BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > M3 (E90 / E92 / E93) > M3 Photos/Video/Media Gallery
 
INDustry distribution
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-11-2013, 02:22 PM   #45
bnombe
Second Lieutenant
 
bnombe's Avatar
 
Drives: '12 E92M3 6MT/ZCP/JetBlkFoxRed
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver, BC

Posts: 232
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by RingMeister01
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sauce View Post
This isn't correct. Initially you are taught to have one smooth turn in and to move the wheel as little possible. However when you actually start going fast and the car starts sliding around under you, quick movements, even what most people would call sawing at the wheel become necessary.

Here, this is an AWD car on slicks at a very high speed track, so the car is much more settled on the power than the M3 in that video, however on entry especially, you can still see what I mean:
+1 Moving the steering wheel as necessary to keep the car in direction while sliding. Look at drivers like Fernando Alonso and Ayrton Senna, while qualifing the cars dance on approach and exit. May not be the most effective style over an entire race but one lap sprint its fastest.
Thanks for putting it into the context and that's what I understand and agree with as well. Wonder if the MDM is engaged in this lap or it's all driver and no computer in the DSC.

By the way, I wasn't implying the driver left time in his lap that would have put the M3 any significantly quicker around this attacking lap. Just though to ride on the track driving style discussion
bnombe is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2013, 03:01 PM   #46
Curt2000
Colonel
 
Curt2000's Avatar
 
Drives: '13 ///M3
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sin City

Posts: 2,409
iTrader: (21)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM

Right. Another video to reinforce that point. And yep, the vette time is remarkable.

The sawing through the esses

That was crazy...I felt uncomfortable just watching it! I'm pretty sure my life would have flashed before my eyes between 1:08 and 1:15 had I been in the passenger seat.
__________________

Current Car: '13 SANTORINI BLUE E92///M3--6MT/Speed Cloth/ZCP (ED Thread)
Former Cars:'10 E90 335i MSport / '07 Interlagos ///M5 / '09 135i / '10 E93 335i
Instagram: @C2KMotorsports
Curt2000 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2013, 05:41 PM   #47
FormulaMMM
Major
 
FormulaMMM's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Midwest

Posts: 1,291
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnombe View Post
Thanks for putting it into the context and that's what I understand and agree with as well. Wonder if the MDM is engaged in this lap or it's all driver and no computer in the DSC.
DSC is definitely off.
__________________
DCT E90 M3: Akrapovic Slip-On, Stoptech ST-40 Front + Pagid RS29 | Stock Rear + Stoptech SP, Apex EC-7 18x10 ET25 + Nitto NT01 275/35/18 (for track), tbd...
Past: Velos Designwerks Tune, Megan Racing Catback then Akrapovic Evolution, Macht Schnell Filter
FormulaMMM is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2013, 08:59 PM   #48
SBRIAN
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: e93
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SOCAL Anaheim

Posts: 49
iTrader: (0)

Where is GTR?
SBRIAN is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2013, 10:29 PM   #49
Sauce
Lieutenant
 
Sauce's Avatar
 
Drives: Montego 135
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Studio City

Posts: 527
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM View Post
Right. Another video to reinforce that point. And yep, the vette time is remarkable.

The sawing through the esses

Leh is the F'ing man. That GTR in that video was on all season tires!!!!!!! While we're on the video thing..



Quote:
Originally Posted by bnombe View Post
I dunno... it was my thought too that it wasn't very smooth attacking driving (not saying I am any smoother or quicker whatsoever). I think the above point: "when you actually start going fast and the car starts sliding around under you......" indicates when someone is actually over-driving the car. Also when the car slides around so much (there was a lot of that in this video) and abrupt correction, times are lost. Just my 2 cents

That is not true, cars are actually fastest at a certain slip angle, ideally all tires at the same angle. Overdriving for the most part reference someone overloading only two tires i.e.: oversteer or understeer. Either end of the car sliding in a direction different than the intended line is when you will lose time, not when all four are sliding on that line. When all four tires are sliding the car is obviously extremely on edge, requiring quick abrupt corrections to keep them at the same degree of slip. Check out the video of the M3 i posted at the bottom, it's the perfect video for this discussion. Same car, STICKIER tires and not just a pro driver, one of the absolute best in the USA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RingMeister01 View Post
+1 Moving the steering wheel as necessary to keep the car in direction while sliding. Look at drivers like Fernando Alonso and Ayrton Senna, while qualifing the cars dance on approach and exit. May not be the most effective style over an entire race but one lap sprint its fastest.
In Ayrtons day of F1 this was very, very true. Modern F1 cars, and just downforce cars in general, are now producing so much downforce that the cars really just snap and slides are avoided at all cost. Gradual decrease of mechanical grip is a much different thing than a sudden loss of aero grip.


One last video then im done lol!!! This is another of Leh Keen, however he is actually driving an M3 on Pilot Sport Cups. Pay attention to his entries for the most part, he gives it its initial turn in and as the brakes are released the car actually requires ZERO steering many times.

__________________
KW V3's, Sparco Pro2000's, Vorshlag CP's, JB4, Heat Wrapped Raceland DP's, aFe stg. 2 Sealed Intake, Miro 111's, Hankook RS3's 225/245 (for now), Seibon M3 CF Hood, Turner Motorsports Alum. Radiator, Big Tom IC, BMW Performance bumper.


Last edited by Sauce; 02-11-2013 at 10:36 PM.
Sauce is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2013, 10:42 PM   #50
klammer
Brigadier General
 
Drives: 11 spc gry m3 e90, 07 X5
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: chicago

Posts: 3,232
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sauce
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM View Post
Right. Another video to reinforce that point. And yep, the vette time is remarkable.

The sawing through the esses

Leh is the F'ing man. That GTR in that video was on all season tires!!!!!!! While we're on the video thing..



Quote:
Originally Posted by bnombe View Post
I dunno... it was my thought too that it wasn't very smooth attacking driving (not saying I am any smoother or quicker whatsoever). I think the above point: "when you actually start going fast and the car starts sliding around under you......" indicates when someone is actually over-driving the car. Also when the car slides around so much (there was a lot of that in this video) and abrupt correction, times are lost. Just my 2 cents

That is not true, cars are actually fastest at a certain slip angle, ideally all tires at the same angle. Overdriving for the most part reference someone overloading only two tires i.e.: oversteer or understeer. Either end of the car sliding in a direction different than the intended line is when you will lose time, not when all four are sliding on that line. When all four tires are sliding the car is obviously extremely on edge, requiring quick abrupt corrections to keep them at the same degree of slip. Check out the video of the M3 i posted at the bottom, it's the perfect video for this discussion. Same car, STICKIER tires and not just a pro driver, one of the absolute best in the USA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RingMeister01 View Post
+1 Moving the steering wheel as necessary to keep the car in direction while sliding. Look at drivers like Fernando Alonso and Ayrton Senna, while qualifing the cars dance on approach and exit. May not be the most effective style over an entire race but one lap sprint its fastest.
In Ayrtons day of F1 this was very, very true. Modern F1 cars, and just downforce cars in general, are now producing so much downforce that the cars really just snap and slides are avoided at all cost. Gradual decrease of mechanical grip is a much different thing than a sudden loss of aero grip.


One last video then im done lol!!! This is another of Leh Keen, however he is actually driving an M3 on Pilot Sport Cups. Pay attention to his entries for the most part, he gives it its initial turn in and as the brakes are released the car actually requires ZERO steering many times.

Awesome videos and thank you for the great explanations love the way he passes the Porsche on a turn and then pits
__________________
mods: akra evo, dinan 3.45 diff, ess akra tune, dinan stg.3, Alcon bbk, HRE P40
klammer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:13 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST