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      04-28-2012, 10:26 AM   #23
dogbone
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I can tell you from first hand experience, a BBK is the single biggest confidence booster out there on a track. I was experiencing shuddering, shaking, pedal fade, complete lack of braking power on the OEM brakes when pushing on the track.......yeah, all those things don't help in the confidence department. Now I have a BBK on all four corners with Castrol SRF.......hehe.....It's hard to over-emphasize what a massive difference it is. No matter what lap #, no matter how hot, no matter how aggressively I brake, I can't overheat them. They just keep working----smooth as butter. Incredible! I was on that 100+ degree track at MFest last weekend in Vegas. The BBK was smooth as can be. Never ceases to amaze me.

My humble advice to you is to own both track and street pads. I know you're only planning on a couple events this year, but if you drive with any degree of aggressiveness, you will only get the full effect of the BBK with the proper pads. Having all the pistons to squeeze a pad against a rotor is great, and having brake fluid with a super high boiling point is great, but you really do need a pad compound that performs optimally in high heat to make it all come together, not one that barely survives it.
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      04-28-2012, 11:46 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Justin(OKC) View Post
I really, really wanted red calipers; however, I have experienced red brembos on my E36 and the finish just doesn't last. I went with these because they are light, cheap to get parts, great reviews, and the calipers are hard anodized so the finish should never change unless some harsh chemical is used on them. I agree that they could "pop" a bit more, but in person they really look perfect on the car with the BBS wheels on.
Did you see the threads about the finish coming off on these calipers?
And APEX wheels will fit over the ST calipers.

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Originally Posted by dogbone View Post
I can tell you from first hand experience, a BBK is the single biggest confidence booster out there on a track. I was experiencing shuddering, shaking, pedal fade, complete lack of braking power on the OEM brakes when pushing on the track.......yeah, all those things don't help in the confidence department. Now I have a BBK on all four corners with Castrol SRF.......hehe.....It's hard to over-emphasize what a massive difference it is. No matter what lap #, no matter how hot, no matter how aggressively I brake, I can't overheat them. They just keep working----smooth as butter. Incredible! I was on that 100+ degree track at MFest last weekend in Vegas. The BBK was smooth as can be. Never ceases to amaze me.

My humble advice to you is to own both track and street pads. I know you're only planning on a couple events this year, but if you drive with any degree of aggressiveness, you will only get the full effect of the BBK with the proper pads. Having all the pistons to squeeze a pad against a rotor is great, and having brake fluid with a super high boiling point is great, but you really do need a pad compound that performs optimally in high heat to make it all come together, not one that barely survives it.
It's a slippery slope because to get the full effect of the track pads, you need R-compound (or close to it) tires too.

.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      04-28-2012, 12:00 PM   #25
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And APEX wheels will fit over the ST calipers.

It's a slippery slope because to get the full effect of the track pads, you need R-compound (or close to it) tires too.
Well, again in my humble opinion, if you're gonna go the route of a BBK like the Trophy kit, you should take it all the way.....why stop short of pads?

I have Apex Arc-8 wheels and RS-3's along with my AP Racing BBK------they're awesome! I have Mintex F3R on the fronts and DS2500 on the back for the track.
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      04-28-2012, 01:05 PM   #26
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RS3 is almost a track tire. I'm looking to get some the next time around.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      04-28-2012, 04:45 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dogbone View Post
I can tell you from first hand experience, a BBK is the single biggest confidence booster out there on a track. I was experiencing shuddering, shaking, pedal fade, complete lack of braking power on the OEM brakes when pushing on the track.......yeah, all those things don't help in the confidence department. Now I have a BBK on all four corners with Castrol SRF.......hehe.....It's hard to over-emphasize what a massive difference it is. No matter what lap #, no matter how hot, no matter how aggressively I brake, I can't overheat them. They just keep working----smooth as butter. Incredible! I was on that 100+ degree track at MFest last weekend in Vegas. The BBK was smooth as can be. Never ceases to amaze me.

My humble advice to you is to own both track and street pads. I know you're only planning on a couple events this year, but if you drive with any degree of aggressiveness, you will only get the full effect of the BBK with the proper pads. Having all the pistons to squeeze a pad against a rotor is great, and having brake fluid with a super high boiling point is great, but you really do need a pad compound that performs optimally in high heat to make it all come together, not one that barely survives it.
Thanks for the suggestion. I know I'll do pads. It's just a matter of time I need to get another liter of Castrol SRF and bleed the brakes a bit more. The thing stops great, but the pedal is a bit mushy when I initially step on it. My experience is sometimes it is like that until the pads are fully bedded in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
Did you see the threads about the finish coming off on these calipers?
And APEX wheels will fit over the ST calipers.



It's a slippery slope because to get the full effect of the track pads, you need R-compound (or close to it) tires too.

.
Yes, I saw the thread and monitored it closely. I am convinced when he had his car detailed they used a chemical on them. Too many other people are not having an issue with the finish. Worst case, I paint them red. I agree that with pads the next step is the tires. I'm going to run AD08's at the DE in June and see how it goes. I may have track pads and a different wheel/tire setup by the DE in September. I'm really wishing now that I had not bought the RAC RG63's and just done some sort of 18" wheel with RS3's like I had initially planned. I've considered selling the RAC's but I haven't seen any used Apex wheels for sale recently that I've wanted to jump on. Thought about doing some 18" Volk TE37sl's in white with red stickers, but not sure I want to deal with white wheels with track brake dust!
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      04-28-2012, 05:40 PM   #28
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Looks sick! Right side up



Quote:
Originally Posted by dogbone View Post
Well, again in my humble opinion, if you're gonna go the route of a BBK like the Trophy kit, you should take it all the way.....why stop short of pads?

I have Apex Arc-8 wheels and RS-3's along with my AP Racing BBK------they're awesome! I have Mintex F3R on the fronts and DS2500 on the back for the track.
Arc-8, RS-3's and Brembo BBK w/ Endless pads here. Love'em. Brake is one thing I no longer worry about at the tracks.
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      04-28-2012, 06:28 PM   #29
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Agreed with above posts. Alcons, AD08's, and pagids or carbotechs and I no longer worry about the brakes, but as stated earlier the weak link now becomes tires if on street tires running aggressive race pads. Not good or bad, just something to think about; more brakes than tires or vice versa....
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      04-28-2012, 06:56 PM   #30
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Try the ST pads. They're pretty damn good for the track too.

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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      04-28-2012, 07:36 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by klammer View Post
Agreed with above posts. Alcons, AD08's, and pagids or carbotechs and I no longer worry about the brakes, but as stated earlier the weak link now becomes tires if on street tires running aggressive race pads. Not good or bad, just something to think about; more brakes than tires or vice versa....
Are you running the AD08's with 19" wheels? I'm really thinking I made a bonehead mistake buying these 19" wheels....damn impulse!

You know, ever since Richard posted that he was running his car on the ST pads I have had in my mind to just run them and see what I think. I can always buy a set of track pads (like he ultimately did).
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      04-28-2012, 07:48 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin(OKC)
Quote:
Originally Posted by klammer View Post
Agreed with above posts. Alcons, AD08's, and pagids or carbotechs and I no longer worry about the brakes, but as stated earlier the weak link now becomes tires if on street tires running aggressive race pads. Not good or bad, just something to think about; more brakes than tires or vice versa....
Are you running the AD08's with 19" wheels? I'm really thinking I made a bonehead mistake buying these 19" wheels....damn impulse!

You know, ever since Richard posted that he was running his car on the ST pads I have had in my mind to just run them and see what I think. I can always buy a set of track pads (like he ultimately did).
Yeah, I'm running 19's, but I've always been the iconoclast, so par for the course. Don't really plan on going the R-comp route so will leave the 19's and am limited by the BBK as well, but that has become more of an excuse than reality... As an aside... What track you running at???
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      05-30-2012, 01:19 PM   #33
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Is it necessary to run the ST BBK on the rear with these cars? Are you really getting that much more stopping power in the rear over the OEM brakes? Would it cause an unbalance if you just went with front ST BBK?

I understand doing it for the appearance.
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      05-30-2012, 01:21 PM   #34
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Looks amazing!
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      05-30-2012, 01:49 PM   #35
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Is it necessary to run the ST BBK on the rear with these cars? Are you really getting that much more stopping power in the rear over the OEM brakes? Would it cause an unbalance if you just went with front ST BBK?

I understand doing it for the appearance.
I bought a BBK (not ST) for all four corners for my car, but due to some odd circumstances, the rear calipers had to be installed later, so I was able to experience the car at the track with just the front BBK, and then later with all 4 corners.

Here's my experiences:

-Going from 4 corners stock calipers to BBK in front, stock in back: MASSIVE difference. Cannot be overstated. Shaking steering wheel mostly gone, shuddering mostly gone, fade gone. The car would nose dive quite a bit because the front braking power was so dominant. That would get a bit weird because you could feel the rear tires weren't helping much in your braking efforts. Stopping mostly with 2 front tires can get weird if the road has problems like bumps or debris. You really want the rear tires doing some legitimate work. (I have been on stock suspension which also doesn't help----although that's changing soon).

-Going from front-only BBK to all 4 corners BBK. Subtle but noticeable difference. Shaking steering wheel completely gone, shuddering completely gone. The braking is smooth under all circumstances, it actually grabs your attention because previously you were constantly fighting these issues, and now they're gone and you can concentrate on something else while driving. The car doesn't nose dive as hard. It plants itself better. You feel more solid. (Hoping new suspension will help this even more.)

I change between street and race pads before/after events. I think this is critical to an all-around enjoyment on and off the track. However, putting rear BBK means doubling the number of pads that need to be changed. I tried running my DS2500 race pads in the rear all the time------squealllllllllll. I hate sounding like a bus stopping on the streets, plus it's harder on your rotors. So, if you're changing out pads, more calipers = more work. It does look great though!

So, in the end, is it MORE stopping power? It's a bit more. But what I would say is that is more STABLE and predictable stopping power because all four corners are working more evenly together.
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      05-30-2012, 04:37 PM   #36
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Good stuff. Thanks.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      05-31-2012, 03:20 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dogbone View Post
Well, again in my humble opinion, if you're gonna go the route of a BBK like the Trophy kit, you should take it all the way.....why stop short of pads?

I have Apex Arc-8 wheels and RS-3's along with my AP Racing BBK------they're awesome! I have Mintex F3R on the fronts and DS2500 on the back for the track.
I have Arc8's with RS-3's & the ST 60/40 kit with ST pads. Brakes great but late on the second lap @ the Ring I could feel them fade & smell. Definitely going with dedicated track pads just don't want to break the bank, nor do I want to cheap out & buy some that don't last or eat through rotors.
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      05-31-2012, 11:55 AM   #38
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I'm considering a BBK setup but is the Trophy worth it over the Standard stoptech? Trophy does look alot better
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