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      06-03-2012, 12:45 AM   #1
thorny
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Buttonwillow Heat

Buttonwillow Track Day with Speed District, June 1, 2012

I finally upgraded my wheels/tires and was anxious to try out my new TE37SL / R-S3 combo on the track. The day was great, I love track days with Speed District, no traffic and plenty of track time.

I also had guys at EAS reprogram my MDM to a "more aggressive" European version. The first two sessions of the day I did with MDM on, and I don't know if it was wishful thinking or maybe better grip from the tires, but MDM didn't intervene as much with my driving. I did fantastic 2:04 in the second session. Considering 100+ degree weatehr (damn it was hot!!!) and the fact that best drivers in advanced group were running 2:01-2:02 tops, I was happy. My stock brakes were beginning to melt after 10-12 minutes and I overshot braking a few times.

R-S3 tires with proper camber felt really great, I was at full throttle in many places where I had to let off to stay on track with my old stock Conti Sportcontact 3.

I turned DSC off and did 2:07 (I was cautious) and then 2:05. I felt like I could do better and I really liked DSC off. The car was predictable and I felt pretty good. Then someone asked me to take him for a ride along. We went out and I spun out on the first lap in left hander Bus Stop. It was entirely my fault, I was going way to fast for approaching that corner, my tires didn't have a chance to warm up yet and I had a heavy guy with me. When situation presented over-steer at over 80-90 MPH, I counter-steered, but let off the gas and made over-steer worst and lost control. The car was full of dirt, It took like 30 seconds for cloud to clear and be able to see.

I learnt the lesson to be more careful with DSC off. Enjoy the pics.

I detailed interior today, it took me 4 hrs or more, but it looks brand new, just need to pressure wash engine bay
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Last edited by thorny; 06-03-2012 at 01:37 AM.
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      06-03-2012, 01:16 AM   #2
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Quoting you from the E9x M3 LAP TIMES (Road Course) thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny View Post
Thanks Randall! I managed 2:04 in the second session of the day with my "new European MDM" (RS3 grip like hell compared to my old stock Conti SportContact3), then I turned DSC off and did 2:07 in 3rd "DCS off" session (I was cautious) and then 2:05 in the 4th (DSC off). Then I put a passenger in the car and went all out on the first lap, my tires were not up to temperature and I came out way to hot out of the Club Corner, my car started oversteering, I let off the gas which made oversteer worst and I spun out right before first left hander Bus Stop. The car was full of Buttonwillow dirt and rocks the size of a quarter since I had both windows open with passenger. I hate this rule! Just like in your video It was a crazy day - the heat was immense, I was starting to lose brakes after 12-15 minutes.. I am about to make a separate post. Stay tuned
While going around Club Corner, not sure if you went over that berm on the right side or not, but (several months ago when I tried going DSC off) I over-steered twice at that fast right-handed Club Corner when I went over that berm. Fortunately, I corrected and didn't go into the dirt, but gotta be careful there with DSC off. Same corner in MDM, you can get as aggressive as you want.

Re: just like my video (of spinning several months ago after exiting the Bus Stop), lulz yeah, I can imagine. After coming off the track, I went straight to the tire shop at the track and used the pressure hose to get most of the dirt out. By the time I got back to the garages, it was time for my run group's next session, lulz.

By the way, the car looks great with TE37 & R-S3's!
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      06-03-2012, 01:43 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OC3 View Post
Quoting you from the E9x M3 LAP TIMES (Road Course) thread:



While going around Club Corner, not sure if you went over that berm on the right side or not, but (several months ago when I tried going DSC off) I over-steered twice at that fast right-handed Club Corner when I went over that berm. Fortunately, I corrected and didn't go into the dirt, but gotta be careful there with DSC off. Same corner in MDM, you can get as aggressive as you want.

Re: just like my video (of spinning several months ago after exiting the Bus Stop), lulz yeah, I can imagine. After coming off the track, I went straight to the tire shop at the track and used the pressure hose to get most of the dirt out. By the time I got back to the garages, it was time for my run group's next session, lulz.

By the way, the car looks great with TE37 & R-S3's!
Yeah, I love the new look! Thanks

I just watched my old video and realized I spun out right in the first left hand Bus Stop. Kind of in between two Bus Stop corners. I did ran over that berm in the Club corner and it pushed me way to the left, hence the reason for tons of speed coming into the first Bus Stop and approaching it on the screwed up line. The car started oversteering when I was turning left trying to make it through first Bus Stop.
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      06-03-2012, 01:54 AM   #4
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^Ahhh, ok.
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      06-03-2012, 08:42 AM   #5
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Thorny - Would you mind providing info re your Recaro driver seat - Where to get, price, how does it install, suggestions if any.
I want to change my drivers seat out so I can have better restraint systems. The stock situation sucks.
Thanks
vz
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      06-03-2012, 01:55 PM   #6
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I love those wheels. Sounds like a blast.
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      06-03-2012, 02:28 PM   #7
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Another question re. your Recaro seat. I can't see in the back because of your window tint--do you use a harness bar, or a roll bar/half-cage for harness mounting?
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      06-03-2012, 03:12 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by von_zoom View Post
Thorny - Would you mind providing info re your Recaro driver seat - Where to get, price, how does it install, suggestions if any.
I want to change my drivers seat out so I can have better restraint systems. The stock situation sucks.
Thanks
vz

I got my from EAS. You will need floor mounts (I run MS), Recaro slider kit and side mounts. Side mounts can be either Recaro or MS, I run Recaro coz I like them to say Recaro and I am not too big on the gothic MS logo. My side mounts are aluminum, but I heard steel is quiter, my squeek just a tiny bit. Before it used to be making more noise, but I took it out and lubricated everything with non-greasy lubricant, I recommend doing that when doing install, lubricate all contact points and it shouldnt make noise.

Install is easy (watch EAS video) but you'll have to code out passenger restraint error. The price of the seat and all hardware is about 1400 if I remember correctly, coding is like 100 plus install.

I had a bit of a troubke in the beginning installing it because holes in Recaro sliders didn't align properly with holes in MS floor mounts, I had to drill out slider holes a little bit, but it was PITA. Maybe you'll be luckier and you wont have this problem.

When installing, install it as much to the right (center of the car) as possible, otherwise your streering wheel will be shifted to the right from the center of the seat.

I also have Sabelt shoulder pad with my stock belt, you can see why in the thread below.

Recaro seat in cloth is the way to go if you track your car any appreciable amount of time.

Hope this helps

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=681381


EDIT: you'd need seat belt receptacle also. I have MS

Last edited by thorny; 06-04-2012 at 12:53 AM.
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      06-03-2012, 03:16 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paradocs98 View Post
Another question re. your Recaro seat. I can't see in the back because of your window tint--do you use a harness bar, or a roll bar/half-cage for harness mounting?
I run stock seat belt. You can see more pics of my setup in the link above, just scroll down the thread.
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      06-03-2012, 03:20 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
I love those wheels. Sounds like a blast.
Thanks! +1 on the wheels. Te37sl are awesome, I get compliments all day long.
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      06-03-2012, 06:15 PM   #11
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Thanks much re the seat. I will have my shop folks look into it. From the pics you have posted, looks like the way to go. Appreciate the info.
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      06-03-2012, 07:56 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny View Post
Buttonwillow Track Day with Speed District, June 1, 2012

I finally upgraded my wheels/tires and was anxious to try out my new TE37SL / R-S3 combo on the track. The day was great, I love track days with Speed District, no traffic and plenty of track time.

I also had guys at EAS reprogram my MDM to a "more aggressive" European version. The first two sessions of the day I did with MDM on, and I don't know if it was wishful thinking or maybe better grip from the tires, but MDM didn't intervene as much with my driving. I did fantastic 2:04 in the second session. Considering 100+ degree weatehr (damn it was hot!!!) and the fact that best drivers in advanced group were running 2:01-2:02 tops, I was happy. My stock brakes were beginning to melt after 10-12 minutes and I overshot braking a few times.
I was there also with new wheels/tires combo and new GC camber plates. I'm running Volks G2 square setup with 275/35/18 RS3. I didn't do as good as you. My best time at Buttonwillow is 2:08 with stock size tires (265/245) AD08. I could barely do the same with my best times in 2:08 - 2:09 range. The setup felt great but my car was overheating quite easily. I had to short shift and run lower RPM most of the day to avoid getting the warning light in the dash.

I noticed that you also have a DCT car from the pictures. Did you car overheat at all? I could get 1-2 laps going all the way and then I had to back-off. I was talking to someone else with a manual version and he seemed to not overheat as easily as me. I'm curious about your case since you seem to have run pretty good time there.
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      06-03-2012, 09:24 PM   #13
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Quote:
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I was there also with new wheels/tires combo and new GC camber plates. I'm running Volks G2 square setup with 275/35/18 RS3. I didn't do as good as you. My best time at Buttonwillow is 2:08 with stock size tires (265/245) AD08. I could barely do the same with my best times in 2:08 - 2:09 range. The setup felt great but my car was overheating quite easily. I had to short shift and run lower RPM most of the day to avoid getting the warning light in the dash.

I noticed that you also have a DCT car from the pictures. Did you car overheat at all? I could get 1-2 laps going all the way and then I had to back-off. I was talking to someone else with a manual version and he seemed to not overheat as easily as me. I'm curious about your case since you seem to have run pretty good time there.
In my case, heat was taking the most toll on the brakes. I actually just found out the reason for shitty performance of my brakes, I knew I was running very low on my Stoptech pads, but not that low - one of the pads was worn to the metal. To answer your question - my car wasn't overheating (engine and DCT), other than usual power steering fluid spill everything was OK and I could redline all day long. You may want to check your coolant level or something.

What are your camber settings with GC plates, I assume you run stock shocks?
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      06-03-2012, 11:56 PM   #14
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What are your camber settings with GC plates, I assume you run stock shocks?
It's good to know that you were able to redline all day without cooling issue. I'm going to check on this as this was really anoying for me. I'm running stock brakes with Endless racing pads and I could also see some loss in braking performance. I assumed it was mainly due to the brake fluid boiling but I'm no expert.

I'm running Dinan stage 1 suspension with the shorter version of the GC camber plates (11mm shorter) to keep suspension travel intact. My camber is set to -2.2 front (0 toe) and -1.8 rear (1/16 toe in). This is obviously not as good as a coilover setup but I'm pretty happy with it so far. I might increase camber later but I'm trying to be careful since I'm DD the car.

What are you running for suspension? I'm working on getting to your kind of lap time and trying to learn what I need to do both in term of driving skills and car modifications.
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      06-04-2012, 12:49 AM   #15
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Quote:
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It's good to know that you were able to redline all day without cooling issue. I'm going to check on this as this was really anoying for me. I'm running stock brakes with Endless racing pads and I could also see some loss in braking performance. I assumed it was mainly due to the brake fluid boiling but I'm no expert.

I'm running Dinan stage 1 suspension with the shorter version of the GC camber plates (11mm shorter) to keep suspension travel intact. My camber is set to -2.2 front (0 toe) and -1.8 rear (1/16 toe in). This is obviously not as good as a coilover setup but I'm pretty happy with it so far. I might increase camber later but I'm trying to be careful since I'm DD the car.

What are you running for suspension? I'm working on getting to your kind of lap time and trying to learn what I need to do both in term of driving skills and car modifications.
I am going to switch to Endless once my new Stoptechs pads wear out, I had a spare set. I was pretty happy with stoptechs though.

I run KW clubsport coilovers, I was told by a reputable shop that to get maximum performance out of R-S3 tires you need to run aggresive camber. I have -3 Front and -2.2 Rear, I dont't DD my car and not particular concerned with tire wear I've pretty much used KW recommended settings until now and car feels great, although I think I may want to have more grip at rear to reduce tendency to oversteer.

So far I've done 5 track days at Buttonwillow (13CW 4 times and CCW once). I've never done any other tracks other than BW. I live 30 minutes away from the track - the reason for so much love for this track

My time and mods progressed as follows:

2:12 first time doing 13CW after my first track event ever at buttonwillow school CCW configuration. Car was stock with just stoptech pads, motul 600 and stoptech lines, MS intake. Conti Sportcontact3 tires, ZCP car.

2:08 second time running 13CW. I added Recaro seat. Same tires as before

2:08 third time running 13CW. I added KW CS coilovers and removed primary cats. Same tires, but now really worn out. I was doing 2:08 without breaking the sweat, but I had virtually no grip. These tires are no good for tracking, but I had to wear them out

2:04 this last event. Finally with good tires, suspension and alignment. I think everyone would be running faster times if not the heat. I was still dropping times with DSC off, but my spinout kind off put an end to it and that GTR fire... All prior events were during winter and spring.

I think experience and driver play a major role, thats why I love it so much. You can see a ton of guys running some major mods and still posting south of 2:10 i wont be adding anything else for a while, I want a small wing, but its not in the cards right now.

Quest to break 2 minutes continues...
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      06-04-2012, 02:31 PM   #16
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Thorny nice work at 2:04! Thats awesome. Did you notice a big difference with the Rs3 tires? I know I did!

Hopefully I will be back out there again soon but been swamped with work the past few months.
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      06-04-2012, 02:36 PM   #17
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also on the brakes melting...I would highly suggest setting up a brake cooling setup with the ducts leading to the dust guards. I switched to Endless pads but still had melting issues. If I could do it over again I would have went with the cooling setup prior to spending the extra $$ on the Endless.
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      06-04-2012, 03:17 PM   #18
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Quote:
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Thorny nice work at 2:04! Thats awesome. Did you notice a big difference with the Rs3 tires? I know I did!

Hopefully I will be back out there again soon but been swamped with work the past few months.

Oh hell yeah, I noticed the difference. Wider RS3s is a whole different ball game!

I am going to shut it down for the summer, too hot for my taste, but I'll be back out there again once it gets cooler!

After wittnesing the fire, I strongly encourage everyone to bring out a fire extinguisher if tracking in this heat, it was no joke

The problems I was having with the brakes was mostly due to worn out front pads, but I hear you on the ducts too.

See you out there Clint!
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      06-04-2012, 03:20 PM   #19
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What was up with the fire? i hadn't heard about that.
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      06-04-2012, 03:29 PM   #20
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What was up with the fire? i hadn't heard about that.

GTR pulled up next to me after the session, there was smoke coming out from the rear, everyone was looking trying to figure out WTF was going on. In about 30 seconds flames engulfed the hole rear and it was getting worse every second. Poor guy was trying to put it out with iced water from the cooler, but it didnt do anything. he was super lucky that there was a safety car driving by nearby, we yelled at him and he pulled up and took care of the fire with the fire extinguisher. Another 2 minutes the whole car would have been gone... It was scary dude, you cant do anything without fire extinguisher.

His exhaust must have been touching or too close to something on the undercarriage and thats what caused the fire. Rear was totally destroyed..
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      06-04-2012, 03:33 PM   #21
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damn!! That is crazy.
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      06-04-2012, 04:00 PM   #22
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I heard that the GT-R was running too rich, throwing flames out the exhaust...

But, judging from the tape-repair, I guess it wasn't that bad.

.
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