BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos
 
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-10-2012, 12:40 PM   #419
Red Bread
Brigadier General
 
Drives: My wife's car
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Dallas, TX

Posts: 4,174
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Good to see xenophobia and Canada get along so well. So the idea of a crossover SUV is unique to BMW? I guess Toyota would be surprised to know that the recent surge in hybrid BMW's is just to reaffirm that BMW invented the hybrid too. Once BMW builds a motor with both direct and port fuel injection, it will be interesting to see you'll spin that as new technology when the Toyobaru already has it. If your hatred is this strong towards Japanese cars, I'd really hate to see your thoughts on the Koreans, who borrow ideas from the Japanese.
Red Bread is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 12:50 PM   #420
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Good to see xenophobia and Canada get along so well. So the idea of a crossover SUV is unique to BMW? I guess Toyota would be surprised to know that the recent surge in hybrid BMW's is just to reaffirm that BMW invented the hybrid too. Once BMW builds a motor with both direct and port fuel injection, it will be interesting to see you'll spin that as new technology when the Toyobaru already has it. If your hatred is this strong towards Japanese cars, I'd really hate to see your thoughts on the Koreans, who borrow ideas from the Japanese.
Pfuh, I don't talk about vehicle class man. This discusiion will go to the roots of who built the car and guess what, it wasn't the japanese.
SUV, whatever, regardless the fact BMW is building SAV not SUV. And yes, it is a difference between them, I hope is no need to go in there.
The single company I respect from japanese is Honda.
Toyota (aka Lexus) is very well known for copying design almost at indigo from germans, especially Mercedes.
It is not xenophobia (not that I really care about a such comment), this is the pure truth, japanese were incapable of bringing something true original in their design. Not to mention Totyota and Subaru's are the most ugliest p.o.s I've ever seen.

I have heard comments about Toyota reaching North Pole. Wow, surprize, at North pole the VW beetle boxer engine is running there in almost every working machine for almost 50 years. People should read before open their mouths.

Koreans who?

And BTW: "Borrow" is not synonym with "stealing".

Last edited by Tracus; 05-10-2012 at 01:08 PM.
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 03:39 PM   #421
M3_WC
Colonel
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CA

Posts: 2,203
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Re: Subaru BRZ concept

I will never consider a car from plagiarist people that are unable to bring their own design ideas.
Headlights have Audi's elements, taillights have BMW elements.

The japanese are good only at stealing and inspiring from those who dare to bring new ideas, new elements. They never have the guts to come in with something that is revolutionary just because they are afraid not to hurt their "reliability image".

That's why BMW is a winner and worthy of "the Ultimate Driving Machine" nickname.

Even if this car will be one of the best, for me it's a product of stealing of ideas and for me such people do not deserve my money or my attention.

I have a HUGE disrespect for these thiefs!
What are you saying? BMW's are the "ultimate driving machine" because they don't steal styling designs?

If all you are worried about is styling, you are missing the entire point of this car. And no BMW does not have anything remotely resembling the chassis and engine layout of this car. Matter of fact, no car company at this price point does. Subie/Toyo are leading the way.
M3_WC is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 04:32 PM   #422
BiscottiGelato
Captain
 
BiscottiGelato's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 135i M Sport 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: GVA

Posts: 633
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3_WC View Post
What are you saying? BMW's are the "ultimate driving machine" because they don't steal styling designs?

If all you are worried about is styling, you are missing the entire point of this car. And no BMW does not have anything remotely resembling the chassis and engine layout of this car. Matter of fact, no car company at this price point does. Subie/Toyo are leading the way.
I don't think the BRZ looks anything like a German car... I don't see the styling cues at all...

I agree. BMW is miles behind when all they are thinking about is still putting M badges and parts onto essentially pig heavy luxury sedans... Yes, BMW is leader is turning big heavy luxury sedans into great sporty feeling vehicles. A sports car from grounds up? BMW is one of the worst...
__________________
Ground Control Camber Plates, Ferrodo D2500 w/ Slotted Rotors, Dunlop Direzza ZII on Apex EC-7s
BiscottiGelato is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 04:40 PM   #423
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

BMW is not the Ultimate Driving Machine because of it's design...gosh...
Read my first post, I was talking about taillights and headlights in this Subaru prototype.

Everybody knows why BMW is a driving machine, chassis, weight distribution, handling, etc. and on and on...
In terms of many things, BMW is one of the few that throws new technology in their cars; the "others" are waiting until the technology is proven, eventualy ready for grab and put it in their "reliable" simple machines. That's why the ones who dare are always one step forward.

I have a deep respect for a company that strives to come up with their own philosophy, I have no respect for copy-paste manufacturers.

And to make the comment about the cars, I am not looking for a sport car that is a pure sport car, I am looking for a confortable sedan with sporty attitude. 99% I am riding on the street not on the race track. However, if I really want a nice sport car, japanese have nothing for me in their yard.

Last edited by Tracus; 05-10-2012 at 04:50 PM.
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 04:59 PM   #424
M3_WC
Colonel
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CA

Posts: 2,203
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
BMW is not the Ultimate Driving Machine because of it's design...gosh...
Read my first post, I was talking about taillights and headlights in this Subaru prototype.

Everybody knows why BMW is a driving machine, chassis, weight distribution, handling, etc. and on and on...
In terms of many things, BMW is one of the few that throws new technology in their cars; the "others" are waiting until the technology is proven, eventualy ready for grab and put it in their "reliable" simple machines. That's why the ones who dare are always one step forward.

I have a deep respect for a company that strives to come up with their own philosophy, I have no respect for copy-paste manufacturers.

And to make the comment about the cars, I am not looking for a sport car that is a pure sport car, I am looking for a confortable sedan with sporty attitude. 99% I am riding on the street not on the race track. However, if I really want a nice sport car, japanese have nothing for me in their yard.
What BMW has the chassis and engine layout of this car? What BMW has an extremely low center gravity like this car? It has a lower COG than a Ferrari 458.

Honestly, you don't have slightest idea about this car if you think they just copied something.
M3_WC is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 05:05 PM   #425
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

Man, I give up...

Please, understand what you want... it's ok...
BTW: even in these two tests posted in here you can see, they were not even able to come up with an orginal color in this copy. Not to mention, M1 comparo is pointless form many points of view...

You know, some people just don't have eyes for some cars even if the COG is under the sea level. For me, some cars don't even exist. Can you live with it?

Last edited by Tracus; 05-10-2012 at 05:13 PM.
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 05:23 PM   #426
Crimson92
Smiling Politely
 
Crimson92's Avatar
 
Drives: Like a boss
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Whales Vagina

Posts: 28,613
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Man, I give up...

Please, understand what you want... it's ok...
BTW: even in these two tests posted in here you can see, they were not even able to come up with an orginal color in this copy. Not to mention, M1 comparo is pointless form many points of view...

You know, some people just don't have eyes for some cars even if the COG is under the sea level. For me, some cars don't even exist. Can you live with it?
1. Which car is the brz/gt86/frs copying?
2. What the hell does color have to do with anything?
3. I see no bmw or audi(as you mentioned) in the styling.
4. SAV is MARKETING. You drive a SUV friend.
__________________
Quote:
Some people are like slinkies...not really good for much but you can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs"
Crimson92 is online now   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 05:45 PM   #427
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson92 View Post
1. Which car is the brz/gt86/frs copying?
2. What the hell does color have to do with anything?
3. I see no bmw or audi(as you mentioned) in the styling.
4. SAV is MARKETING. You drive a SUV friend.
1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Re: Subaru BRZ concept
Headlights have Audi's elements, taillights have BMW elements.
2. Color? Just making me laugh, they are not able to come with nothing original, not even the color.
3. See 1.
4. Unlike traditional SUVs which are derived from the body-on-frame construction of light trucks, vehicles in the sports activity family are crossovers that are based upon unibody car platforms. BMW emphasized their sports-car like on-road ability, helping to distinguish this new series from others. The sports activity nomenclatures are indicative of the reality that for the most part, the vehicles are more "activity" based than "utility". The sports activity family of BMW automobiles are grouped by their X-series branding.
4A. The X1 is based on a 3 series Touring platform far from an SUV "friend".

5.It is hilarious to see that people assume that the guy from the other side of the forum has no experience; maybe the judgment is based on the number of posts on this forum?

6. Subject closed for me; I wouldn't spend my energy on such vehicle or brand.
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 06:36 PM   #428
M3_WC
Colonel
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CA

Posts: 2,203
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Man, I give up...

Please, understand what you want... it's ok...
BTW: even in these two tests posted in here you can see, they were not even able to come up with an orginal color in this copy. Not to mention, M1 comparo is pointless form many points of view...

You know, some people just don't have eyes for some cars even if the COG is under the sea level. For me, some cars don't even exist. Can you live with it?
Understand what I want? You simply are clueless about the underpinnings of this car, saying it isn't revolutionary "because they are afraid not to hurt their "reliability image"."

We get it you don't like the styling or think it copies German cars. That is personal opinion and very much arguable.

Where you are completely wrong is stating this car is copy or brings nothing mechanically new the automotive industry. There is a reason why there is such a hype around this car. Either you haven't educated yourself about the car, or don't care too, or too ignorant to understand why this car is revolutionary to the car world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
You know, some people just don't have eyes for some cars even if the COG is under the sea level. For me, some cars don't even exist. Can you live with it?
Sure personal opinion is fine about what car you want in your garage.

But your are making blanket statements about this cars abilities and mechanical design that are not true.
M3_WC is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 08:55 PM   #429
BiscottiGelato
Captain
 
BiscottiGelato's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 135i M Sport 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: GVA

Posts: 633
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
1.
2. Color? Just making me laugh, they are not able to come with nothing original, not even the color.
3. See 1.
4. Unlike traditional SUVs which are derived from the body-on-frame construction of light trucks, vehicles in the sports activity family are crossovers that are based upon unibody car platforms. BMW emphasized their sports-car like on-road ability, helping to distinguish this new series from others. The sports activity nomenclatures are indicative of the reality that for the most part, the vehicles are more "activity" based than "utility". The sports activity family of BMW automobiles are grouped by their X-series branding.
4A. The X1 is based on a 3 series Touring platform far from an SUV "friend".

5.It is hilarious to see that people assume that the guy from the other side of the forum has no experience; maybe the judgment is based on the number of posts on this forum?

6. Subject closed for me; I wouldn't spend my energy on such vehicle or brand.
I just don't see how the headlamp copies Audi and how the tail copies BMW. Please post side by side pictures to make your point. I really want to see, cuz I have to admit i don't follow the intricate styling details of every car out there.

and... BMW does not own orange... With your line of thinking, BMW copied this then...

SAV unique to BMW? No kidding. An SUV with 4 seats and call it a coupe cross-over... X5 drop one seat and sell it for more... Definately unique marketing for the rich, that's for sure.

For the masses who wants affordable sports, arguably better engineered than the Porsche Cayman? You have the Toyobaru.
__________________
Ground Control Camber Plates, Ferrodo D2500 w/ Slotted Rotors, Dunlop Direzza ZII on Apex EC-7s
BiscottiGelato is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 09:04 PM   #430
BiscottiGelato
Captain
 
BiscottiGelato's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 135i M Sport 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: GVA

Posts: 633
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
And to make the comment about the cars, I am not looking for a sport car that is a pure sport car, I am looking for a confortable sedan with sporty attitude. 99% I am riding on the street not on the race track. However, if I really want a nice sport car, japanese have nothing for me in their yard.
If you aren't looking for a sports car, you have nothing to do with this thread. When it comes to real sports cars, BMW has nothing even close in it's arsenal. Don't even talk about at the under 30k price range.

For the sporting intention that the Tobayaru carries, it's probably the most livable you can find for daily driving. Any of those Porsche Cayman/Carrera has both less seats, harsher ride and less trunk space. Not to mention costing 3 to 4 times more.

If you are talking about interior quality and such, you are out of your mind. It's 26k for god's sake.

I'd say the Toyobaru is a game changer. If it sells like hot cakes (which is as expected. I think it'll be super tough to get your hands on one, especially since they are not producing that many for the first year), expect all other manufacturers to REACT to Toyobaru's innovative design and engineering.

I for one, can tell you that if I am in the position I was in 2 years ago in choosing a car, I'd have bought the Toyobaru over the 135i. You just get more with less money. It's that good!
__________________
Ground Control Camber Plates, Ferrodo D2500 w/ Slotted Rotors, Dunlop Direzza ZII on Apex EC-7s
BiscottiGelato is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-10-2012, 11:50 PM   #431
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

Gentlemen, if you are looking for a car that is under 25k I think you are on the wrong forum.

I personally, prefer quality interior and I am not interested in poor quality interior that will hide behind excuses like " it si 25k for God's sake" .
As I already said, it really doesn't matter for me, it can cost 300 bucks and have the COG lower than anybody, it is still a Junkbaru for me.

For me quality means everything in every thing including a proper anticorosive body, aluminum or real wood trim, real leather and proper fit and finish.

And Ithink I have mentioned already, I am not a Porsche guy, nor other very low cars, I preffer a discreet BMW with a small letter on the corner that puts to shame many other cars that blow too much advertising, and is doing so in confort, superb fit and finish and wonderful sound system with gadgets that make the life on the seat a pleasure. Not to mention a car is many times defined by the hands who drives it and own it...
Better engineered than Porsche?
Depends what engineering means for people. For some, the engineering term is just a term that defines the numbers on the window sticker; for others it means, mechanics, technical solutions, materials and technology used and other litle things made to be seen by the proper eye...

Not last, not every person looks at the vehicle from financial point of view.
There are people out there that even if they spend the last cent they know what they want and why. This is why there are choices for everybody, the ones who want a car to take the from A to B and calculates the cost per year, and the ones who love the car and care how they spend that every minute in their daily comuting machine...
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 12:07 AM   #432
Singletrack
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
 
Singletrack's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 SSII E92 M3; 12 AW X5d
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Posts: 3,791
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Re: Subaru BRZ concept

I will never consider a car from plagiarist people that are unable to bring their own design ideas.
Headlights have Audi's elements, taillights have BMW elements.

The japanese are good only at stealing and inspiring from those who dare to bring new ideas, new elements. They never have the guts to come in with something that is revolutionary just because they are afraid not to hurt their "reliability image".

That's why BMW is a winner and worthy of "the Ultimate Driving Machine" nickname.

Even if this car will be one of the best, for me it's a product of stealing of ideas and for me such people do not deserve my money or my attention.

I have a HUGE disrespect for these thiefs!
LOL
Singletrack is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 12:37 AM   #433
Cdnrockies
Banned
 
Drives: BMW's
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Calgary

Posts: 1,113
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Re: Subaru BRZ concept

I will never consider a car from plagiarist people that are unable to bring their own design ideas.
Headlights have Audi's elements, taillights have BMW elements.

The japanese are good only at stealing and inspiring from those who dare to bring new ideas, new elements. They never have the guts to come in with something that is revolutionary just because they are afraid not to hurt their "reliability image".

That's why BMW is a winner and worthy of "the Ultimate Driving Machine" nickname.

Even if this car will be one of the best, for me it's a product of stealing of ideas and for me such people do not deserve my money or my attention.

I have a HUGE disrespect for these thiefs!
Are you fucking kidding me???

X1??? Really? And you have the gall to criticize any other car?

Fanboi at it's finest.
Attached Images
 
Cdnrockies is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 12:45 AM   #434
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

And if you really want to see further let me tell what this "modern junkbaru" is:
It is a1982 BMW E30 under a new body design, (Specific fo these days, and as mentioned before not even original).
Bmw had back then 2865 lbs ! Junkbaru arround there
Bmw had 2.3l, 4 cyl, 192 hp, at 6750 rpm, And 176 lb-ft torque at 4750 rpm,
With 7300 limit rev limit.
Junkbaru has 2.0l, 4 cyl boxer, At 7000 rpm, 151 lb-ft, Torque at 6600 rpm.
That M3 was RWD with A LSD and Junkbaru is following in kind.

Bottom line, SOO MUCH EVOLUTION!
Wow, remember my comment withthe japanese waiting to prove reliable?
Exception is that they need it 30 YEARS to be there and even now, 30 years later with carbon fiber and all that jazz, thebmw e30 is over in numbers.
Japanese cars = too much noise for nothing and no torque.

So,Toyobaru can becompared ( very hard but let' s live it like that) with 30 years oldBmw. Thats ths single comparo that can be ever done, and even then it is still unfair forthe japanese....

Cdnrockies, watch your language. We might not be the same age , nor educational level. X1 is not my car, leave the assumption at home. In the meantime find out aboutthat false misleading dual exhaust in IS F.

Last edited by Tracus; 05-11-2012 at 12:55 AM.
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 12:58 AM   #435
Cdnrockies
Banned
 
Drives: BMW's
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Calgary

Posts: 1,113
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Cdnrockies, watch your language. We might not be the same age , nor educational level. X1 is not my car, leave the assumption at home. In the meantime find out aboutthat false misleading dual exhaust in IS F.
Ummm...how about go fuck yourself fanboi. It's tools like you that make this forum painful to participate in for those that actually appreciate cars....all cars.

As for the dual exhausts....do mean the exact same set up that is on the 750? Idiot.
Cdnrockies is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 01:07 AM   #436
BiscottiGelato
Captain
 
BiscottiGelato's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 135i M Sport 6MT
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: GVA

Posts: 633
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
And if you really want to see further let me tell what this "modern junkbaru" is:
It is a1982 BMW E30 under a new body design, (Specific fo these days, and as mentioned before not even original).
Bmw had back then 2865 lbs ! Junkbaru arround there
Bmw had 2.3l, 4 cyl, 192 hp, at 6750 rpm, And 176 lb-ft torque at 4750 rpm,
With 7300 limit rev limit.
Junkbaru has 2.0l, 4 cyl boxer, At 7000 rpm, 151 lb-ft, Torque at 6600 rpm.
That M3 was RWD with A LSD and Junkbaru is following in kind.

Bottom line, SOO MUCH EVOLUTION!
Wow, remember my comment withthe japanese waiting to prove reliable?
Exception is that they need it 30 YEARS to be there and even now, 30 years later with carbon fiber and all that jazz, thebmw e30 is over in numbers.
Japanese cars = too much noise for nothing and no torque.

So,Toyobaru can becompared ( very hard but let' s live it like that) with 30 years oldBmw. Thats ths single comparo that can be ever done, and even then it is still unfair forthe japanese....

Cdnrockies, watch your language. We might not be the same age , nor educational level. X1 is not my car, leave the assumption at home. In the meantime find out aboutthat false misleading dual exhaust in IS F.
Yeah, and that's an M3. And an M3 back then actually cost a lot more in terms of percentage of average annual income. That's how far we have came along. We can have a brand new 1982 M3 for 1/3rd the price of how much it would've costed 30 years ago. And better yet, lower COG, better fuel economy, and much better safety.

And what have BMW done for us lately? the lightest car is some 30% heavier than what they created 30 years ago... disgrace.
__________________
Ground Control Camber Plates, Ferrodo D2500 w/ Slotted Rotors, Dunlop Direzza ZII on Apex EC-7s
BiscottiGelato is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 05:43 AM   #437
GoingTooFast
Banned
 
Drives: fat cars are still boats
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: compensating a fat car with horsepower is like giving an alcoholic cocaine to sober him up.

Posts: 1,247
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
X1 is not my car, leave the assumption at home.
Please, the guy had BMW X1 written in the 'Drives:' information and deleted it. Obviously, it's someone who wants to see this thread closed and I think he will succeed if you guys still keep helping him.

The 1965 Toyota Sports 800 was the first and up until now the ONLY 'modern era' Front-engine, Rear-wheel-drive sports car featuring a boxer engine (0.8 liter 2-cylinder, 580kg curb weight ). The Sports 800 was also one of the first production cars featuring a lift-out roof panel, or targa top, pre-dating the Porsche Targa. Weight was kept down by using aluminum on selected body panels and thin steel on the unibody construction. For the first few years of production even the seat frames were made of aluminium. That's the Toyobaru heritage:









However, the handling benchmark was the mid-engine Porsche Cayman despite the fact that the Toyobaru's center of gravity (17.7 inches high) is one inch lower than a Cayman's. They tried to copy the Germans after all!

Last edited by GoingTooFast; 05-11-2012 at 09:28 AM.
GoingTooFast is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 06:45 AM   #438
GoingTooFast
Banned
 
Drives: fat cars are still boats
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: compensating a fat car with horsepower is like giving an alcoholic cocaine to sober him up.

Posts: 1,247
iTrader: (0)

Oh!... and the same color, I haven't even noticed... well pointed out!


GoingTooFast is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 09:31 AM   #439
GoingTooFast
Banned
 
Drives: fat cars are still boats
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: compensating a fat car with horsepower is like giving an alcoholic cocaine to sober him up.

Posts: 1,247
iTrader: (0)

Just for the record:


Quote:
Toyota's First Sports Car - The Sports 800

The road-going Sports 800 was launched alongside the 2000GT at the 1965 Tokyo Motor Show, having been developed from the Publica saloon. Toyota’s first sports car, it featured a neat, aerodynamic two-seat body with a detachable roof panel. At the front, the recessed lamps with chrome surrounds echoed the styling of its more powerful stablemate.

It was powered by a 790cc flat-twin air cooled engine with twin carburettors and its output of 45bhp enabled a top speed of 155km/h (96mph). Drum brakes were used and the suspension featured double wishbones at the front and a rigid axle at the rear.

Its competition potential was quickly realised and it claimed victory in Japan’s biggest race of the year, the 1965 All Japan Car Club Championship. Tojirou Ukiya’s battle to first place against more powerful competition became a Japanese sporting legend.

Following this early success, the Sports 800 went on to feature regularly in domestic motor sport events. In 1966 the car’s low 9km/litre (25.4mpg) fuel consumption allowed Shihomi Hosoya to finish the Suzuka 500km race without having to stop to refuel, delivering a victory over rivals including the Prince Skyline GT, Nissan Fairlady and Triumph TR4. The same year it achieved a 1-2-3 finish in the GT-1 class in the third Japan Grand Prix, competing against Porsche 911, Lotus Elan and Honda S800 entries.

In 1967 the gallant racer completed a Toyota top three in Japan’s first 24-hour race, following a brace of 2000GTs to the chequered flag and taking the class honours. This was to be the works Sports 800’s competition climax, successfully achieving its ambition of demonstrating the durability of Toyota vehicles. Its achievements had a lasting impact, providing valuable inspiration for Toyota to develop and expand its motor sport activities.

The Sports 800 went out of production in 1969, but privately entered cars continued racing until 1970. The model enjoyed a brief revival in 1977 when it provided the platform for a prototype hybrid power system combining a gas turbine engine with an electric motor. This was the forerunner of today’s Toyota Hybrid Synergy Drive system which powers the Prius model.

Last edited by GoingTooFast; 05-11-2012 at 09:38 AM.
GoingTooFast is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      05-11-2012, 09:34 AM   #440
Tracus
Lieutenant
 
Tracus's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada

Posts: 505
iTrader: (0)

cdnrockies cowboy,
This is just the first comment found at a simple search:One noticeable element of the IS F design were its faux quad exhaust tailpipes consisting of two vertically stacked exhaust tips on each side that did not directly connect to the actual exhaust pipes ( tips were part of the bumper, rather than the exhaust)
Call your friend google, he will reveal for you the topgear where they are just making fun of this car. And the comparison with 7 series just proved that you are FAR from car knowledge, probably the street boys that teached you were not very honest with you. You know, a list of cars on the forum will not prove that you are educated or that you have knowledge, nor will make you look better, especially when you are adopting a red neck attitude and vulgar language. Just the fact that you judge someone based on a car that he owns proves many things...

GoingToofast, I have changed the name of the car because it seems that in here some people make connections between whatever car you own and the posts, without thinking that actually that can be one of the cars anyway. However, it is obvious that some people will not take criticism from somebody who drives a Pontiac Vibe. It can be whatever car in there, a discussion is a discussion; unfortunately some have very narrow views...

BiscottiGelato,
The car has a lower COG because of the layout of the boxer engine in comparaison with the inline 6. Plus, we are in 2012, 30 years later, we should expect some improvement , especially these days when we consider that the car technology is also 30 years more mature, don't you think?

In one post you are pointing the weight in another the safety. let me tell you something about the safety and the weight. Active safety is one thing, passive safety is another. You might have 8 airbags and one plastic car, when you will hit a heavier car you can bet you wish to be in a heavier car; if you still have the opportunity...

Not last, the quality of product and materials comes with a negative element: the weight.
Some people preffer a car made from tic-tac plastic, some preffer the cars made from real materials, good quality, nice speakers with titanium elements, real audio wirring, nice leather, vented seats, etc.
Bottom line, the agility comes from the weight/HP ratio and the torque power distribution and how that whole machine handles, this is where BMW exceeds. They know how to make well build cars with quality workmanship that are agile too.
As I can see, it si nothing new in there, the 1982 BMW solution who benefits from the lower gravity of a H engine, nothing more. And even after 30 years, they still didn't beat that E30 values. What a pitty...

You want a light car and cheap? Sure, take it but don't bring the safety element in here... Smart as a vehicle is safe too but reported to certain conditions.
Buyers buy their cars based on their perception, but that doesn't mean that is actually the truth...

In the end, I am not willing to have an interminable discussion with you, I respect your choices, please respect mine. I still don't understand why people who are frustrated with their cars don't get rid of them and buy whatever they like? Masochism?
Please go and buy that tic-tac car, if in your perception is better, go for it, you have one life and is too bad to spend your time in a machine that you don't like.

And yes, you are in BMW forum, be ready to take the criticism, otherwise go in the Toyota forum and your posts will be praised.

Peace
Tracus is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:21 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST