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      12-01-2012, 07:09 AM   #1
AJ_MO
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DCT or Differential issue!

Hi! I wanted to expose my problem to you all hoping it can be usefull. My 2008 E93 DCT has 92k km, it's hard driven everyday and I have done already 30k km since March when I bought it, so it's a hero considering that is a 420cv NA high performance machine.

Issue:

-When the car is driven in DRIVE mode and you slow down while cruising in 5,6,7 gear and you don't full stop but take off again slowly, when the DCT dowshift to 2nd gear the DCT hesitate and when engage the 2nd gear a "clunking" noise comes from the rear of the car and the car shakes...this happens only in DRIVE mode, when set to manual the car is perfect and the gear changes are perfect without any problem.

-ONLY IN DRIVE MODE and in 7 gear the car vibrates a little over 120km/h (near 65mph) and there is a faint whining coming from the rear (BMW Service says it comes from the gearbox but I still hear it from the back) of the car everytime time you are not on the gas pedal.

BMW Service have checked the differential and it seem to be ok, the computer says there is no error codes, they reseted the clutch and the DCT program. They have no idea of what could be, but the BMW dealer of my city have really bad reputation for the after sale service. Next week a BMW Tech it's coming from Munich and I have an appointment with him. I have BMW Premiun Warranty, I hope they figure it out fast because the problem get worse everyday that's why I'm not using it until they fix it...but after 2 days of using the SUV I already miss my M!

You guys have any idea/experience with this kind of problem?

I already did a research in the forum and I only founded a similar problem but there was no conclusion.

Sorry for my english.
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      12-01-2012, 08:00 AM   #2
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Sorry to hear about this OP, Glad to hear you have a warranty. Keep us posted!
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      12-01-2012, 10:56 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ_MO View Post
Hi! I wanted to expose my problem to you all hoping it can be usefull. My 2008 E93 DCT has 92k km, it's hard driven everyday and I have done already 30k km since March when I bought it, so it's a hero considering that is a 420cv NA high performance machine.

Issue:

-When the car is driven in DRIVE mode and you slow down while cruising in 5,6,7 gear and you don't full stop but take off again slowly, when the DCT dowshift to 2nd gear the DCT hesitate and when engage the 2nd gear a "clunking" noise comes from the rear of the car and the car shakes...this happens only in DRIVE mode, when set to manual the car is perfect and the gear changes are perfect without any problem.

-ONLY IN DRIVE MODE and in 7 gear the car vibrates a little over 120km/h (near 65mph) and there is a faint whining coming from the rear (BMW Service says it comes from the gearbox but I still hear it from the back) of the car everytime time you are not on the gas pedal.

BMW Service have checked the differential and it seem to be ok, the computer says there is no error codes, they reseted the clutch and the DCT program. They have no idea of what could be, but the BMW dealer of my city have really bad reputation for the after sale service. Next week a BMW Tech it's coming from Munich and I have an appointment with him. I have BMW Premiun Warranty, I hope they figure it out fast because the problem get worse everyday that's why I'm not using it until they fix it...but after 2 days of using the SUV I already miss my M!

You guys have any idea/experience with this kind of problem?

I already did a research in the forum and I only founded a similar problem but there was no conclusion.

Sorry for my english.
Yes...i had the same problem...THE SECOND GEAR LAG..well knowed on this
forum,i had an update from my BMW dealer here in Belgium to 233-E
and now it's just perfect,also the DCT shifts faster and the ///M3 pulls better,but i had never the clunking noise .

Last edited by ///M Power-Belgium; 12-01-2012 at 11:02 AM.
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      12-01-2012, 11:31 AM   #4
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I hope that the specialist from München will be able to pinpoint the issue for you, it certainly does not sound right from what you described in your post.

If all fails I would consult another dealership in a near by city such as San Marino or Venice I'm sure they let you have a loaner while they investigate and / or correct the issue.

Good Luck

PS. Small town BMW dealerships are not the best to handle such issues also I would not put too much hope in the so called specialist form München, I speak from personal experience from past issues with my former Bimmers.
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Last edited by Mr. ///M3 RD; 12-01-2012 at 11:33 AM. Reason: added PS
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      12-04-2012, 03:32 AM   #5
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The DTC was upgraded with a new program and the cluth was reset to a new position...the cluncking noise and the hesitation in 2nd gear have gone away...but the vibration still happening some times! "The super mega tech" is not coming til next week...but he thinks (by what they told him by email) that should be a clutch issue (of course...clutch is out of warranty)...but its just a supposition!
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      12-04-2012, 04:28 PM   #6
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"Resetting the clutch position."

What is this exactly?
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      12-06-2012, 10:21 PM   #7
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      12-06-2012, 11:08 PM   #8
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Whining noise? Maybe a wheel bearing?

I have a similar issue in drive. In D2, if I come to a corner and brake the car is slow to kick down to 2nd. I have to wait. Not a big deal though...I'll get it looked at someday.
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      12-12-2012, 04:54 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sensi09 View Post
"Resetting the clutch position."

What is this exactly?

Well they explain to me that because of the clutches wearing, the attack point of the clutches is slighly different so the computer sets the right point. By resetting the DCT program, it establish a new point of jointure.

I left the car this morning, the Tech tried together with me and obviusly there was a little hesitation to 2nd but NO CLUNKING noise or any shaking ...but he was surprised because of the vibration over 120km/h...the gas pedal, the steering and if you put a hand over the ashtray there is the same vibration constantly...by the face he did I'm probably getting a new trasmission...but he just told me to leave the car that he will look at it.
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      12-12-2012, 08:04 AM   #10
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Have you tried changing the diff fluid? Some diffs will make noise IF the person who broke in the drove the car faster than 170 kph (and HARD!) during the break in period.

I would change your diff fluid and use the special BMW diff fluid with "+FM" (friction modifier, booster). Castrol SAF-XJ +FM, bmw part #83 22 2 282 583 SAE 75W-140 SAF-XJ + FM BOOSTER


Castrol SAF-XJ + FM BOOSTER, bmw part #83 22 2 282 583...
Name:  RdifFM.JPG
Views: 923
Size:  183.9 KB

regular Castrol SAF-XJ diff fluid... (sold thru out Europe and BMW Zentrums over here)
Name:  RdiffNOfm.jpg
Views: 1146
Size:  61.6 KB

BMW NA uses this +FM diff fluid to quiet diff noises at low speeds. But its mostly for low turning speeds. Like say for a U-turn or when parking. Still... changing your diff fluid won't hurt anything. You should have it changed every 45K miles or third oil change.

I do not believe that the +FM fluid is used in Europe. Only for us cranky and complaining US guys! lol So I would special order some and see IF it gets rid of your diff noise.

CORRECT 1M Fluids List [Engine, Transmission, Differential
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=620282



The other thing you might want to do is change your transmission fluid. I don't buy into BMW's lifetime fluids.

I am not sure about the DCT trans(code) that the M3 uses, but I bet these guys would know which ZF trans fluid you should use. They also sell filter changing kits and have some good ZF documents on their site.

CTSC... ZF Lifeguard fluids....
http://www.thectsc.com/index.php?p=c...parent=56&pg=1


Sounds like having your car's SW(software) update has fixed 90% of your woes.
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      12-12-2012, 08:28 AM   #11
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Hi! They change the diff oil in the last service less than 2000km ago...but I don't see in the bill the transmission oil change so maybe they didn't change it. I'll ask about it!

And you're right...they didn't put any +FM in the diff! Just the Castrol oil...and believe me in the US clients get a HUGE better treatment thant in UE!

Thanks!
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      12-14-2012, 04:31 AM   #12
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Ok...yesterday after work BMW Dealer delivered me the M. The Assistance Foreman tells me to wait for the BMW Super Mega Tech when I ask him what's happening with my car...the tech arrives and tells me that after testing the car:

He THINKS that the clunking noise IS NORMAL.

About the vibration over 120km/h...was a front left inner seal of the hub bearing broken.

I have two others friends with DCT M3...I meet with one of them this morning for breakfast and ask him to try his car...his 2010 M3 doesn't do the "NORMAL" clunking.

I just talk to my dealer Assistance Foreman and he agree with me saying that it can't be normal, so he already send the sound record to BMW Italy headquarter and see what they say.

Well at least I solved 1 issue...
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      12-14-2012, 08:32 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ_MO View Post

Well at least I solved 1 issue...

One down one to Go! You really need to keep their feet to the "fire" so they fix your car.


I think you should really try the "+FM booster" fluid in your diff. Why not ask your dealer what they think? And they could change the fluid for you for free. Heck even with you paying for the diff fluid, its not that expensive. Probably under 150 euros for parts and labor.

IF you do put the "+FM booster" in your diff.... you will need to do about twenty RIGHT and LEFT turns in a parking lot at almost full lock to coat the LSD clutches with the fluid. Then drive the car for a few hundred miles before it fully takes effect. Once its used on a LSD, you should always use this fluid for the life of that diff.


Q). Have you ever had any work done on the rear diff or center drive shaft? Has the driveshaft ever been taken off? Or the flex disc(Guibo)?

Q). Has the vibration always been there? Or has it started all of a sudden?
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      12-14-2012, 09:01 AM   #14
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Quote:
Q). Have you ever had any work done on the rear diff or center drive shaft? Has the driveshaft ever been taken off? Or the flex disc(Guibo)?

Q). Has the vibration always been there? Or has it started all of a sudden?
Hi!

A1: I don't know...I bought the car used with 60k km on March...but it was fine and has always been till now.

A2: The vibration started after the last service done by them 2000 km ago with also new OEM pads. (I think they just mess up something!)

Anyway...the dealer is still saying me that there is no problem with my diff (and they should be right) but I already order the +FM for the diff and some trans oil just in case...the shop that take care of my track car is going to do all the oil change...they already changed the silent blocks and did a really nice job even if they have never work on a E93 M3 before, but at least they have 30 years of racing experience, grease and steel knowledge!

Thanks for the advice!
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      12-14-2012, 10:03 AM   #15
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Keep us upto date. Gladd you have premium warranty. That should keep the costs down on your side
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      12-14-2012, 10:04 AM   #16
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Is that the only BMW dealer in your area?
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      12-18-2012, 10:06 PM   #17
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Guys this comes up all the time. Happened to me and hundreds of e46 and e90 m3 owners. The clunking at low speeds, especially when changing momentum (ie slowing down then quick forward acceleration at low speeds) this is completely absolutely normal and simply a noisy differential sound. They can do the "thicker" diff fluid but didnt help me.

The only thing people should rule out is a loose/broken diff bolt. If those are fine than this is totally normal. I experience this every day each time I slow down in a parking lot and then a very quick stab of the pedal and release it than it will clunk

in conlclusion, rest east, get your car home and drive and enjoy!
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