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      02-20-2013, 04:24 PM   #1
drakar99
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Thumbs down M3s OUT OF ALMS!

Is anyone else upset with BMW Motorsports for switching to Z4s (?!) in the American Lemans Series?! The ALMS series was pretty poor last year with low entry counts, etc, but this move will make it worse...at least for M3 owners. Who cares about Z4s anyway?? Not many people buy them. I may be cancelling my trip to Sebring.
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      02-20-2013, 04:29 PM   #2
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I think the Z4 looks bad ass. Who cares as long as it out performes every other brand?

Relax, when the new M3 comes out, they will switch back; it's only because the E9x is nearing extinction.
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It's one thing for some buffoon to put an M badge on something that doesn't deserve it...it's another for a multi-billion dollar corporation to do the exact same thing and keep a straight face.
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      02-20-2013, 04:34 PM   #3
drakar99
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It can't outperform the Corvettes and Ferraris.
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      02-20-2013, 05:12 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drakar99 View Post
It can't outperform the Corvettes and Ferraris.
comparing apples to oranges a bit.
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It's one thing for some buffoon to put an M badge on something that doesn't deserve it...it's another for a multi-billion dollar corporation to do the exact same thing and keep a straight face.
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      02-20-2013, 05:20 PM   #5
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Indeed. Which is why the Z4s shouldn't be there.
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      02-20-2013, 05:35 PM   #6
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except the Z4 GT3 have been doing awesome in Europe..
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      02-20-2013, 05:55 PM   #7
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Just going to have to wait and see
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      02-20-2013, 06:00 PM   #8
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I'm with you - people want to see THEIR make and model out there - but balking won't make any difference at this point.

The bigger argument is why'd they screw up so bad with the Z4!? Super soft and no M model is shortsighted, in my opinion.
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      02-20-2013, 06:01 PM   #9
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They made the switch to be competitive, which is more important than keeping the M3 in the series.

The M3 has been pushed to the limit and in recent years, could not keep up in the straights (due to regulations and whatnot).

http://www.bimmer **********/content.php?2585-ALMS-2012-BMW-blames-new-technical-regulations-for-the-4th-and-8th-place-finish-at-the-2012-Mosport-Grand-Prix
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      02-20-2013, 06:43 PM   #10
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I don't understand why it matters as the "m3" they use is really very little alike to our m3's. The z4 is also so different than a stock z4 that it comes with a stroked s65 engine which clearly is not even available.
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      02-20-2013, 06:52 PM   #11
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I suspect the turbo POS motor that will be in coming M3 would not be able to survive a race, let alone be competitive. BMW is an eco-freindly brand now meaning, they will submit to the pressure of government CAFE regulation. When you do this there you create engines that are anything but, race worthy.
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      02-20-2013, 10:17 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3takesNYC View Post
I don't understand why it matters as the "m3" they use is really very little alike to our m3's. The z4 is also so different than a stock z4 that it comes with a stroked s65 engine which clearly is not even available.
+1, I'm surprise how many ppl doesn't understand this either. People, switching to the Z4 doesn't matter one bit. Yes, there's some minor chassisn and aero development, but all other parts on the car will be retained from the old M3.

In GTC (or whatever the GT class will be called now) these cars are built from the ground up as race cars. Yes a M3 or Z4 is no match against a Corvette and Ferrari in real life, but b/c this is regulated class racing, the Z4 will be evenly matched against cars in its class. They all have the same power to weight ratio, achieved by intake restrictors and weight restrictions. All brakes and tires are the same specs. In fact, this is one main reason why the Corvette ran the 5.5L engine instead of the 7.0L stock engine is as it's easier to conform to the max HP rating for the GTC class. This was due to the contraction of the old GT1 and GT2 classes in ALMS. GT1 ran higher hp, lower weight, more heavily developed cars.

As I recall, the Z4 used in Europe thus far has used the exact same M3 GT2 V8 and lots of the same parts. Essentially, it's the same car. Additionally, although the motor is the S65, it's very loosely based on the S65B40 in our cars. I would wager likely less than 10% of part commonality.

BMW made the switch for 2 reasons. Marketing: The E92 is at the end of it's life cycle and thus marketing cycle. They decided the Z4 should be marketed in the gap between the E9X M3 and F-Series M4.
Modifications to GTC rules: as someone has pointed out, the rules are starting to weigh against the M3 chassis which were originally designed for the old GT2 rules. But since then, they've contracted GT1 and GT2 classes.

That simple.

Last edited by mdosu; 02-20-2013 at 10:26 PM.
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      02-20-2013, 10:21 PM   #13
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i think its pretty cool and have always loved the z4m coupe. the alms version looks sick. it is kind of nice to turn on the tv and see my car, sort of, running out there but what mdosu says is right, this time. its brand placement and nothing more.
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      02-20-2013, 10:25 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drakar99 View Post
It can't outperform the Corvettes and Ferraris.
no, by definition of the GTC class, Corvette = Ferrari = new Z4 GTC car = Lotus Evora GTC = 997 RSR etc etc etc.....


All the same power to weight ratio. Restricted aero rules and all sorts of requirements.
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      02-20-2013, 10:28 PM   #15
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i think its pretty cool and have always loved the z4m coupe. the alms version looks sick. it is kind of nice to turn on the tv and see my car, sort of, running out there but what mdosu says is right, this time. its brand placement and nothing more.
THIS TIME?

lol. anyways, I've been watching ALMS religiously for the last 6 years. I finally went to my first race last year in the Baltimore street race. LIFE CHANGING EXPERIENCE. If you haven't attended an ALMS race, you're missing out.


http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=739257
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      02-20-2013, 10:29 PM   #16
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Smart response

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Originally Posted by PrimoM3 View Post
I'm with you - people want to see THEIR make and model out there - but balking won't make any difference at this point.

The bigger argument is why'd they screw up so bad with the Z4!? Super soft and no M model is shortsighted, in my opinion.
Well said. And an owner with a frozen white version knows!
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      02-20-2013, 10:30 PM   #17
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Here's the press thread:

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=803072
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      02-20-2013, 10:42 PM   #18
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did you chase off that hater guy?
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      02-20-2013, 11:40 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdosu View Post
no, by definition of the GTC class, Corvette = Ferrari = new Z4 GTC car = Lotus Evora GTC = 997 RSR etc etc etc.....


All the same power to weight ratio. Restricted aero rules and all sorts of requirements.
GT class actually.

GTC class has the likes of the gt3 cup car.
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      02-21-2013, 12:26 AM   #20
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It's actually GTE

And news of this switch has been LONG out there, so this truly shows OP's dedication to this motorsport

The Z4 chassis IMO can take it to the Vettes and Ferraris. It is lighter by 86 pounds, is 5.1" lower to the ground in overall height, shorter length wise by ~1 foot and a bit wider.

It is going to be a nimble car.

If you don't like the change because they went away with the M3 then you're not a true fan.

PS - The Z4 stock chassis has always had a stiffer torsional rigidity than a stock M3.

Long live the M3, but I can't wait to see this beast run. Really disappointed they canceled Mid-Ohio. I got awesome shots:





Mid-Ohio E92 M3 by M0nk3yy31, on Flickr
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      02-21-2013, 08:55 AM   #21
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Quote:
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GT class actually.

GTC class has the likes of the gt3 cup car.
Right, I can't keep up with the name anymore, they're changing every few years
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      02-21-2013, 10:47 AM   #22
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I have never been. I'm missing out.
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