BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Track / Autocross / Dragstrip / Driving Techniques
 
ESS Tuning
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      09-05-2012, 01:16 PM   #1
M3crit
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: 2011 e90
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NY

Posts: 38
iTrader: (0)

noob looking to get into tracking my car

was wondering if anyone here has some advice for someone who has never driven on a track before but is really interested in doing so in the future. just a general question i guess, whats a good car to learn/start with? i have been thinking of trying to find an e36 that i can beat on vs. learning on my e90. also does it get crazy expensive to go? thanks in advance.
M3crit is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 01:29 PM   #2
Crimson92
Smiling Politely
 
Crimson92's Avatar
 
Drives: Like a boss
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Whales Vagina

Posts: 28,609
iTrader: (3)

Learn with your E90 just keep the nannies on and use the instructors, that's why they are there.

Yes, it can get crazy expensive. At the very minimum you'll have to pay for tires more often. It all depends on how often you decide to go.
__________________
Quote:
Some people are like slinkies...not really good for much but you can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs"
Crimson92 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 01:51 PM   #3
M3 Esq
Lieutenant Colonel
 
M3 Esq's Avatar
 
Drives: Fast
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CT

Posts: 1,542
iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Learn on the E90. The first couple times out you will just be learning the line, flags, etiquite, etc. It will be sensory overload. You shouldn't be driving hard enough to shred your tires or breaks your first couple times out.

Not sure what you are looking into, but for the CCA events all you will need is a brake fluid flush, inspection and Snell rated helment to get out. Also look into track insurance as you may not be covered under your auto policy. Be careful though, this can get addicting, and if you become addicted, it gets expensive.
M3 Esq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 02:01 PM   #4
apecush
Lieutenant
 
Drives: 2008 E90 M3
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Edmonton

Posts: 430
iTrader: (2)

If I did it again, I would have found a miata or something similarly underpowered, light, and cheap to develop my skills at the edge of control. Keep in mind that a faster car requires a quicker reaction time for corrections. If you track the E90, for the love of god keep DSC on at first. With MDM on, my DSC only really intervenes when I royally screw up.
apecush is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 02:03 PM   #5
radiantm3
Apex Everything!
 
radiantm3's Avatar
 
Drives: >1000 HP in my garage
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Danville, CA

Posts: 3,706
iTrader: (5)

Garage List
2011 E92 M3  [4.79]
2013 BMW X5M  [4.33]
+1 to the above posts. The most important thing is finding a well-run group that has proper instruction with a focus on safety. BMWCCA usually runs a tight ship. My first track day was with them and it was a great experience.
__________________
(1:40 @ Laguna Seca, 2:03 @ Thunderhill, 1:52 @ Infineon)
radiantm3 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 02:24 PM   #6
M3crit
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: 2011 e90
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NY

Posts: 38
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Team Plutonium View Post

And check your ego at the door... I ate a huge piece of humble pie when I went to the track the first time... and the time after.
haha My ego will be left at home, im not under the illusion im some kind of expert driver. you guys all have some great advice so far, thanks for the input.
M3crit is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 02:27 PM   #7
von_zoom
Captain
 
von_zoom's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Z06
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Carolina

Posts: 913
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Team Plutonium View Post
^ +1

...... I ate a huge piece of humble pie when I went to the track the first time....
I have no telling how many track days, and this is the way I begin each day at the track. Well said.
vz
__________________


Previous Track Toy
von_zoom is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 02:32 PM   #8
Crimson92
Smiling Politely
 
Crimson92's Avatar
 
Drives: Like a boss
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Whales Vagina

Posts: 28,609
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3crit View Post
haha My ego will be left at home, im not under the illusion im some kind of expert driver. you guys all have some great advice so far, thanks for the input.
That being said, respect the car and the cars/people around you and you'll be just fine.
__________________
Quote:
Some people are like slinkies...not really good for much but you can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs"
Crimson92 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 03:55 PM   #9
JZBE92
I poop at work to save money on toilet paper.
 
JZBE92's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 M3 SOLD, FR-S Monogram
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: SF Bay Area

Posts: 468
iTrader: (0)

my friend said that the track may have sound level caps.... so what do I do with an aftermarket exhaust? I don't want to spend the money and go all the way out there only to get turned away....
__________________
2012 JZB E92 M3 Coupe. DCT/ZCP. Paint Match IND Cosmetic Package, Arkym Bumper, Verstrabe Paddles, LUX Angel Eyes, Vorsteiner double sided CF CSL trunk lid, Evolve Valve Exhaust, 19x9.5 et 21, 19x10.5 et 22 TE37 SL Pressed Graphite
JZBE92 is offline   Taiwan
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 04:26 PM   #10
kornykidd0
Private
 
Drives: 2008 E90 M3
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Yardley PA

Posts: 87
iTrader: (1)

Tracking is fun. To go one or two times with the e90 won't hurt too much, but like others have said you'll get addicted and then it will hurt if you continue with the M...lots. If you leave MDM on the car is very forgiving and unless you are really being foolish you won't get into too much trouble in the beginner class.

It is a great way to learn what you can and cannot do in your car which is why I think it's a good idea to use that at least for now. You'll begin to understand how much grip your tires can maintain before you get into trouble which will translate over to the real world. Knowing how much your tires can take will help make you a better, more confident driver all around. If you get a specific track car, while great, you don't drive that on the road every day and it won't necessarily translate as well to your DD e90.
kornykidd0 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 04:35 PM   #11
Z K
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Z K's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: San Francisco

Posts: 1,969
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JZBE92 View Post
my friend said that the track may have sound level caps.... so what do I do with an aftermarket exhaust? I don't want to spend the money and go all the way out there only to get turned away....
Usually sound caps are just at places like Laguna Seca where there are residences near the track. If you head to Thunderhill or down south to Buttonwillow, there are no restrictions. Or if there is, it is pretty lax. Or you can always put on the stock exhaust or run a down-turn pipe.
Z K is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 04:56 PM   #12
Ilia@IND
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Ilia@IND's Avatar
 
Drives: F10 M5
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Chicago

Posts: 2,139
iTrader: (3)

Different courses have different standards for maximum db output, and also different degrees of enforcement. That question is best answered on a local forum, as the guys that drive your local track will know best what you can and can't get away with from an exhaust modification standpoint.

I would strongly recommend using track insurance, if you do choose to track an E9x M3. Your ultimate goal is to advance your driving skill and you'll be doing that by pushing yourself and your car to and past the limits. As you do that it is not enormously unlikely that you'll go off course and you may break a few things. Track insurance is a lifesaver here!

Of course, there is also some virtue in driving a cheaper, slower car as well. Learning with a car with a low power output can often improve your ability faster, as you quickly learn to really work the car in order to produce good results.
__________________
Ilia@IND is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 05:03 PM   #13
M3 Esq
Lieutenant Colonel
 
M3 Esq's Avatar
 
Drives: Fast
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CT

Posts: 1,542
iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by JZBE92
my friend said that the track may have sound level caps.... so what do I do with an aftermarket exhaust? I don't want to spend the money and go all the way out there only to get turned away....
Some tracks do have noise restrictions, just check with the track before you go. For example, Lime Rock Park has an 87db limit and they enforce it. Last event I was at a guy was spoken to about noise. He had stock exhaust and speculated it might be the whine of his supercharger. Go figure.
M3 Esq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 05:35 PM   #14
M3crit
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: 2011 e90
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NY

Posts: 38
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Esq. View Post
Some tracks do have noise restrictions, just check with the track before you go. For example, Lime Rock Park has an 87db limit and they enforce it. Last event I was at a guy was spoken to about noise. He had stock exhaust and speculated it might be the whine of his supercharger. Go figure.
i see you're from CT, im in the area. i went on their site to get more info about pricing and i saw $900+ for 4 hours? did i read that correctly or am i seeing things? i feel thats a bit much, but again with no prior expierence i really wouldnt know.. any thoughts?
M3crit is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 06:28 PM   #15
von_zoom
Captain
 
von_zoom's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Z06
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Carolina

Posts: 913
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3crit View Post
i see you're from CT, im in the area. i went on their site to get more info about pricing and i saw $900+ for 4 hours? did i read that correctly or am i seeing things? i feel thats a bit much, but again with no prior expierence i really wouldnt know.. any thoughts?
Yes, very expensive and out of line with most club sponsored events. Visit

www.motorsportreg.com

and I think that you will find many HPDE events which would be ideal for your first track adventure and cost effective. Try and locate one which will be close to your home, sign up for it, and have a fun time. Any event you register for the organizer will place you in the novice group and assign an instructor. Take your car. You will not need to do anything to your car (E90)except have it tech inspected before you go to the event. It will be fine for your first outing. Have fun, learn a little about what your car is about, and how well you will do. But be warned, this is an addictive sport.
vz
__________________


Previous Track Toy
von_zoom is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 06:40 PM   #16
Majdnoon
Welek Ya Kelb
 
Majdnoon's Avatar
 
Drives: 1998 E36 M3 Coupe
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: SoCal

Posts: 134
iTrader: (0)

I agree with what most of the people posted that, if you're going to do it only a few times a year, go with the E90 and be VERY careful and cautious with it. But if you are planning on making it a regular thing (which you will, soon as you try it you'll fall in love and look forward with a fevered passion for the next track day) but an old, beat-up E36 or something of the sort. Mine was 3K, has no AC and no radio no nothing but its great fun, light and nimble and agile, and it puts a smile on my face every time I get it. That can be your track beast, while the E90 remains your DD
Majdnoon is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 06:41 PM   #17
adc
Brigadier General
 
Drives: 2009 E90 M3 ED
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: MD/DC

Posts: 4,073
iTrader: (6)

Like others have suggested, I would start with CCA events and go from there.

Are you a CCA member already? If not, becoming one should be your number 1 step. Once you do, you automatically become affiliated with a local chapter. Local chapters organize and run HPDE's (driving schools) and you can see what events they run and at which race tracks.

The CT Valley chapter, Patroon Chapter, New York chapter and New Jersey chapter are all in your neighborhood as an example. Of course you are not limited to the events run by these groups, but rather by how far you want to drive to get to a track, as various CCA chapters run events all over the US.

As far as I know, CCA HPDE events are usually in the $175-200 per day, which buys you 4-5 x 20-25min track sessions, depending on the event. That is plenty time for a stock driver and stock car. They usually also include classroom instruction (mandatory) and some of them do wet skidpad exercises which is an incredible tool to learn car control at low speed.
__________________

2009 E90 M3 ED
2014 X1 28i
2000 Boxster
adc is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 06:50 PM   #18
M3 Esq
Lieutenant Colonel
 
M3 Esq's Avatar
 
Drives: Fast
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CT

Posts: 1,542
iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3crit
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Esq. View Post
Some tracks do have noise restrictions, just check with the track before you go. For example, Lime Rock Park has an 87db limit and they enforce it. Last event I was at a guy was spoken to about noise. He had stock exhaust and speculated it might be the whine of his supercharger. Go figure.
i see you're from CT, im in the area. i went on their site to get more info about pricing and i saw $900+ for 4 hours? did i read that correctly or am i seeing things? i feel thats a bit much, but again with no prior expierence i really wouldnt know.. any thoughts?
I have only run in BMW CCA sponsored events so I can't speak for other clubs, but the CCA sponsored events usually run about $300 per event. Where are you in NY? I ran with the Patroon chapter at LRP. They also run at Watkins Glen. Check out the patroon website or the CT Valley chapter website. They both have a lot of good info about their driving schools. Also, as mentioned above, check out motorsportreg. You can search for events nearest you. The CCA events are pretty structured so I would start there.
M3 Esq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 07:09 PM   #19
armyav8tor
n1smo
 
armyav8tor's Avatar
 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: North Carolina

Posts: 1,425
iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Don't worry about beating up the car if you are just starting out. You won't go very fast in the novice group. The M3 was designed with track in mind, so let it go out and have some fun. That's the good part about German engineering, they over engineer everything. I'm surprised my shocks have held up this long.
armyav8tor is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-05-2012, 07:58 PM   #20
Car54
Captain
 
Drives: 1999 Z3 Mcoupe | 2008 M3/4
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lutz, FL

Posts: 837
iTrader: (1)

Looks like Del Valley chapter has something coming up at Pocono....25th anniversary. www.motorsportreg.com
__________________

Craig Brickner
BM
W CCA/PBOC/Chin Motorsports DE Instructor
Click to Join: BMWCCA # 366493
Car54 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-06-2012, 01:01 AM   #21
CatchM3IfYouCan181
Private
 
CatchM3IfYouCan181's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 BMW M3 Alpina White
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: New York City

Posts: 73
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 BMW M3  [3.17]
You're in NY. A good place to start to work yourself up to track is Autocross and it can get a little expensive lF you get hooked.

For your first time, $50 fee for registration, bring a tire gauge, bring a cooler with water and a sandwich, don't worry about a helmet yet as they have loaners OR rentals for $5.00. You can ask for an instructor at the beginning of every run. Also, make sure to come early as in 7:30 early so you can walk the course as many times as you can.

Autocross is usually run in rented out parking lots of stadiums which are large enough to hold events and is not exactly being on the track but it develops your skills so that once you're on that "scary track" for the first time, it'll actually feel like a gigantic open road.

As a matter of fact, there will be a BMWCCA event this Saturday at Nassau Coliseum if you'd like to attend. My suggestion, try this out.

If you decide you want to, go to nybmwcca.org, click on autocross at the top, click on schedule and register. Also bring blue painter's tape so you can create your number.

Remember to come early(by 7:30 if possible), bring plenty of water and something to eat, some sun screen, tire gauge as your tire pressures will rise, $ for registration, registration form (if u did it online) so u don't have to wait.

if you come, look for me driving an alpine white M3 marked 731, Ray. By the way, this whole novice/newbie thing, I explain it well because I just started in June and I've been to between 10-15 events now and I'll be hitting the track in the next few weeks right after my Evo School which we'll talk about if you get hooked.

Unlike track where you will spend 300.00 for registration, you will go through a set of tires for sure on the track, brake flush, new brake pads if yours are worn, autocross is much much less expensive. I would only hit the track if I'd already worked on my own driving skills and tuned the car.

a few good websites: sccaforums.com, BMWCCA.org, autox4u.com, NYRscca & Motorsport.reg. check em
__________________
AutoX: BMWCCA-NY, NYR-SCCA, NNJR-SCCA, MSNE
YouTube: CATCHMEIFYOUCAN181
Instagram: CATCHM3IFYOUCAN

"Drag Racing is for fast cars, AutoX is for fast drivers"
CatchM3IfYouCan181 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      09-06-2012, 11:24 AM   #22
M3crit
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: 2011 e90
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NY

Posts: 38
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Esq. View Post
Where are you in NY?
Im in manhattan, but I'm back and forth to CT (danbury mostly) on some weekends. i will def be looking into CCA, any links? I'm currently looking through motorsportreg.com to see if there is anything i can get into over the coming weeks.
M3crit is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:19 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST