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      11-19-2012, 11:42 AM   #23
Alan l.
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Ah thanks for clearing that up. Any advantages/disadvantages to either setup?

Debating if i should try out the M5 tire size on my 19" M351 (8.5" all around). Oem spec calls for 245 40 19" tire while the M5 front wheel is 19x9 which calls for 255 40 19" tire. I like the fact of having more sidewall for winter roads and i don't think it would cause any issues with the bigger diameter since the front and back will be the same. Another member here is rolling on 7 series size wheels/tires on his F10 without issues. I am just worried that the tire will look really square/chunky on a 8.5" wheel.
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      11-19-2012, 11:58 AM   #24
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based on some tire tech talks, directional is better in the wet condition (more design in mind for rear wheel drive vehicle) for bettering traction.
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      11-19-2012, 03:51 PM   #25
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The directionals are Porsche specific I believe. No reason they couldn't be run on any car though.
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      12-01-2012, 11:21 PM   #26
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Any updated thoughts on the tires? I want these for my E46 M3 but they don't come in 225/40/19. I think I'm gonna have to go with Blizzak LM-60s.
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      12-02-2012, 12:10 AM   #27
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No snow or ice but I am very impressed with the road manners, responsiveness, and especially wet traction. Lots of rain here lately and I have massive amounts of confidence in the wet, including standing water. Hydroplane resistance is excellent in a straight line. Noise is almost nonexistent. I'm thrilled with these tires for winter use so far. I'm tempted to drive up into the mountains to try some snow, but sand and salt are pretty rough on the way up there.
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      12-02-2012, 10:22 PM   #28
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Thanks for the quick response! It would be cool if these were available in the size I need.
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      12-02-2012, 10:23 PM   #29
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Skiing was decent today so I took the plunge and drove my M into the snowline up Stevens Pass. This drive is on a winding 2 lane highway and today there was a torrential downpour followed by fast falling snow. The road is in modest shape but due to the water volume, standing water was a regular threat at lower elevations while up higher, the snow was thick and slushy until the pass, where it was covering the road and parking lot. I had mostly traffic free road on the way up so I took advantage of it and despite the driving rain, I was flying. 100-120mph happened a few times very briefly. oops

I have driven this road dozens of times in my last car, a highly modified WRX with Pirelli Sottozero's for winter, and I had much more confidence with the M3 and Michelin PA4's. These tires are planted so firm in cool wet weather it's downright rediculous. In the thick slushy snow, I was able to blast through lane changes with controllable slop and no loss of traction. I passed basically everyone including the 4x4s and subies. I could get the rear end to step out if I was abrupt on the throttle, but loss of traction was progressive and controllable, never harsh. In the parking lot, there are some small hills and the snow is icy and slick. I was able to move slowly up and down the hills without any issue while I looked for parking and never had wheelspin.

Driving into the mountains is my absolute favorite thing to do and I do it often in summer and winter. This drive was my first in my M3 on winter tires in winter weather and it was so much fun. I'm 100% sold on these tires and can't imagine finding anything better for my driving.
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      12-18-2012, 02:58 AM   #30
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What spacers did you use? I was seriously considering a/s setup but finally made up my mind on dedicated winter setup around pa4s and either miros or avant gardes.
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      12-19-2012, 01:15 AM   #31
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See post 13
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      12-22-2012, 12:34 AM   #32
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I put about 1,800 freeway miles on the PA4s just before Thanksgiving, driving from Oregon to Minnesota.

245/40/18 & VMR 701 wheels.

These are great tires for dry and high speed, yet cool/cold conditions; even got up to 145 MPH on the American Autobahn in Montana! I encountered a little bit of snow and ice on the streets of Butte, MT, where the tires performed admirably with excellent traction and stopping control.

I've only used Michelin tires on three different vehicles over the past few years and the PA4s are continuing my confidence in the brand.
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      12-27-2012, 10:38 AM   #33
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I'm running PS A/S Plus tires and they were sliding around more than expected in a couple inches of snow when I got caught out in a storm. I know they're not dedicated winter tires but curious if other people have had this same issue. Does turning DSC off help in snow (have heard this helps with some other cars)?
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      12-27-2012, 05:21 PM   #34
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If I may, I like to add a couple of comments of real driving experience with the PA4 today in Toronto, Ont, Canada.

We just had a 15m snow storm past thru overnite and it was my first real snow encounter driving my M5 with PA4 on the local roads, almost unploughed. The overall traction for the tires are actually pretty good, but the car's dynamic traction control needs to kick in many, many times to help the tires to gain some grip on the pavement. I did not get stuck in any situation but I must say I need to disengage the 'MDM' system so that the DTC will not engage the brake as often as I like to.

Overall, I am satisified thus far even though it's only 1 real test run to-date.
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      01-04-2013, 02:08 AM   #35
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Last weekend I had Mike Benvo add his tune as well as Euro MDM and I took him out for a rainy night spin here in Seattle. The new MDM is awesome and let's the driver get much more aggressive. I had one or two nice tail out 50mph sweepers and was again thrilled at the level of predictable control these tires offer as well as grip when I didn't want to slide. Mike enjoyed the ride and was impressed by the tires, given the conditions.

BTW, the BPMSport tune is excellent!
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      01-05-2013, 04:59 AM   #36
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Great thread! Will be getting these tyres soon.
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      01-20-2013, 03:43 AM   #37
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Well we have had some snow in the uk, not a lot but enough to test these in. In cold conditions my PA4's have been great. Excellent grip and makes driving in icy cold conditions feel safe.

In the snow they are unbelieveable, i just had to see at what point i could lose traction as normal driving did not see any dramas at all. The tyres performed as though there was no snow!

Foot to the floor sees some traction control but also rapid acceleration in a very controlled way. I can not recommend these tyres highly enough and the added safety margin they give over normal summer tyres in cold/snowy conditions is worth buying them for.

You have to really push them to lose grip.

Cheers

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      01-20-2013, 01:52 PM   #38
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http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article...No-Problem.htm
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      01-20-2013, 04:13 PM   #39
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Thanks for the reviews, I will try these as my next set.
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      01-20-2013, 11:10 PM   #40
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I've been up to the pass a few times now in icy wet and light snow conditions with packed snow in ski area parking lots and I've yet to be wanting for traction. The only time I slipped a little was in 4-5 inches of fresh snow over packed snow in the parking lot going up a slight incline but there was no way I was going to get stuck. Great tires!
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      01-23-2013, 01:06 AM   #41
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How much do these spacers and hub centric rings needed cost? I'm also looking at replica wheels 2
18 x 8 et20 on with245/40/18 for 2009 e92
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      01-23-2013, 02:57 AM   #42
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Spacers:
http://www.europeanautosource.com/pr...pacer-kit-12mm

Hub rings you can get cheap plastic ones on ebay or aluminum ones on ebay or at Discount tire. The plastic polycarbonate ones could melt in extreme use (track) but I'm not worried about that for winter driving.
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      02-03-2013, 11:17 PM   #43
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any rubbing at full lock at all? I know you can stuff a big tire in there but didn't know if the winter et20 offset made any difference there or not.
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      02-04-2013, 01:17 AM   #44
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No rubbing. Even with the low offset, the tire is actually a little more inset than my summer wheels with wider rubber.
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