which should I go with? TCKline, Dinan, Ground Control or fit ZCP?

[BimmerRob08]

Fella's,

There is alot of info and lots of suspension kits out there I've been looking at, but I'd like to get your opinions for what I'm looking for. I know that in order to get max performance out of the suspension it required an entire suspension swop. That's not what I'm looking to do, that's beyond what I'll be using it for but I would like to improve the handling characteristics and lower it just slightly within reason from OEM. My M3 is an '08 so it does not have a competiton package.

What I'm looking for is a sleeve kit that meets the criteria below;

1.) Slight drop same as the ZCP or Competition package or abouts. Don't want to go slammed.

2.) Don't want to spend more than $2,000 estimated.

3.) Suspension kit that is EDC compatable as I don't want to get rid of the funcion, but I won't just go with lowering springs and screw up the ride quality or trash the shocks/struts.

4.) Mainly street use but occasional track use and mountain road spirited driving, so improved handling is the key hear.

5.) Direct fitment with no modifications. DIY friendly.

6.) Dealership alignment capable, if that's possible.

7.) Currently running with ARC-8 wheels but might switch to GTS 19" wheels, so a kit that will compliment these wheels.

8.) TCKline and other kits I'm sure have different spring rates, which spring rate is right for street/mountain type spirited driving and light tack use? I'm guessing something in the middle??? Not too stiff?

I know some use camber plates for better turn in and would compliment the set up and also is it practical to get new sway bars or just stay stock with the sway bars?

So with what I'm looking for, what do you guys suggest as an ideal suspension kit for what I'm looking for? Please, just serious intelligent answers. Thanks,

Rob

[THE TECH]

I would just get a good set of springs.

[BimmerRob08]

Originally Posted by THE TECH

I would just get a good set of springs.

What about riding on the bump stops that I've read so much about? My understanding is that needs to be modified or changed with a lower one so not to bottom out on them and damage the struts. From what I've read, doesn't sound like what I'm looking for.

[THE TECH]

Originally Posted by BimmerRob08

What about riding on the bump stops that I've read so much about? My understanding is that needs to be modified or changed with a lower one so not to bottom out on them and damage the struts. From what I've read, doesn't sound like what I'm looking for.

I haven't personally had any issues. I run the E36 bumpstops on the front. Couldn't be simpler.

[Car54]

I'll have a GC EDC sleeve kit for sale once I get it back from being refreshed at Ground Control.

[slicer]

You will have the bump stop issue no matter what system you use that retains the stock edc shocks. There isn't much point IMO to getting an adjustable sleeve-over kit if you only plan to lower 10 mm. If you want the most mild drop, dinan is your answer. Dinan is however over priced. I would recommend eibach springs with e36 bump stops. I previously ran eibachs with OEM bump stops and did not notice any issues with them. Ride quality was good and height was conservative.

[Car54]

Originally Posted by slicer

You will have the bump stop issue no matter what system you use that retains the stock edc shocks. There isn't much point IMO to getting an adjustable sleeve-over kit if you only plan to lower 10 mm. If you want the most mild drop, dinan is your answer. Dinan is however over priced. I would recommend eibach springs with e36 bump stops. I previously ran eibachs with OEM bump stops and did not notice any issues with them. Ride quality was good and height was conservative.

ran...on a road course?

[THE TECH]

Originally Posted by Car54

ran...on a road course?

I believe he just means a previous suspension setup.

[slicer]

Originally Posted by Car54

ran...on a road course?

I had no track use with eibachs. Keep in mind that the sleeve-over kits allow for ride height adjustment and some allow you to choose your spring rates. These kits are not any more friendly to your edc shocks than a lowering spring. It seems like you are under the impression that lowering springs are harder on your shocks which not the case.

[slicer]

I should say that the sleeve-over kits allow you to corner balance the car. That is a plus for track use...

[Car54]

Originally Posted by slicer

I should say that the sleeve-over kits allow you to corner balance the car. That is a plus for track use...

And the sleeve kits come with camber plates. Springs + camber plates = $750ish...which is just about a sleeve kit new, and the cost of a barely used one...like I have.

If it's for looks only...just get a lowering kit, but if you want better function...you should grab another -1.5° of front camber with camber plates.

[slicer]

Originally Posted by Car54

And the sleeve kits come with camber plates. Springs + camber plates = $750ish...which is just about a sleeve kit new, and the cost of a barely used one...like I have.

If it's for looks only...just get a lowering kit, but if you want better function...you should grab another -1.5 of front camber with camber plates.

You can get -1.8 negative camber with stock suspension (if u pull the pins). An addition -1.5 would be usable on the track but I wouldn't recommend it on the street as you will burn through tires quicker.

To be clear - I don't have anything against sleeve-over kits. I would personally choose a sleeve over kit for my use because I would want to lower the car far more than 10mm. Plus the ability to adjust camber would be nice. There is no denying that it is great to have the extra flexibility of a sleeve-over kit. I recommended springs Because the OP seems to desire a conservative set-up.

[BimmerRob08]

Thanks fella's on all your inputs. I think a sleeve-over kit might be for me with the addition of the adjustable camber. I would adjust it to accomodate somewhere in the happy medium for street and light track use and minimze tire wear...if that is possible.

What Sleeve-on kits do you guys recommend then?

Cheers,
RB

[bigjae1976]

If you are keeping the OEM shocks, just do springs. I doubt that you'll be riding on the bump stops if you lower the car 10mm. If you are worried suspension travel, get the Dinan Stage I which provides new front and rear mounts which help gain a small increase in travel.

Sleeve over kits are a waste. The WHOLE point of a height adjustable system is to either corner balance the car or to slam the car as low as possible. Your car is stock and it comes optimally balanced, you don't want to slam the car...so what's the point?

I have the Dinan Stage II plus camber plates on a non-EDC suspension. It looks much better and turns in much nicer than OEM. Unless I'm on the track, I can't detect much of a difference in performance.

[BimmerRob08]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

If you are keeping the OEM shocks, just do springs. I doubt that you'll be riding on the bump stops if you lower the car 10mm. If you are worried suspension travel, get the Dinan Stage I which provides new front and rear mounts which help gain a small increase in travel.

Sleeve over kits are a waste. The WHOLE point of a height adjustable system is to either corner balance the car or to slam the car as low as possible. Your car is stock and it comes optimally balanced, you don't want to slam the car...so what's the point?

I have the Dinan Stage II plus camber plates on a non-EDC suspension. It looks much better and turns in much nicer than OEM. Unless I'm on the track, I can't detect much of a difference in performance.

I wonder if it would be best to order the ZCP shocks/springs, etc. But not sure if software can be changed to suit it? There is another member that did a ZCP re-fit and sounds like he likes it. Probebly expensive and not sure if its worth the money.

If I just add springs to drop it 10mm and change out the front bump stop, besides it'll look a little better, will it perform a bit better on twisty roads, track? I'm really not worried about regular street driving because I think it feels fine anyway and I drive it in comfort during regular street driving.

[bigjae1976]

I'd say that's a good plan. You'll see minimal gains on the track with any set of springs, IMO. My dinan stage 1 made very little difference if any. I would think about adding camber plates.

I think the OEM suspension is very good. If you want a significant improvement, you need to get new dampers.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by BimmerRob08

I wonder if it would be best to order the ZCP shocks/springs, etc. But not sure if software can be changed to suit it? There is another member that did a ZCP re-fit and sounds like he likes it. Probebly expensive and not sure if its worth the money.

If I just add springs to drop it 10mm and change out the front bump stop, besides it'll look a little better, will it perform a bit better on twisty roads, track? I'm really not worried about regular street driving because I think it feels fine anyway and I drive it in comfort during regular street driving.

Did you see the price for the ZCP struts and shocks...over $2k..ouch!!

Dave

[BimmerRob08]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

Did you see the price for the ZCP struts and shocks...over $2k..ouch!!

Dave

Yeah, not worth it then.

cheers,
RB

[CSanto]

I'm looking for the same thing as you.

Long story short. I'm still stock. I feel like if I'm going to upgrade the suspension it's a waste to spend 1k on something like a sleeve kit. Either keep it stock or really give it an upgrade (JRZ AST MCS Moton Ohlin) that sort of thing.

If it must be lower. Springs

[BimmerRob08]

Tough choice. I like the EDC function. I payed for it so might as well use it and for street driving, I like it. But for when it comes to handling for mountian type switch backs, light track use, the stock M3 is already awesome. I'd just like to compare to a competition package type. For an edge on performance handling and looks. If a sleeve kit will do that, then great.

There are no real good tracks around here to use its full potential anyways so just a slight drop and a little gain in handling is all I'm looking for. I' already running with RC-8 9" & 10" wheels that already give it a little wider stance. I might go with GTS 19" wheels too so a 1/2" drop would do it justice but I don't want to degreade the handling characteristics it already has.

[bigjae1976]

I think if you get a quality dual purpose coilover you'll find that it will be just as suitable for dual duty as EDC. The only kicker is you'll need to adjust settings on each corner vs. pressing a button.

I have the TC Kline S/D (x2 adj) with 600fr/700rr springs. Its pretty comfy for the most poart on the street and great on the track. I could have gone with 500fr/600rr springs but its more of a track machine now.

I could be very wrong about this but I've personally found that the rebound adjustment has the biggest impact on comfort.

[BimmerRob08]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

I think if you get a quality dual purpose coilover you'll find that it will be just as suitable for dual duty as EDC. The only kicker is you'll need to adjust settings on each corner vs. pressing a button.

I have the TC Kline S/D (x2 adj) with 600fr/700rr springs. Its pretty comfy for the most poart on the street and great on the track. I could have gone with 500fr/600rr springs but its more of a track machine now.

I could be very wrong about this but I've personally found that the rebound adjustment has the biggest impact on comfort.

Cool! Well that makes sence I think about the rebound and comfort association. I'll have to give it some thought.