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      11-04-2012, 02:59 PM   #1
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Seriously, how important is the last NA high revving V8 M3?

Everyone talks about the M3 being the last NA high revving M and last V8 M3 all the time, but in reality how important is this when the new M3 comes out and/or couple years later? Will the E9X always be the one? Or people are just going to forget about it and jump on the new M3? Seriously, how important is the last NA high revving V8 M3 to you guys?
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      11-04-2012, 03:22 PM   #2
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i don't think the E92 will fair any better than its predecessors despite the switch to forced induction because of the high number of units produced. I do predict E90 M3 values to skyrocket however but i may be a bit biased.

This car being the last of the NA engined M cars will only have significant meaning if BMW keeps making turbo cars. If they switch back to an NA I-6 motor for the M3 after the next one then I don't think the V8 era cars will get any appreciable bump.

anyways, its silly to worry about these things. If you love the current car and test drive the new one and love it more then switch. if you hate the thing, well keep your E92.

I drove the F10 M5. I got the turbo lag to rear its ugly head in just 4 minutes of driving it. I can't stand turbo lag. The instant torque was nice, but I could tell i would get bored with such a heavy car very quickly. The F80 M3 with 1000 lbs less girth however might be an entirely different story! I'm hoping for a fun ride. Maybe i'll get one in a coupe and keep the E90 sedan so i can enjoy both.
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      11-04-2012, 03:27 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by eNCore View Post
Will the E9X always be the one?
It's Neo. E46 is the Oracle.
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      11-04-2012, 03:36 PM   #4
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It's important in some respects, not so much in others.
I bought now because I wanted to experience the M3 at it's peak. It's most perfect form as a racecar daily driver. Sure the new one will be faster, more powerful, have slightly better fuel economy, be more gadgety, but it won't feel like a thoroughbred driver's car. I'm sure it will be excellent, but I wanted the last hoorah gas guzzler V8 F1 inspired engine. I'll be driving this one for years to come.

For those that bought the E9x M3 because they thought it would hold value better and want a collector or investment car, that seems pretty dumb and I don't think there are many of those folks out there.
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      11-04-2012, 03:40 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eNCore View Post
Everyone talks about M3 being the last NA high revving M and last V8 M3 all the time, but in reality how important is this when the new M3 comes out and/or couple years later? Will the E9X always be the one? Or people are just going to forget about it and jump on the new M3? Seriously, how important is the last NA high revving V8 M3 to you guys?
That's sort of asking a airplane pilot: How important are wings to you guys?




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      11-04-2012, 03:47 PM   #6
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How important is the E30 M3?

Granted that car was made in significantly smaller numbers, I think the E9x will have a similar cache, in 20 years.

If BMW continues to make turbo M3s for the next 3 generations, and the poorly-maintained E9x M3's get weeded out due to age, we will see our cars held in a similarly high regard in the future.

I'm keeping this car for the next 2 decades and we'll see what happens.
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      11-04-2012, 04:01 PM   #7
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It's really inconsequential to me..........just like "the last high revving inline6", etc. I could really care less. As long as the ///M performs as it should, whether its engine is NA or FI doesn't matter. I'll likely end up with one of the new FI M3's at some point anyway.
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      11-04-2012, 04:28 PM   #8
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For some (such as myself), the engine was the deciding factor to get this generation M3 now vs the next gen. The new turbos (including M5) still have quite a bit of lag and the sizes of these newer M cars are making them less fun to drive. There are only a couple engines in the world that have/had the same linear power delivery and rev characteristics of the S65/85. Will be interesting if the sheer production numbers (esp the E92) will render the 'special' factor a moot point in the future, or if similar to Porsche and the last of the air-cooled engines, whether some sort of desirability/collector/'end of an era' status materializes over time.
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      11-04-2012, 04:41 PM   #9
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Collector value mean nothing to me. I bought my car to drive and enjoy. I'm not rich enough to let it in a pristine condition in the garage for 30+ plus years. When the new M3 comes out, I will test drive it. But I will get a new car before then, and it's looking more and more like a Porsche S. We shall see. I will have paid off my M in February of 2014. I will keep it for all the awesome moments it has given me.
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      11-04-2012, 04:42 PM   #10
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It all depends on how "good" the new M3 is going to be...but for now I am babying and taking care of my V-8 e92..b/c I do think it has the potential for its depreciaton to stablize and even appreciate further down the line.
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      11-04-2012, 04:58 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
It's really inconsequential to me..........just like "the last high revving inline6", etc. I could really care less. As long as the ///M performs as it should, whether its engine is NA or FI doesn't matter. I'll likely end up with one of the new FI M3's at some point anyway.
This is 98% of current /M owners.
But that 2% are keeping the price of the E30 M3 appreciating still.
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      11-04-2012, 05:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IL8Apex View Post
How important is the E30 M3?

Granted that car was made in significantly smaller numbers, I think the E9x will have a similar cache, in 20 years.

If BMW continues to make turbo M3s for the next 3 generations, and the poorly-maintained E9x M3's get weeded out due to age, we will see our cars held in a similarly high regard in the future.

I'm keeping this car for the next 2 decades and we'll see what happens.
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      11-05-2012, 01:04 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eNCore View Post
Everyone talks about the M3 being the last NA high revving M and last V8 M3 all the time, but in reality how important is this when the new M3 comes out and/or couple years later? Will the E9X always be the one? Or people are just going to forget about it and jump on the new M3? Seriously, how important is the last NA high revving V8 M3 to you guys?
I would say that the E92 will have a particular following but it won't have a major effect on value.

I have an 88 Mustang 5.0 5 speed. This whole debate came up when Ford switched to modular motors and did away with the pushrod 302. The car began appreciating around 05. So now, instead of kbb value of around $1500 it's worth around $4000 on a good day. Financially the difference is negligible. It's not high end or rare and it will never appreciate the way the old late 60's or early 70's era cars appreciated.

The E30's have a following and they are more rare now but they're not fetching unrealistic dollars. Someday they may. One big warning to thinking of the E92 as a collector item is the gadgetry. Rebuilding a 30 year old E30 wouldn't be anywhere near as expensive as replacing all of the sensors on a 20 year old E92.
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      11-06-2012, 08:28 PM   #14
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I don't own an e92, yet, but the whole premise for buying that car is that v8. (of course the chassis and looks count too)

M3s will always have that balanced chassis, good handling, and practicality. But, as the newer cars come out, the M cars are losing what made them awesome in the first place, the MOTOR.
The new M cars are giving up the unique built 'special' engines that are powerful naturally aspirated and high revving for engines that are basically more powerful versions that are already used in other models, other 'normal' models.
What will make the next M3 motor THAT much better than the next 335i? (other than power output, which can be remedied just like people do now with turbo engines)

I am sure the F80 will elicit some awesome reactions, and I am sure that the lag will be minimal, but still. It will NOT have the same feeling as taking a NA engine high into the revs. Ask anyone who has chipped, tuned, and modded out a 335i. It is still not up to the same experience as the engine in the M3.

just my opinion of course

edit: oh yeah, forgot to answer the op
Yes, I would/will pay more for the v8 M3 in years to come, because as you stated, this is the last NA M car, the last and only M3 V8, and it will be missed by enthusiasts.

Last edited by mxa121; 11-06-2012 at 08:33 PM.
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      11-06-2012, 08:46 PM   #15
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Its important to me, because the way I see it the E9X M3 and E6X M5/M6 are one of a kind in M lineage. These three triplets are descendants of the BMW F1 era and inherited the most technology transfer IMO.

Bespoke engines and drivetrains and bangle era styling. Its a different kind of flash and glam compare to new and older M cars.

The new M5 already looks already wore off on me, and I am beginning to appreciate the E60 M5 styling more and more; its a lot more bold and evocative. The F10 M5 is more like a sequel to the E39 M5.

If the new M5 is any indication, I think the new M3 will pick up where the E46 M3 left off, making the V10 M5/M6 V8 M3 truly one of a kind chapter in M history.

Sure the E9X, E6X M cars had its flaws but I think those characteristics are part of the charisma. The engine and sound absolutely dominates the driving experience.
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      11-06-2012, 10:10 PM   #16
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I have never been a fan of turbo cars despite the prodigious amounts of torque that can be easily produced. Sure I want a certain absolute amount of speed capability, but my enjoyment of driving truly comes from how my mind and body interface with the car. Does the car, in all its aspects feel wired in to my own nervous system?

There is an inherent disconnect with turbo cars. The output of the motor just isn't totally in sync with what the driver does. It's like watching a movie where the sound is just off ever so slightly from the movement of the actors lips.

The current M3 V8 is so responsive and so linear. The baritone trumpeting of the eight cylinders with their own throttle body is an auditory orgasm for any car enthusiast. It is simply a feast for the senses.

I will always favor the highly tuned NA motor for the more enjoyable subjective driving experience, as well as for the appreciation of the engineering that went into it.
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      11-06-2012, 10:14 PM   #17
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I would trade my E92 for my old E46 M3 carbon black on cinnamon vert in like new condition or a factory fresh E30 M3. All great cars.
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      11-06-2012, 10:19 PM   #18
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I am dying to see what BMW's new M3 will offer.
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      11-06-2012, 10:20 PM   #19
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The fact that the E9x M3 is still winning comparison tests (Automobile mag the latest) vs its direct sedan/coupe rivals 5 years after its introduction and right before the next generation is released pretty much says it all. Would not be terribly surprised if the E9x will be billed as the more fun/engaging car to drive vs the F8x.
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      11-07-2012, 09:20 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhabs View Post
The fact that the E9x M3 is still winning comparison tests (Automobile mag the latest) vs its direct sedan/coupe rivals 5 years after its introduction and right before the next generation is released pretty much says it all. Would not be terribly surprised if the E9x will be billed as the more fun/engaging car to drive vs the F8x.
The outgoing M3 is, by all accounts, a very special car. It's a joy to own one and drive it every day. I won't be surprised if this car is held in the same high regard as the E39 M5 many years from now. The new M3/4 will surely outperform the current car, but with so much resting on the subjective feel of a car for many enthusiasts, they will be hard-pressed to produce a new car that compares in this respect to the cars we own.
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      11-07-2012, 05:37 PM   #21
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the current e9x m3's are fantastic cars, and my guess is that the f8x m3's will be as well. time and technology move on, and that keeps the lid on values for most of what becomes 'old' tech. i love my e92 m3, but some day down the road i would not at all care about selling it if the new one was a great car. i have no problems with turbos if they are well implemented, and from the sound of things bmw is really getting good at accentuating the pluses and minimizing the minuses from turbocharging.
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      11-07-2012, 07:41 PM   #22
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Let's see...

The first M3 was a racy NA four
The second was a fantastic, streetable (but not special) NA six (US version)
The third was a spectacular, if not particularly streetable (rough when cold, that type of thing), NA high revving six
The current is a racy, streetable, spectacular NA high revving eight.

I don't think any "last of a generation" arguments hold when there has not been any consistency, having said that, I think it's hard to argue this isn't the greatest of all of the M3 engines to date. Most HP, Most torque, highest revving, extremely responsive (not sure if most responsive, but it may be), and is lighter than the e46 (engine only).

Will the next be better, maybe (doubt it could be lighter with turbo and associated plumbing, and doubt it will be more responsive or as linear), but will be far superior at peak torque and HP.

At the end, only time will tell, in the meanwhile, 8400 RPM is just right for me!!!!
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