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      03-01-2013, 06:31 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonCSU
I would venture to guess the higher sales number in February 2012 for the 3 series may have been attributed to people picking up the last of the E90's that would have been discounted with the F30 then hitting the dealer lots.
Makes sense, the C Class is also in its last year which is why it's picking up in sales, given the incentives over there at Mercedes.

Almost 7000 units, that's still a strong number for any car in the 3 series segment.
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      03-01-2013, 06:44 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Iron Man View Post
So I guess the blizzard didn't hit any Mercedes dealerships? Or Ford? Or GM? They all had decent sales increases last month.
Seems to be the go to excuse for car companies with lackluster sales in Feb...Honda/Acura using the "weather excuse" too.

That said, the most shocking here is the X3, IMO, but maybe the X1 is siphoning off some sales. Based on previous X3 sales, perhaps dealers aren't as willing to deal on the X3 and it hurt them this month, as well. There also must be some kick-a$$ deals for the X5 in its last model year.

The 3 doesn't surprise me too much, I guess. I actually like the looks of my E90 better, especially because of that line across the front of the hood on the F30. The interior is slightly better in the F30, however, IMO. Overall, not enough to get me to want to change and I'm wondering if others feel the same way and are just holding onto their prior model. If I remember correctly, sales of the F30 have been slipping for some time.
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      03-01-2013, 07:15 PM   #25
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Interestingly the C-Class outsold the 3 in Feb. 2013 with 7,302 sold vs. 6,973 3-Series. You wouldn't know it by how many you see on the roads. But maybe I look for BMWs more?

The ATS already outsells the A4. 3,382 vs. 3,089
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      03-01-2013, 07:21 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by tony20009 View Post
Last I heard BMW was at the top of the luxury sales market. When that's where you are, weather is enough to bring you down. Others may well see an increase simply because they were behind. You need to maintain sales to stay ahead.
Well they weren't number one last month and Mercedes had a 22.2% increase in sales, so I'm not buying your argument. Not sure why they aren't doing better, but my feeling is people are getting better deals on the C-class.
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      03-01-2013, 07:43 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CirrusSR22 View Post
Interestingly the C-Class outsold the 3 in Feb. 2013 with 7,302 sold vs. 6,973 3-Series. You wouldn't know it by how many you see on the roads. But maybe I look for BMWs more?

The ATS already outsells the A4. 3,382 vs. 3,089
Now that you mention it, I wouldn't be surprised if 3-series sales are suffering because of the ATS. It has had a lot positive media attention on how it handles.
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      03-01-2013, 07:45 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason View Post

IMO, it makes sense:

1er - old model. besides it never looked that good (headlights and some proportions are messed up) and a new 2er is coming out soon.

3er - new sedan has not yet grown on regular 3er buyers. That front is so-so and the rest looks like e90. Oh, and have you seen the price sticker? Another model in there is the coupe - old model (though still looks relevant despite LCI horrification process). In general, sales of 3er will go up next year (combined with 4er).

5er - cant believe some think it is the best looking sedan. not sure what is but 5er isn't (and I mean out of box).

7er - no comment. its a big car for big guys... Whatever they started making with it in early 2000's, they lost me. Before that it was "the car to own one day".

x1 - not surprised it is growing sales... it is actually a decently looking small SUV and priced ok.

x3 - if I was a manager over at BMW, the guy who accepted that design would get fired. Really? X3 never looked good but to continue making it look like a child's toy is just ridiculous.

x5 - not surprised it does well in sales dept. X5 is one of the best looking SUVs on the market. Aggressive enough, beautiful enough, properly proportional, and priced right.

x6 - that LCI killed it. not to mention it costs too much for what it is.
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      03-01-2013, 07:46 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Man View Post
Well they weren't number one last month and Mercedes had a 22.2% increase in sales, so I'm not buying your argument. Not sure why they aren't doing better, but my feeling is people are getting better deals on the C-class.
I agree. That's two months in a row the 3-Series performed poorly and I think BMW's pricing may have caught up to them. BMW is a couple thousand more expensive then the C-Class at base and that difference grows once you start adding on packages and options. And it doesn't help that the cars are the dealership are all optioned out costing 55-60k, at least that's what's appearing here in the GTA.

As for the ATS sales, that's got to hurt Audi having the A4 being outsold like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Man View Post
Now that you mention it, I wouldn't be surprised if 3-series sales are suffering because of the ATS. It has had a lot positive media attention on how it handles.
I don't think so. While it might have a very small effect, ever since the ATS release, the 3-Series sales have been pretty much consistent IIRC so there's not enough evidence to suggest that the ATS is causing the 3-Series to perform badly. I'll have to check the numbers again to be sure.
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      03-01-2013, 07:49 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 宝马.e90 View Post
Now to find Mercedes numbers...

Mercedes's 22,040 vehicles vs. BMW's 21,311. Not bad but Mercedes had another positive month with the C-Class. Interesting to see that cars where BMW is up, Mercedes is down and vice versa.
I think the auto industry is hurting (up to this point in the year) across the board. Let us hope it improves as the year gets on ..

As for BMW and Benz ... I have one of each and love them both (depending on the weather Dry and or sunny days it's the M3 wet and snowy days it;s our C-Class 4Matic.
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      03-01-2013, 08:06 PM   #31
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My opinion: the new 3-series and 1-series just don't look as good as the Benz offerings.
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      03-01-2013, 08:22 PM   #32
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To me the F30 doesn't have the magic BMW feel of the previous versions. The drivetrain is brilliant, but it doesn't feel as connected to the road as the older versions. Chassis dynamics and feedback are not the same as in the good old days. This is why I loved BMWs. I thought I'd never shop for another brand - and now I'm not so sure.

They're in danger of losing their core buyer. What a shame.

For the true faithful, it was never about how they look. It was about how they drive.
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      03-01-2013, 08:53 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midlifecrisis View Post
To me the F30 doesn't have the magic BMW feel of the previous versions. The drivetrain is brilliant, but it doesn't feel as connected to the road as the older versions. Chassis dynamics and feedback are not the same as in the good old days. This is why I loved BMWs. I thought I'd never shop for another brand - and now I'm not so sure.

They're in danger of losing their core buyer. What a shame.

For the true faithful, it was never about how they look. It was about how they drive.
Electric power steering is the culprit here
Sure it saves 1-2mpg, but at what cost?
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      03-01-2013, 08:56 PM   #34
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F30 sales are down vs last year of the E90?
That's very worrying news
It's their biggest money maker
So when you sell less of them, it's not looking very bright
And the newer versions (3GT) aren't going to reverse that slide
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      03-01-2013, 08:57 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midlifecrisis View Post
For the true faithful, it was never about how they look. It was about how they drive.
maybe, but the few don't make the sales numbers. I think 3er BMW got so popular b/c of the few faithful and the looks. Yes, for the masses the car has to look good. Now, if the car looks good and drives good, its a hit and this is what 3er used to be. Every other car in the segment tried to reach that popularity and some are finally close/did - C, A4, and ATS. Soon Jaguar will release their competitor made of aluminum. So, while competition got more serious, F30 got lame and overpriced. I truly think BMW lost the edge with their 3er. I also expect the LCI to be "all we can do to improve" kind of Cycle. I wish BMW well, they are not far off and have the experience and tech to get back on their feet. Hope they find the way to do that before the faithful leave them for good.
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      03-01-2013, 09:13 PM   #36
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You guys all hit the nail on the head RE: the 3 series. The ATS and C-Class are just sexier cars. Also, BMW's marketing sucks. Their commercials are so dorky. BMW is riding on the legacy of the BMW brand name - but in this society that doesn't mean as much anymore. People want to get value for their dollar - not a cheap looking car for $50,000... However, in the higher-end categories, they are still putting out drool-worthy vehicles. I just hope their strategy of further fragmenting the lineup (1,2,3,4,5,6,7 series) is a wise one - personally I think it's gonna further confuse new buyers. While it's great BMW gets a lot of return customers, they need to be taking business away from the competition. It's gonna be tough to do that with lackluster advertising and luke-warm magazine reviews.
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      03-01-2013, 10:51 PM   #37
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Yeah honestly I am not suprised. I think the look of the new 3 series and 1 series is a step back from the previous models.
The E92 had a lot of road prescence with its simple but attractive style.

And the old 1 series hatch was reasonable. The new 1series hatch is just disgusting to look at - seriously BMW have to do something about it cos the new A-Class = WIN.

New Merecedes GLA class could be a good one too and will take X1 sales.

New CLA class looks very nice and is at an attractive price point.

I predict 2013-2014 will be Benz's year.
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      03-01-2013, 10:57 PM   #38
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      03-01-2013, 10:57 PM   #39
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I guess it is easier to find fault with BMW strategy retrospectively.
If F30 is so bad dynamically, how can you justify increased sales of 5 series which looks like a 7 series, bloated and heavy.
I doubt sales of cars are determined by enthusiasts no matter how vocal they are. You will find enough mainstream buyer who did not buy e90 because of small size and stiff suspension.
New F30 is targeted more towards mainstream buyers with its larger size (which I love) and softer suspension (which I hate)
I think the biggest letdown of F30 is its price especially with the options (which every luxury buyer expects ) which can easily goes into 50s even when not fully optioned. There is hardly any price difference b/w 335i and s4 when fully optioned.
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      03-01-2013, 11:03 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alext View Post
My opinion: the new 3-series and 1-series just don't look as good as the Benz offerings.
Have to say the new Benz offerings are better looking for cheaper, things have caught to Bmw if they do nothing they will be dethroned.
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      03-02-2013, 12:43 AM   #41
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I didn't see many F30s in my area until a few months ago - silver and grey 328s so I thought maybe sales were finally picking up. Then I took my e92 in for service this week and when I got there first thing in morning to drop off mine and pickup a loaner car - first 2 loaners lined up were silver and grey. I dont think it was a coincidence. I couldn't wait to get my e92 back. Like previous poster said 50k for a 4 cylinder that also drives like a camry ? - no thanks.
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      03-02-2013, 02:21 AM   #42
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Have to say the new Benz offerings are better looking for cheaper, things have caught to Bmw if they do nothing they will be dethroned.
Actually MB has already dethroned BMW if you look at the real numbers.
Reason is BMW numbers include cars that are sold to the dealer but the cars are sitting on dealer lots. MB numbers mostly are cars sold to customers and hence are registered vehicles.

http://www.bimmerfile.com/2013/02/26...e-us-for-2012/
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      03-02-2013, 02:27 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by 宝马.e90 View Post
I agree. That's two months in a row the 3-Series performed poorly and I think BMW's pricing may have caught up to them. BMW is a couple thousand more expensive then the C-Class at base and that difference grows once you start adding on packages and options. And it doesn't help that the cars are the dealership are all optioned out costing 55-60k, at least that's what's appearing here in the GTA.

As for the ATS sales, that's got to hurt Audi having the A4 being outsold like that.



I don't think so. While it might have a very small effect, ever since the ATS release, the 3-Series sales have been pretty much consistent IIRC so there's not enough evidence to suggest that the ATS is causing the 3-Series to perform badly. I'll have to check the numbers again to be sure.
Actually I don't think Audi is hurting at all. The A4 is in it's second last year of this platform while the ATS is new for one and second is that the A4 sales has actually gone up. So has most of it's other models.

http://www.marketwire.com/press-rele...rd-1763112.htm
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      03-02-2013, 06:23 AM   #44
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Quote:
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Looks like X1 ate the X3 sales
Exactly my thought as well.


Quote:
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I would think the X1 stole 3 series sales more than X3. The X3 is really a different market in terms of size.
If mere size puts the X1 in a different market than the X3, then certainly adding the completely different form factor and utility of the 3 series to the equation does the same and then some.

Obviously it impossible to know the truth for certain without conquest numbers, but to me the more significant cause for the X3s decline in sales is its little brother. The lower 3 series sales can be partly attributed to the fact that last Februaries numbers were bolstered by a pent up demand waiting for the new car, especially given that the E90 had been out of production for months by then.
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