BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos
 
GT Haus
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-11-2013, 03:24 PM   #1
inspector gadget
New Member
 
Drives: chevy c6 corvette
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: USA

Posts: 23
iTrader: (0)

Exclamation Next gen 2015 Mustang (s550) will get Turbo 4 Cylinder Ecoboost @ 300 HP

Saw this up on Mustang6G.

Pretty incredible numbers for a turbo 4 cyl And if they drop weight in the next Mustang, it should go like stink.

Article:
http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showthread.php?t=565
inspector gadget is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 03:41 PM   #2
Dave07997S
Colonel
 
Drives: 2013 BMW M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Playa del Rey, CA

Posts: 2,456
iTrader: (1)

That 2.3L EB4 motor is what the Focus RS is going to get in Europe, which we won't get. The 2.3 EB4 motor is over 330hp and 300 ft/lbs of tq. It will take sometime for Mustang buyers to get used to the idea of this motor though. I remember when the SVO Mustang was out with similar horsepower numbers to the older iron 5.0L V8 and the V8 outsold the more expensive SVO by a 3:1 margin.

Dave
__________________
2013 M3 Coupe-MR/BLK ZCP, ACM test pipes, BPM Stg2 dev. tune and Megan catback, AFE Stg2. with C/F elbow
Previous rides: 2011 M3 Coupe-MR/Blk
2007 Porsche 997C2S Speed Yellow/Blk sport seats
2004 BMW M3 Imola/Blk
Dave07997S is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 03:59 PM   #3
kyleb350
Brigadier General
 
kyleb350's Avatar
 
Drives: F30 335i M-Sport
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: LoMbard, IL

Posts: 4,170
iTrader: (6)

I wouldn't imagine it'll upset too many Mustang fans as it'll be the entry level engine option. From the rumors I've read, the engine is based on the 2.0L Focus ST engine with a slightly larger turbo to go with the displacement bump.
kyleb350 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 04:04 PM   #4
IancoleTX
Dillo boxers
 
IancoleTX's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: USA

Posts: 3,041
iTrader: (13)

A high-output turbo 4 is going to be similar in performance to a V6, so why bother? It's not going to be cheaper, and if you try and squeeze crazy power out of a 4-cyl already putting about ~150 hp/liter.. can't be great for reliability. I don't get it at this point.
__________________
2011 135i 6MT - Alpine White / Savannah Beige
IancoleTX is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 04:56 PM   #5
GeeRam
Captain
 
GeeRam's Avatar
 
Drives: 135i Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London,UK

Posts: 885
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by IancoleTX View Post
A high-output turbo 4 is going to be similar in performance to a V6, so why bother?
Euro emissions.
__________________
2011 135i M-Sport Coupe DCT ~ Bluewater:Coral Red | BMWP CF spoiler & BMWPE | Birds B1 suspension | Forge FMIC | Hartge footrest | Alufelgen CS7 & Pirelli P Zero

2012 Harley Davidson Softail Slim ~ lots of mods
GeeRam is offline   United Kingdom
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 05:13 PM   #6
Red Bread
Brigadier General
 
Drives: My wife's car
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Dallas, TX

Posts: 4,214
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
And engine displacement tax.
Red Bread is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 07:59 PM   #7
Year's_End
RWD only.
 
Year's_End's Avatar
 
Drives: '08 E92 335i
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: St. Pete, FL

Posts: 12,241
iTrader: (0)

I'm all for more engine selection for the consumer, and I'll always welcome another FI addition, but unless the new-gen Mustang's design and character is drastically different from the outgoing one, I just don't see a four-banger suiting the car.

It's like "yeah that's a great engine. Good numbers, good fuel economy, decently fast, etc... but you should've gone with the V8".
__________________
E92 335i: Space Grey|Coral Red|Aluminum Trim

Future Ride: 2015 Mustang GT Premium |Guard|401A|PP|Recaros|6MT
Year's_End is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-11-2013, 08:32 PM   #8
PINeely
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Drives: 2009 E90 N54
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS

Posts: 1,546
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Year's_End View Post
I'm all for more engine selection for the consumer, and I'll always welcome another FI addition, but unless the new-gen Mustang's design and character is drastically different from the outgoing one, I just don't see a four-banger suiting the car.

It's like "yeah that's a great engine. Good numbers, good fuel economy, decently fast, etc... but you should've gone with the V8".
I feel the same way. Bigger displacement and more cylinders is the philosophy which made muscle cars successful. Even if the new 4-banger turbo is technologically stunning and practical I don't think that it will sell as many cars as a V6 would. Instead I see people wanting to pay the extra for the V8 rather than suffer the stigma of having a 4-banger Mustang.
__________________
PINeely is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 09:01 AM   #9
Aventador97
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: Mustang Cobra and Mustang V6
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Kentucky

Posts: 214
iTrader: (0)

I read about this, if they bring the 4 cylinder back I hope that those numbers are true. It can only go up hill from the last 4 cylinder.
Aventador97 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 10:40 AM   #10
ragingclue
One cam is enough
 
ragingclue's Avatar
 
Drives: VF
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: mulletville

Posts: 6,774
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Year's_End View Post
I'm all for more engine selection for the consumer, and I'll always welcome another FI addition, but unless the new-gen Mustang's design and character is drastically different from the outgoing one, I just don't see a four-banger suiting the car.

It's like "yeah that's a great engine. Good numbers, good fuel economy, decently fast, etc... but you should've gone with the V8".
Well the next gen Mustang will be a lot lighter and have a properly implemented IRS, which should make it at least seem a lot more civil. As long as this doesn't mean Ford thinks it can take the Mustang upmarket, I'm OK with it. A turbo four could suit the new chassis well.

Who is going to miss the V6 in a Mustang anyway? With the volume Ford sells (do fleet vehicles count towards CAFE standards?), moving to a more efficient engine in a demographic where the customer likely won't give a shit either way is probably a smart move.

Now, if they were to replace the V8 with a TTV6, that's another story entirely.
ragingclue is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 11:49 AM   #11
PINeely
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Drives: 2009 E90 N54
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS

Posts: 1,546
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingclue View Post
Well the next gen Mustang will be a lot lighter and have a properly implemented IRS, which should make it at least seem a lot more civil. As long as this doesn't mean Ford thinks it can take the Mustang upmarket, I'm OK with it. A turbo four could suit the new chassis well.

Who is going to miss the V6 in a Mustang anyway? With the volume Ford sells (do fleet vehicles count towards CAFE standards?), moving to a more efficient engine in a demographic where the customer likely won't give a shit either way is probably a smart move.

Now, if they were to replace the V8 with a TTV6, that's another story entirely.
The thing is, I think that the customer WILL care. You're already talking about compromise with a muscle car on comfort, consumption, handling (usually) etc. People in the 60's made that compromise so they could have the big engines. Granted bigger displacements were used to net more power rather than turbos in that case and we are moving to a very turbo-friendly market. It's just that even if a turbo 4 puts up big numbers, you're taking away the displacement which is all the cars had to begin with.

In short, this engine makes too much sense to be in a muscle car. The fun of those cars is in the huge wailing block. Even with the rest of the car being engineered to suit the new engine, that engine doesn't suit a muscle car.

We are talking about people assumed to know the difference and have preferences however; its not going to phase the market share of high-school girls who drive the V6.
__________________
PINeely is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 12:37 PM   #12
ragingclue
One cam is enough
 
ragingclue's Avatar
 
Drives: VF
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: mulletville

Posts: 6,774
iTrader: (1)

I don't know, I just don't think the V6 crowd will care too much. Nobody cares about the displacement of the V6's and nobody was aiming real high when selecting the V6 anyway (I'm not trying to sound like a jerk there but it seems to be true in my experience). It's not replacing the V8, so the people who do care about power and displacement won't be affected in the least.

Ford is doing the right thing in dropping the V6 which no one cares about, and replacing it with something more efficient while not losing out on power. Plus, now you have tunability, which the V6es weren't exactly known for.

In fact, I think when they switch to the Ecoboost engine, interest in the car as base engine will go up, not down (assuming prices stay reasonably in line with what they are now).
ragingclue is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 12:53 PM   #13
flyinb501
Lieutenant
 
Drives: G35 Coupe, Dodge Ram
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Minneapolis, MN

Posts: 551
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingclue View Post
I don't know, I just don't think the V6 crowd will care too much. Nobody cares about the displacement of the V6's and nobody was aiming real high when selecting the V6 anyway (I'm not trying to sound like a jerk there but it seems to be true in my experience). It's not replacing the V8, so the people who do care about power and displacement won't be affected in the least.

Ford is doing the right thing in dropping the V6 which no one cares about, and replacing it with something more efficient while not losing out on power. Plus, now you have tunability, which the V6es weren't exactly known for.

In fact, I think when they switch to the Ecoboost engine, interest in the car as base engine will go up, not down (assuming prices stay reasonably in line with what they are now).
I think your analysis is spot on. The V6 mustang was pretty much worthless to everyone IMO. With the 4 you will get some attention from the tuner crowd and the people that don't care about power won't be affected.
flyinb501 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 12:54 PM   #14
Red Bread
Brigadier General
 
Drives: My wife's car
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Dallas, TX

Posts: 4,214
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Doesn't the current V6 redline under 6k? I know they used to, and that they've made recent improvements, so maybe it's less truck like, but it's not like they're replacing a great engine in the first place. There have only been two great V6's, the NSX and the GTR.
Red Bread is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 08:01 PM   #15
son_of_siggy
Lieutenant
 
Drives: CTS-V
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: United States

Posts: 414
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by flyinb501 View Post
I think your analysis is spot on. The V6 mustang was pretty much worthless to everyone IMO. With the 4 you will get some attention from the tuner crowd and the people that don't care about power won't be affected.
+1.

They're essentially opening the car up to two heavy aftermarket crowds now. The V8 guys, and the 4-cyl crew. Lots of opportunity.

The muscle cars were about speed. At the time, engine size was very linear to speed so the bigger engines usually won. However the Mustang (and a few others) began to change that with lighter cars and smaller displacement engines.

Now, we don't need the constant big engine size to stay competitive. Remember, forced induction IS displacement. It's just extra displacement on tap. It IS a bigger engine when you need it, and a smaller engine when you don't.

The V6 stang is usually for people who want the look, the name, the style, but don't care too much about the all-out performance. Nothing wrong with that, but I'm with the others who says they'll care little about going from a V6 to a turbo 4 that nets the same power and probably better MPG.
son_of_siggy is online now  
0
Reply With Quote
      03-12-2013, 09:41 PM   #16
Jamesons Viggen
Brigadier General
 
Drives: '98 M Roadster stg 2 S/C
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: New Jersey

Posts: 3,539
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Doesn't the current V6 redline under 6k? I know they used to, and that they've made recent improvements, so maybe it's less truck like, but it's not like they're replacing a great engine in the first place. There have only been two great V6's, the NSX and the GTR.
No, it's a Dohc with vvt. With the proper packages and rear end ratio it's a 13 second car trapping in the low 100's. Before the Coyote 5.0, those were GT numbers.
__________________
'98 M Roadster stg 2+ S/C @ 13psi(cracking 500hp this summer) +'13 EBII M Sport 328i 6mtFOR SALE
Jamesons Viggen is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      03-13-2013, 01:15 AM   #17
inspector gadget
New Member
 
Drives: chevy c6 corvette
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: USA

Posts: 23
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by son_of_siggy View Post
+1.

They're essentially opening the car up to two heavy aftermarket crowds now. The V8 guys, and the 4-cyl crew. Lots of opportunity.
Definitely. The V6 is just blah and not very responsive to tuning. An ecoboost 4 cyl however is the aftermarket tuner's wet dream.
inspector gadget is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:21 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST