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      09-04-2012, 11:03 PM   #1
Caspita
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Bedding On The Way To Track?

Got some new Pagids in (rs19), but won't be able to install till a little later on this week. My track day is on Saturday, and was just wondering what the opinion was about bedding them on the way there, I will easily be able to do numerous 80-15 stops and a semi repetitive nature....which I figured should suffice. Any alternative thoughts I should be aware of?
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      09-04-2012, 11:13 PM   #2
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i usually do my bedding in prior to heading to the track but also do a modified bedding each time i head down as you stated. also on rs19s. shouldnt be a problem doing what you suggested.
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      09-04-2012, 11:19 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caspita View Post
Got some new Pagids in (rs19), but won't be able to install till a little later on this week. My track day is on Saturday, and was just wondering what the opinion was about bedding them on the way there, I will easily be able to do numerous 80-15 stops and a semi repetitive nature....which I figured should suffice. Any alternative thoughts I should be aware of?
The key is to keep it hot, so don't wait too long between stops. But safety always come first!
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      09-05-2012, 08:16 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by RLDZHAO View Post
The key is to keep it hot, so don't wait too long between stops. But safety always come first!
I was planning on doing 4 consecutive 80-15 stops....a couple minutes of regular highway driving to get some cooling, and then another 4 consecutive stops.
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      09-05-2012, 08:40 AM   #5
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The biggest problem is getting enough heat in the pad & rotor to get a good transfer layer on the rotor.I find that if I do not get enough heat during this process on the street I will will have brake shudder on track.I normally do about 7-10 applications from 180 kph to 50 kph with hard braking back to back with full acceleration to do this properly or wait and use my 1st session on track to do this.
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      09-05-2012, 08:44 AM   #6
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I don't bed my brakes on the street. They bed themselves naturally on the track. By the end of the first session, I've got a nice blue tint on my rotors.
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      09-05-2012, 09:13 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armyav8tor
I don't bed my brakes on the street. They bed themselves naturally on the track. By the end of the first session, I've got a nice blue tint on my rotors.
Me too
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      09-05-2012, 10:31 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armyav8tor View Post
I don't bed my brakes on the street. They bed themselves naturally on the track. By the end of the first session, I've got a nice blue tint on my rotors.
Agree only if you're using the same pads on both street and track. (ie) the rotors have already mated with the pads before, even if the "bed" layer has already worn off (and it will), requiring just a simple touchup, street or track.

If you switch between 2 different pad compounds then I think you have to do a formal and proper bed-in procedure to transfer like-material to the rotor face.

I've never felt like my first session at the track is worthwhile for doing this--heat up is too abrupt--maybe its just me and my over enthusiasm on the first big brake zone. I usually do about 10 controlled 70-10mph stops in rapid succession (late at night). Pagids and other race pads require a lot of heat to to do it properly, much more than street pads.

I have bedded them in driving to the track in the wee hours, but my car's so loaded down and crammed full of crap (4 tires/rims in the back seat, jacks, tools, tent, etc etc) that its a bit of a PITA! Prefer to do it ahead of time.
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      09-05-2012, 10:43 AM   #9
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I switch between the ST perf pads and PF01s. When I go to the PF01s, no issues. I do have to bed the ST pads after the PF01s...zero bite. Then after bedding the ST pads do fine.
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      09-05-2012, 10:51 AM   #10
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I don't know, I feel bedding is just a myth. When I was stock at the Nurburgring, I would bed the brakes (stock pads) on the Autobahn before going onto the Ring but the brakes warped up just the same (or uneven brake pad transfer if you don't believe the rotor can warp).

Since getting the PFC BBK, I have not done any sort of bedding. Basically, I switch out from my street pads to the PF01s before going to the track, drive to the track, and go crazy on the track. Drive home after the weekend is over, take the PF01s off and put the street pads back on. Done. The rotors look fine and there's hardly any wear, the pads are done after 3x HPDEs though. Maybe I'm missing something here but what I've been doing seem to work pretty good. VIR is not heavy on the brakes other than turn 1 and 14/14a. So maybe that is kind of the bedding in process because you brake hard at 1, it cools off and you brake at Oak Tree, it cools off and you brake at 14/14a, bedding process complete..... :P
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      09-05-2012, 02:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armyav8tor View Post
I don't know, I feel bedding is just a myth. When I was stock at the Nurburgring, I would bed the brakes (stock pads) on the Autobahn before going onto the Ring but the brakes warped up just the same (or uneven brake pad transfer if you don't believe the rotor can warp).

Since getting the PFC BBK, I have not done any sort of bedding. Basically, I switch out from my street pads to the PF01s before going to the track, drive to the track, and go crazy on the track. Drive home after the weekend is over, take the PF01s off and put the street pads back on. Done. The rotors look fine and there's hardly any wear, the pads are done after 3x HPDEs though. Maybe I'm missing something here but what I've been doing seem to work pretty good. VIR is not heavy on the brakes other than turn 1 and 14/14a. So maybe that is kind of the bedding in process because you brake hard at 1, it cools off and you brake at Oak Tree, it cools off and you brake at 14/14a, bedding process complete..... :P
My understanding is that bedding can help reduce wear on your pads and rotors. High temp pads work differently than street pads. Track pads rely on heat in the friction material and the pad kind of acts more like a sticky glue which grabs the rotor vrs a street pad which uses pressure against a hard friction surface. By bedding high temp pads and creating a thin layer of the pad material on the rotor disc, you improve performance and reduce wear.

I believe I got this from Zeckhausen.
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      09-05-2012, 03:46 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post
My understanding is that bedding can help reduce wear on your pads and rotors. High temp pads work differently than street pads. Track pads rely on heat in the friction material and the pad kind of acts more like a sticky glue which grabs the rotor vrs a street pad which uses pressure against a hard friction surface. By bedding high temp pads and creating a thin layer of the pad material on the rotor disc, you improve performance and reduce wear.

I believe I got this from Zeckhausen.
Thanks for refreshing my memory, I think I've read that article before. Anyway, my point was that after the first session at VIR, I get a good layer of brake pad material on the rotors. Which was why I said by the end of the first session, there is a nice blue tint on them. My theory is that the process happens naturally at the track. But I don't have much to back it up with other than my own experience at VIR.
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      09-05-2012, 10:54 PM   #13
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I think some street use is highly desirable, prior to bedding. I've read that you want to wear in the pads a little bit, so that they start to conform to the rotors (like 15-25 stops at city speeds). Otherwise, the pads will have microscopic hot spots when you start bedding them. I'm not sure what that does (pad glazing? increased rotor wear?).
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      09-06-2012, 04:31 PM   #14
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I often change my pads at the track in the morning while I install my track wheels. I go on a small side street and do a dozen hard brakings (80-20 mph) then drive slowly back to the padock to let them cool. Not ideal, but it has worked for me .
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      09-07-2012, 12:50 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caspita View Post
I was planning on doing 4 consecutive 80-15 stops....a couple minutes of regular highway driving to get some cooling, and then another 4 consecutive stops.
I think 4 may not be enough... especially for a race compound. And don't stick to a hard number because there are many variables involved (ambient temp, how hard you brake, prior layers, etc.) I've typically bedded my brakes until I can either A) see/smell smoke from the brakes or B) see a layer of transferred pad material on the rotors.

Excellent resource here: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=396763
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      09-07-2012, 10:31 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RLDZHAO View Post
I think 4 may not be enough... especially for a race compound. And don't stick to a hard number because there are many variables involved (ambient temp, how hard you brake, prior layers, etc.) I've typically bedded my brakes until I can either A) see/smell smoke from the brakes or B) see a layer of transferred pad material on the rotors.

Excellent resource here: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=396763

Have read and watched everything in the page linked, great information in there. It would be about 8 total, but I understand not to stick to a solid number....thanks for the input.
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      09-07-2012, 01:45 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drifty// View Post
I think some street use is highly desirable, prior to bedding. I've read that you want to wear in the pads a little bit, so that they start to conform to the rotors (like 15-25 stops at city speeds). Otherwise, the pads will have microscopic hot spots when you start bedding them. I'm not sure what that does (pad glazing? increased rotor wear?).

What the city driving does is clean the previous pad deposits off. Even after bedding, driving around town for a few weeks will scrub all the material off--just bare polished metal. It takes real heat to transfer pad material (burnish) to the rotor face. Cold brakes (city driving) will act as scrubbers over time.
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      09-07-2012, 01:58 PM   #18
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Not to mention street driving may tear up your rotors much faster. That was my experience with PF01s on e46 M3 euro rotors. The rotors wore out before the pads when I kept them on for street driving.
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