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      07-17-2012, 08:51 PM   #1
besiktas
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Can someone explain what happened to my brake pads?

I was in NJMP Lightning on saturday. bone stock car. 20 min sessions and brand new OEM front rotors and brake pads with 500 light miles on them.
I went on the track and the first session was raining so didnt even push it then in the other 3 session, as it dried up, i went faster but i was still gentle on the brakes. I felt like the pads were not biting the entire day and i dont think i was driving hard enough to boil the brake fluid.
Anyway, at the end of the day, there was a huge layer of brake dust on my front wheels. (much more than the 2 hrs i spent on VIR). On my service info screen, the lifetime of my pads went from 28k to 17k miles.
Is there like a brake in period that i wasnt aware? what happened to them, just fell apart? Were they faulty parts?
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      07-17-2012, 08:55 PM   #2
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There is a bedding procedure when you get new brakes installed, if this wasn't done it could contribute to poor brake performance. Could have let air into the brake system when installing the new pads??? Not sure...lots of scenarios. Take it back to the people who installed them for you to have it inspected.
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      07-17-2012, 08:57 PM   #3
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Dealer installed them and unfortunately i cant tell them that i track the car

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There is a bedding procedure when you get new brakes installed, if this wasn't done it could contribute to poor brake performance. Could have let air into the brake system when installing the new pads??? Not sure...lots of scenarios. Take it back to the people who installed them for you to have it inspected.
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      07-17-2012, 08:59 PM   #4
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Who says you have to? Just go in and tell them that your brakes aren't biting as hard as they used to prior to them installing the new set.
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      07-17-2012, 09:01 PM   #5
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wouldnt they understand it from the wear on the rotors and the pads?
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      07-17-2012, 09:01 PM   #6
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The "lifetime" of the pads is just a calculation that the car does based on speed and braking. Until the pads actually get to the wear sensor, the car really doesn't know how much pad you have left. The best way to know how much pad you used is to remove the wheels and measure the pad thickness. You probably have a bit of life left.

The OEM pads are ok for occasional and moderate tracking, but if you're really pushing it, you won't feel like you're getting enough bite.
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      07-17-2012, 09:02 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheClozer
Who says you have to? Just go in and tell them that your brakes aren't biting as hard as they used to prior to them installing the new set.
Totally agree. Just tell them what you experienced. You don't have to say anything about being at the track.
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      07-17-2012, 09:04 PM   #8
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Hey there--it may be due to lack of bedding as suggested above. If you only had 500 light miles on them, they might not have ever achieved proper mating between pad and rotor for the demands of track driving. StopTech has great info about why bedding (or "burnishing") is important and how to do it:

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-su...ake-pad-bed-in

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-su...-system-bed-in
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      07-17-2012, 09:05 PM   #9
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In my experience at the track, the stock pads do just fine, but they fade after a short while. The OP was saying that the pads were soft from the get go...this is a red flag to me that something is wrong.
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      07-17-2012, 09:16 PM   #10
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I went to VIR before with 28k old pads and they worked fine. maybe these were not broken in yet...
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      07-17-2012, 09:50 PM   #11
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Check your brake fluid as well and make sure it that it hasn't aged.
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      07-17-2012, 10:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by besiktas View Post
I was in NJMP Lightning on saturday. bone stock car. 20 min sessions and brand new OEM front rotors and brake pads with 500 light miles on them.
I went on the track and the first session was raining so didnt even push it then in the other 3 session, as it dried up, i went faster but i was still gentle on the brakes. I felt like the pads were not biting the entire day and i dont think i was driving hard enough to boil the brake fluid.
Anyway, at the end of the day, there was a huge layer of brake dust on my front wheels. (much more than the 2 hrs i spent on VIR). On my service info screen, the lifetime of my pads went from 28k to 17k miles.
Is there like a brake in period that i wasnt aware? what happened to them, just fell apart? Were they faulty parts?
Nothing happened, except that you wore your pads down a bit. The decline in remaining life on the Condition Based Service indicator is based on how hard you were braking and how many times. Your computer thinks you work the pads down about 35%, and the heavy layer of brake dust confirms you wore them some, although perhaps not as much as 35%. If you had your stability control on "normal" you would have worn them a lot even if you didn't brake hard - the DSC uses them to keep the car on the road. If you set DSC to Sport, your brakes will last a lot longer.
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      07-18-2012, 04:53 AM   #13
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normal for stock pads
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      07-18-2012, 11:03 AM   #14
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There are quite a few possibilities here, although I agree that it was probably a recipe of many things.

How many miles are on the car now, compared to when you went to VIR? If you have some older brake fluid, that will contribute to soggy pedal feel.

Two things I would suggest:

Bleed and put in a higher temp brake fluid (Super Blue, Motul, etc) as this will refresh the fluid and take out any air bubble you may have.

I would also consider a set of track pads for your next outing. This will really improve your experience and safety on the track.

While on track at Mid Ohio, I watched a car lose its brakes right in front of me going down the back stretch to China Beach and took out a 2 week old Boss 302 Mustang. He was using OEM brake bluid and brakes.

Don't want to scare you, just something to think about.

Last edited by TC Kline Racing; 07-18-2012 at 12:23 PM.
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      07-18-2012, 11:24 AM   #15
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Thanks, At VIR the car and brakes were 28k old, at NJMP it the car is on 30k miles, brakes were 600 miles old and OEM brake fluid was 400 miles old.

I am going to get the super blue and thinking of getting carbotech XP12's for the front pads. and XP8 or XP10 on the rear pads

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There are quite a few possibilities here, although I agree that it was probably a recipe of many things.

How many miles are on the car now, compared to when you went to VIR? If you have some older brake fluid, that will contribute to soggy pedal feel.

Two things I would suggest:

Bleed and put in a higher temp brake fluid (Super Blue, Motul, etc) as this will refresh the fluid and take out any air bubble you may have.

I would also consider a set of track pads for your next outing. This will really improve your experience and safety on the track.

While on track at Mid Ohio, I watch a car lose its brakes going down the back stretch to China Beach and took out a 2 week old Boss 302 Mustang. He was using OEM brake bluid and brakes.

Don't want to scare you, just something to think about.
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      07-18-2012, 12:27 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Thanks, At VIR the car and brakes were 28k old, at NJMP it the car is on 30k miles, brakes were 600 miles old and OEM brake fluid was 400 miles old.

I am going to get the super blue and thinking of getting carbotech XP12's for the front pads. and XP8 or XP10 on the rear pads
OK, so it sounds like you were just getting some brake fade, and even though you didn't 'boil' the brake fluid, there still may have been some cavitation from working the brakes so much and not being able to retain its properties in the fluid.

If you are considering Hawk or Performance Friction brake pads, we are a dealer for both
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      07-18-2012, 09:11 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by besiktas View Post
Thanks, At VIR the car and brakes were 28k old, at NJMP it the car is on 30k miles, brakes were 600 miles old and OEM brake fluid was 400 miles old.

I am going to get the super blue and thinking of getting carbotech XP12's for the front pads. and XP8 or XP10 on the rear pads
When I had stock calipers I burned thru a set of XP-10s in only 3 track days. Had much better experience with Pagid RS 19 and 29s. Have heard good things about Performance Friction from others as well.
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      07-20-2012, 07:20 AM   #18
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You didn't bed your pads. Light driving won't do it. You have to get the pads HOT so that you get a layer of the friction material on the rotor surface.

Otherwise, you won't get very good performance from your brakes.

Then if you lost a lot of pad, it was probably because you didn't bed in your pads before you drove on the track.
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      07-29-2012, 01:44 AM   #19
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Dealer installed them and unfortunately i cant tell them that i track the car
why not? Is there a maintenance exclusion with track use?
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      07-29-2012, 10:00 AM   #20
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Yes, Its called abusing the car.
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      07-29-2012, 10:57 AM   #21
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Quote:
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Thanks, At VIR the car and brakes were 28k old, at NJMP it the car is on 30k miles, brakes were 600 miles old and OEM brake fluid was 400 miles old.

I am going to get the super blue and thinking of getting carbotech XP12's for the front pads. and XP8 or XP10 on the rear pads
Might want to consider Catrol SRF instead of the Blue, which is essentially stock fluid. SRF is more money,but you don't need to change it out all season. it has the highest wet boiling point if all the fluids.

The Stoptech Street Sport pads work pretty well for a combo street/track pad.

.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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