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      08-12-2007, 06:24 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by ///Murdock View Post
335 vs M3 no chance in any category...

and who are u to say to M5 is on its way out....

i've read smarter posts before.

i'm going to try and respond to your bumbling post without making myself look as asinine as you've managed to.

1) the title of this thread is "if M3 comes in too expensive, what would your next car be?". my answer was my 335i. no where in there did i mention anything about comparitive performance figures. that was your assumption. and in case you didn't know assumption is the mother of all F-ups. i'm not about to turn this thread into another one in a litany of 335i vs M3 threads.

2) who am i to say the the M5 is on its way out?? i'm me, an informed active particpant on this board... you must be that other guy. the current generation e60 m5 was released in 2004. in a few months, it will be in its 2008 MY of production. production on the e60 is set to cease in 2010. do the math. the car has only a few more years left in its lifecycle. it's on its way out.

if you want to get off on the right foot with this board, you should consider losing your derisive and antagonistic attitude.

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      08-12-2007, 07:21 PM   #46
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Does anyone know if 911s come with the 4 years free service deal BMWs come with?

Nope I dont think anyone but Bmw has this..

You looking at porsche too?

My husband (more his idea) and I are looking at the 911 c2s, Tho it is a great deal more than the M3, my whole point was to look for a comfortable/performance car which I could keep for a long while (just really hate buying cars..) and porsche speaks for itself. Not to mention they are for sale right now.

The M3 wait is soo long.. Mabey even longer for me ,not even in top 5 for my 2 deposits (I was looking for a new car since mid 06 :mad but to wait another year and after reading the 335 board for nearly a year and some experiences from friends etc.. bmw's dont sound all that reliable, 1st year bugs more likely but still..

Thats why Im in contact with several Porsche dealers recommended by some folks over at Rennlist and my porsche crazy brother looking into a C2s.

Anywho thats my pick in case the m3 is too expensive, I know Im kinda going in the wrong direction pricewise... But I look at it like this. Its what you get for your money that counts and 65k-70k+ base is too much for a M3 imo. In reality tho Its more the long wait than anything else. So Im gonna wait till october, I need a new ride asap!!

Where is the us price/release info? come on bmw!!
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      08-12-2007, 07:32 PM   #47
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i know this isn't most folks idea of an alternative since the two cars are quite different but i'd seriously look at the Cayman S. In fact I'm seriously looking at it regardless of the M3 price. I won't make any decisions until i've driven the m3 though.
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      08-12-2007, 07:38 PM   #48
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i know this isn't most folks idea of an alternative since the two cars are quite different but i'd seriously look at the Cayman S. In fact I'm seriously looking at it regardless of the M3 price. I won't make any decisions until i've driven the m3 though.
Porsche knows the mid-engine layout of the Cayman will smoke the 911 if both had the same engine, and it doesn't want to destroy the brand image of the 911, so it will not ship the Cayman with enough power. In other words, the Cayman and the Cayman S are underpowered.
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      08-12-2007, 07:38 PM   #49
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i know this isn't most folks idea of an alternative since the two cars are quite different but i'd seriously look at the Cayman S. In fact I'm seriously looking at it regardless of the M3 price. I won't make any decisions until i've driven the m3 though.
Id say thats a great pick as well. I test drove one just a week ago, great car but I need room for my 2 doggies.
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      08-12-2007, 07:42 PM   #50
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Nope I dont think anyone but Bmw has this..

You looking at porsche too?

My husband (more his idea) and I are looking at the 911 c2s, Tho it is a great deal more than the M3, my whole point was to look for a comfortable/performance car which I could keep for a long while (just really hate buying cars..) and porsche speaks for itself. Not to mention they are for sale right now.

The M3 wait is soo long.. Mabey even longer for me ,not even in top 5 for my 2 deposits (I was looking for a new car since mid 06 :mad but to wait another year and after reading the 335 board for nearly a year and some experiences from friends etc.. bmw's dont sound all that reliable, 1st year bugs more likely but still..

Thats why Im in contact with several Porsche dealers recommended by some folks over at Rennlist and my porsche crazy brother looking into a C2s.

Anywho thats my pick in case the m3 is too expensive, I know Im kinda going in the wrong direction pricewise... But I look at it like this. Its what you get for your money that counts and 65k-70k+ base is too much for a M3 imo. In reality tho Its more the long wait than anything else. So Im gonna wait till october, I need a new ride asap!!

Where is the us price/release info? come on bmw!!
I fully agree. $60k+ base for the M3 would be too much. I can afford it, but I won't pay that much for it. 911S is supposed to be a great car. I haven't driven the S. On my to do list.

That said, I don't think the 911S is worth $90k out the door either. However, the nice thing about 911s in general is that you can pick up a 1-2 old car with very low miles (less than 10k miles) with warranty at a great discount, which is what I would do.
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      08-12-2007, 07:42 PM   #51
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Porsche knows the mid-engine layout of the Cayman will smoke the 911 if both had the same engine, and it doesn't want to destroy the brand image of the 911, so it will not ship the Cayman with enough power. In other words, the Cayman and the Cayman S are underpowered.

It does pretty well on a low speed track, autox vs the 911 with just an LSD added.

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I fully agree. $60k+ base for the M3 would be too much. I can afford it, but I won't pay that much for it. 911S is supposed to be a great car. I haven't driven the S. On my to do list.

That said, I don't think the 911S is worth $90k out the door either. However, the nice thing about 911s in general is that you can pick up a 1-2 old car with very low miles (less than 10k miles) with warranty at a great discount, which is what I would do.
Yeah I looked at some of the porsche approved used ones and have great prices etc.. But Im one of those who just cant buy anything used, I know $90k is alot but I plan to keep the car for a while so it evens out in my book
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      08-12-2007, 07:46 PM   #52
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It does pretty well on a low speed track, autox vs the 911 with just an LSD added.
Seat your husband on the passenger seat and try again unless he weighs 100lbs.

Actually, I was speaking in relation to the norm these days. If you can have much better power/weight ratio with the 911, then it would be worth it in my opinion.
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      08-12-2007, 07:46 PM   #53
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Porsche knows the mid-engine layout of the Cayman will smoke the 911 if both had the same engine, and it doesn't want to destroy the brand image of the 911, so it will not ship the Cayman with enough power. In other words, the Cayman and the Cayman S are underpowered.
i'm not drag racing. or racing at all for that matter. i'll be doing track days and autox in either car so handling, steering response and brake performance is far more important to me. I know porsche doesnt want to up-rate the cayman s but it's not a huge factor in my buying decision.
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      08-12-2007, 07:47 PM   #54
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Id say thats a great pick as well. I test drove one just a week ago, great car but I need room for my 2 doggies.
yeah we got the X5 for hauling the doggies around
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      08-12-2007, 07:49 PM   #55
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i'm not drag racing. or racing at all for that matter. i'll be doing track days and autox in either car so handling, steering response and brake performance is far more important to me. I know porsche doesnt want to up-rate the cayman s but it's not a huge factor in my buying decision.
I hear you. If you don't mind not having the power of the 911S, the Cayman would be great. I, on the other hand, want it all!
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      08-12-2007, 07:55 PM   #56
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Seat your husband on the passenger seat and try again unless he weighs 100lbs.

Actually, I was speaking in relation to the norm these days. If you can have much better power/weight ratio with the 911, then it would be worth it in my opinion.

LOL That would sure throw their pricing out the window, 3.8 cayman S..base price would be?

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yeah we got the X5 for hauling the doggies around
Yup have a minivan as well. But really an suv, truck or van? What fun is that?

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I hear you. If you don't mind not having the power of the 911S, the Cayman would be great. I, on the other hand, want it all!
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      08-12-2007, 08:40 PM   #57
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I dont know why you say worst dealer service. Compared to what?
Compared to BMW (Z4MC and 528i)... Honda (S2000), Chevy (Z06), and Mitsubishi (Evo)... we now have a new 997 GT3 so we'll see how that works out... but at 3000 miles there is already some sort of metallic creak in the GT3's PASM electronically adjustable suspension. I don't like taking a car like this in for dealer "service" so the tech monkeys can go out and play with it. But looks like we will have to have some warranty work done already.

In the JD Power surveys (I'm assuming that's where you got the #1 thing) new owners are encouraged to report "ALL 10's or I don't get paid my bonus" by their dealership! (kinda like BMW does) Also, did you know that the Porsche service department knows IF you gave them "ALL 10's" and may treat you a little different if you did not, on your next service visit. Ask actual Porsche owners about their experiences. And let's not begin about costs outside of warranty. 58K miles on our Boxster S (we each had one, but I sold mine) and $3500 for an ABS module! I don't really know what my point is here though, because the new M3 is bound to be just as expensive out of warranty as any Porsche...

Really, if you crave a Porsche, "there is no substitute" and they drive like nothing else (well, at least the Box-Cayman-GT3 does .. base 911 is not too impressive IMO) OTOH, these cars are not as bulletproof as some would like to think. But they are fun and if you want one, you should own one at some point.....
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      08-13-2007, 12:07 AM   #58
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As debated many time before on this forum, to bring a lesser BMW car to M standards, one would have to not only chip the engine, but upgrade the suspension, transmission, chassis, and beef up the structural components of the engine, and lose the warranty. So such “I can chip the engine for less” arguments are null and dull. Not to mention the 135 is one ugly car.
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      08-13-2007, 10:28 AM   #59
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True, but this would only apply to track racing...

I'm sure a Procede 335 would keep right up with an M3 on normal American stop and go (red light, green light) or highway racing. That's where most people are going to compete with their cars anyways.

How many are actually going to use the suspension, transmission and chassis upgrades of the M3 to their advanatage in normal American conditions? Or how many are going to join a race club and push thier 70K M3 to the limit? .05% maybe.
hmmm...not going away huh. if you want to go race in a straight line like most people as you infer, then what keeps you from buying the cobra? think about that for a second, and you'll realize why many of us will prefer the m3 over the others fine automobiles you've discussed. and if you've ever driven a "pricey" car out of warranty, you'll realize that the whole procede thing is a bit silly.

also, you really are the genius if you want a car for "normal American stop and go" or "highway racing." people buy cars for their own reasons, however too many good ones for not buying a car to do this.
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      08-13-2007, 11:27 AM   #60
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My alternatives are 335i or 135i. In both cases I would probably add an LSD, body kit (maybe not on the 135), rims and non-RFTs. Maybe some suspension mods eventually too.
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      08-13-2007, 01:59 PM   #61
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335 or S5. I've yet to see more S5 reviews though.... When is S5 coming out?


OT: Personally my second in line MB C63 AMG. but I'm hearing it's interior is cheesy (has a plastic feel)... hahaha
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      08-13-2007, 02:58 PM   #62
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I've concluded the M3 will be beyond me so it's a 335i coupe for me
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      08-13-2007, 03:58 PM   #63
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Ive made up my mind! Totally custom 2007 S2k fully built to either a stroked 2.7L 450hp N/A or 500hp Turbo S2k! If you guys want to look it up I will be doing a one off Amuse GT1 WideBody Kit. For the 60+k price tag I would have to pay for the ///M. I can make a race/street S2k that weighs significantly less (2800 lbs) that will look better be funner to drive and beat the ever loving life out of the ///M turns and all!

Cars are my passion and I am on a mission to make one of the baddest cars for under 75k.
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      08-13-2007, 04:29 PM   #64
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hmmm...not going away huh. if you want to go race in a straight line like most people as you infer, then what keeps you from buying the cobra? think about that for a second, and you'll realize why many of us will prefer the m3 over the others fine automobiles you've discussed. and if you've ever driven a "pricey" car out of warranty, you'll realize that the whole procede thing is a bit silly.

also, you really are the genius if you want a car for "normal American stop and go" or "highway racing." people buy cars for their own reasons, however too many good ones for not buying a car to do this.
I would if that was all I wanted in a car.

I was merely comparing a small aspect of the M3 and you took it like I was bashing the whole car and that one aspect was my only reason for wanting an M3.

There are obviously many other apects of the M3 that make it far more superior and that is why I am ordering one.

The M3 is not going to be perfect in all areas, but as a total package I believe nothing in that price range compares.
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      08-13-2007, 07:40 PM   #65
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Ive made up my mind! Totally custom 2007 S2k fully built to either a stroked 2.7L 450hp N/A or 500hp Turbo S2k! If you guys want to look it up I will be doing a one off Amuse GT1 WideBody Kit. For the 60+k price tag I would have to pay for the ///M. I can make a race/street S2k that weighs significantly less (2800 lbs) that will look better be funner to drive and beat the ever loving life out of the ///M turns and all!

Cars are my passion and I am on a mission to make one of the baddest cars for under 75k.

I love the S2000. One of its strong points is its reliability though.... R U sure you can add massive HP and keep the reliability on the track? My current track car is an '02 S2K. I'd take even a stock S2K over an M3 for the track any day! It's just more fun to drive and cheaper too! (tires, brake pads, rotors etc) Good luck on your project car.....


Back to the M3... if it's "too expensive"... I'll still want one.
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      08-13-2007, 07:41 PM   #66
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The M3 is not going to be perfect in all areas, but as a total package I believe nothing in that price range compares.
That about sums it up!
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