another waste of money. and now it's a quasi civil war as politicians are all about pork and misappropriation of funds (more taxes!). the rise in homeland shootings: can you smell the desperation? the working class gets taxed more and kids become fighters who don't even know what they're fighting for.

key point is this senseless pride that america never loses... like a crack whore that just can't let it go. the sun is setting for america as the world's cop, and i really don't think it's a bad thing. [THG]
The US didn't get it's "ass handed" in Vietnam - we didn't get beat, instead we walked away - there is a difference. Key mistake was letting the "suits" manage the war effort, vs. the warriors.

Korea was certainly not a waste of time - it held the ChiComs at bay.

Whatever we did to win WW2, we also did it in WW1.

Politicians are a mess - I agree.

The rise in Homeland shootings are because crazy people are not kept away from guns - it has nothing to do with a rise in desperation - How did you come to that conclusion?

Senseless pride? America is the greatest nation the world has ever seen, using any and every measure - and that's senseless pride to you?
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      03-29-2013, 10:54 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Templar View Post
Keep it rolling guys. Teaching a Canadian proper US Military history is making my day.
More like self-loathing liberals - it's a common theme...
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      03-29-2013, 10:56 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
More like self-loathing liberals - it's a common theme...
True.

I won't contribute much because anything I will say will only get me an infraction or a forum ban. These two jokers have no clue what they are talking about, and don't even know basic history.
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      03-29-2013, 11:16 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Grubba Balls View Post
[THG]

Why did you post a picture of Ho Chi Minh with the East German Navy?
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      03-29-2013, 11:21 PM   #104
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The truth hurts... USA lost the Vietnam war.... What you were told was sugar coated

USA may be the greatest nation in the world.... But it is bankrupt and china is holding it by the cherries...
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      03-29-2013, 11:39 PM   #105
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The truth hurts... USA lost the Vietnam war.... What you were told was sugar coated

USA may be the greatest nation in the world.... But it is bankrupt and china is holding it by the cherries...
You offer no supporting information for your claim that the US lost the war.

The US is not bankrupt, and China is not holding anything but promissory notes. Japan owns virtually as much US debt as China, as of Jan 2013. And less than half of the debt is owed to foreign nations.

We are through here - your information is continually wrong, and unsupported with facts.
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      03-29-2013, 11:42 PM   #106
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So... is Israel going to war with Iran or what?

I think they are cowards that shoot off their mouths like little bitches! I wanna see them attack or STFU!
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      03-30-2013, 12:14 AM   #107
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So... is Israel going to war with Iran or what?

I think they are cowards that shoot off their mouths like little bitches! I wanna see them attack or STFU!
Don't underestimate them - that's kind of what Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, and Iraq thought in 1948.

And Egypt and Jordan thought in 1967 (for 6 days).

And Syria and Egypt though in 1973.

And Syria and the PLO thought in 1982.

And Hezbollah thought in 2006.

There are less than 14 million Jews on the planet (6 million in Israel today), and there have never been over 15 million at any time - in a world of 6 billion people. They occupy an area about the size of New Jersey. Why would anyone consider them a threat?
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      03-30-2013, 01:24 AM   #108
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Wow at the great liberty some of you take in rewriting history.

How do some of you define victory and defeat in war? How did America "get its ass handed to it" when the body count shows otherwise?

I would also say Israel is the most dangerous nation in the world considering how small it is. It is dangerous because of its huge influence in American foreign policy. They are a parasite nation and I laugh at anyone who dares call them "our greatest ally".
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      03-30-2013, 02:23 AM   #109
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if america took a shit, i think the only people who would feel bad would be americans who've never left the country. anyone know why an american passport is written in french?
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      03-30-2013, 06:36 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Don't underestimate them - that's kind of what Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, and Iraq thought in 1948.

And Egypt and Jordan thought in 1967 (for 6 days).

And Syria and Egypt though in 1973.

And Syria and the PLO thought in 1982.

And Hezbollah thought in 2006.

There are less than 14 million Jews on the planet (6 million in Israel today), and there have never been over 15 million at any time - in a world of 6 billion people. They occupy an area about the size of New Jersey. Why would anyone consider them a threat?
Oh yeah those were all arabs! These guys have 3000 years of army history behind them!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post

And Hezbollah thought in 2006.
Are you serious?
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Last edited by Ahmed; 03-30-2013 at 06:42 AM.
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