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      04-24-2012, 12:42 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce.augenstein@comcast. View Post
I personally think the C63 is a better daily driver than the M3, but in my fairly complete and detailed analysis of these cars (see "The Snake, The Mongoose, and The Zookeeper"), I said they were pretty much even overall, but that I'd take a six-speed M3, given the choice.




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Don't get mad at me, you are the one posting this stuff...
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      04-24-2012, 02:27 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Don't get mad at me, you are the one posting this stuff...
Not sure at all what the intent of this post was, but yes, I still think the C63 is a better daily driver, and yes, I'd still take the M3 since I can't seem to wean myself off a stick gearbox.

Hint: I think they're both daily drivers...
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      04-24-2012, 10:03 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine
I love when people post what they think is smart, but is really dumb.
Is that what you tell yourself every time you do not have something "smart" to write back.

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In all things measurable, the M3 is more economical.
Says who? What are "all things" that you believe are measurable?

Finally, thanks for rebutting your own post so we really didn't have to.
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      04-24-2012, 10:53 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by DiscoZ View Post
Is that what you tell yourself every time you do not have something "smart" to write back.



Says who? What are "all things" that you believe are measurable?

Finally, thanks for rebutting your own post so we really didn't have to.

You are easier than a college girl...

Things that can be measured:
Fuel Economy (MPG) -
Maintenance Expenses(Oil Changes/Services) -
Wear & Tear items (Tires/Brakes)
All of which favor the M3, what can you measure, that favors the economical argument for the C63??
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      04-25-2012, 12:07 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Nine View Post

You are easier than a college girl...

Things that can be measured:
Fuel Economy (MPG) -
Maintenance Expenses(Oil Changes/Services) -
Wear & Tear items (Tires/Brakes)
All of which favor the M3, what can you measure, that favors the economical argument for the C63??
... and your English comprehension is worse than a 5th grader. Let me guess, you consider regurgitating someone else’s argument to be a comeback you devised? Adding 20 "lol's" doesn't make your post more profound, BTW.

So, IN YOUR OPINION... factors identified and "measurable" by you make the M3 a better "daily driver"?

To respond to your points:

a) My C63 is 10.4 – 16.1//100 km; the M3 is 9.9 – 15.4l/100km – average difference is 0.6l/100km or rather insignificant;
b) These are mostly paid for by Mercedes, in fact;
(i) MB just replaced my brakes under warranty recently… something BMW did not do on either my M3 or Z4MC;
(ii) Oil changes are not included in MB service, however this could offset item 1 above;
(iii) Tire wear for me is approx. the same as I have painfully pointed out at least twice; and
c) My C63 is approx.. $5-7K cheaper (+13% tax) than my M3 – so please amortize that savings over the life of the vehicle and tell me if it offsets other items.

I am sure many of these change by region, etc. However, by your definition, not sure the M3 still comes out as a better “daily driver”… so not quite sure what your point is anymore in this context.

My point was: I enjoy driving my C63 more than my M3 everyday. Hence, better “daily driver” for me. You attempted to bring some form of quantum to this and represented it applied broadly by specifying your estimation of a quantitative measure; however your measure is subjective based on values you think matter - which could be flawed as per above.

Before you fire off a reply and attempt to insult me again to protect your online pride, consider what I say above. I am done wasting my time when it seems all you want to do is protect your e-warrior status.

Thanks.
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      04-25-2012, 01:08 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscoZ View Post
...

My point was: I enjoy driving my C63 more than my M3 everyday. Hence, better “daily driver” for me. You attempted to bring some form of quantum to this and represented it applied broadly by specifying your estimation of a quantitative measure; however your measure is subjective based on values you think matter - which could be flawed as per above.

Before you fire off a reply and attempt to insult me again to protect your online pride, consider what I say above. I am done wasting my time when it seems all you want to do is protect your e-warrior status.

Thanks.
Still didn't prove your point

I'm glad you are happy driving a c63amg, but you wanted to talk numbers, sometihng you failed to do. Your dealership not covering M3 brakes within service/maint warranty, sounds like there is more to the story. And alluding to similiar tire wear between the M3 and c63amg, sounds like you've never owned either. Curious, how much is an oil change, or a service at 40,000 miles on the MB?

I don't need to insult you, your posts do the work for me.
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      04-25-2012, 01:17 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Still didn't prove your point

I'm glad you are happy driving a c63amg, but you wanted to talk numbers, sometihng you failed to do. Your dealership not covering M3 brakes within service/maint warranty, sounds like there is more to the story. And alluding to similiar tire wear between the M3 and c63amg, sounds like you've never owned either. Curious, how much is an oil change, or a service at 40,000 miles on the MB?

I don't need to insult you, your posts do the work for me.
.... yawn. Really? That is your response?

Not wasting any more time on you as mine is likely worth much more than yours.
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      04-25-2012, 02:23 PM   #96
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All I know is I'd be more than happy with any of those MoFo's
LOL.... Same here...
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      04-25-2012, 02:43 PM   #97
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Using the parameters defining a better daily driver set by Nine, a Passat CC, Fiat 500, Toyota Camry are all better DD's then a BMW M3.
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You sound like my buddies who have AMG's - Slam the gas, slam the brakes...
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      04-25-2012, 02:52 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscoZ View Post
.... yawn. Really? That is your response?

Not wasting any more time on you as mine is likely worth much more than yours.

You're wasting your breathe, Disco. I've been down this road several times with several members. I've been labeled a 'troll' and have been banned several times. Do yourself a favor and leave this forum before you suffer the same fate. The admins and mods suck, there are 16 year olds that seem to claim that they bought the car(yeah right) but we all now daddy had something to do with it. There are fanboi's(as you can see) that refuse to accept the fact that the M3 isn't the holy grail and it's not god's gift to man. I haven't posted in awhile but I just thought I'd give you a heads up.
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You sound like my buddies who have AMG's - Slam the gas, slam the brakes...
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      04-25-2012, 03:24 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
You're wasting your breathe, Disco. I've been down this road several times with several members. I've been labeled a 'troll' and have been banned several times. Do yourself a favor and leave this forum before you suffer the same fate. The admins and mods suck, there are 16 year olds that seem to claim that they bought the car(yeah right) but we all now daddy had something to do with it. There are fanboi's(as you can see) that refuse to accept the fact that the M3 isn't the holy grail and it's not god's gift to man. I haven't posted in awhile but I just thought I'd give you a heads up.
Don't blame the world for your problems.

Hot|Ice, with all fairness and honesty, with economics and numbers in mind. Which car has a higher cost of ownership, including things like Price, MPG, Service, Maint and Wear & Tear.

In your opinion...


Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Using the parameters defining a better daily driver set by Nine, a Passat CC, Fiat 500, Toyota Camry are all better DD's then a BMW M3.
Yes. Thank you, so you agree Everyone has their own opinion of DD, nobody can argue which is a 'better DD', I already mentioned the Elise forum, and as a former s2000 owner, I know people have different opinions of "DD". But we can argue which is cheaper
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      04-25-2012, 05:04 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Don't blame the world for your problems.

Hot|Ice, with all fairness and honesty, with economics and numbers in mind. Which car has a higher cost of ownership, including things like Price, MPG, Service, Maint and Wear & Tear.

In your opinion...




Yes. Thank you, so you agree Everyone has their own opinion of DD, nobody can argue which is a 'better DD', I already mentioned the Elise forum, and as a former s2000 owner, I know people have different opinions of "DD". But we can argue which is cheaper
Any kind of 'free' maintenance is a hoax. It's not free. You've already paid for it in the MSRP of the car.(As Scott would say, there is no 'business case' for offering free service. BMW would be losing millions of dollars) As far as gas and cost of ownership, the MB will be a tad higher but I will say that the difference is so little(almost a grand difference) that if you can't afford it, you really shouldn't be driving either vehicle.

An interesting link:

http://editorial.autos.msn.com/artic...mentid=1088569
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You sound like my buddies who have AMG's - Slam the gas, slam the brakes...
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      04-25-2012, 05:19 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
You're wasting your breathe, Disco. I've been down this road several times with several members. I've been labeled a 'troll' and have been banned several times. Do yourself a favor and leave this forum before you suffer the same fate. The admins and mods suck, there are 16 year olds that seem to claim that they bought the car(yeah right) but we all now daddy had something to do with it. There are fanboi's(as you can see) that refuse to accept the fact that the M3 isn't the holy grail and it's not god's gift to man. I haven't posted in awhile but I just thought I'd give you a heads up.
You're right... logic doesn't seem to resonate. Neither does showing someone that his argument is self-contradictory or grounded in subjective selection of variables – which will also likely lead to a conclusion that is not what that person sought.
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      04-25-2012, 09:02 PM   #102
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You're right... logic doesn't seem to resonate. Neither does showing someone that his argument is self-contradictory or grounded in subjective selection of variables – which will also likely lead to a conclusion that is not what that person sought.
I think it is now obvious to me, you don't own a c63amg. To say that Tire wear and MPG are equal to an M3, just about nullifies any semantics you care to craft. Oh and, to allude that BMW does not cover brakes, is to use unsubstantiated anecdotal stories to build some sort of argument. The fact of the matter is that the c63amg and M3 are equally priced (base msrp). But the c63 gets worse MPG, wears out tires faster, and does not come with free service. The only real argument you could come up was that the tank in the M3 is smaller than the c63, not enough to prove your point. And not enough to mount your high horse.

When you engage in discourse, you can't just walk away and quit, well you can, when you have failed to prove your point. Even your buddy Hot|Ice agrees that the c63amg is marginally more expensive, I'm willing to bet he didn't want to post that it was more expensive since he hates agreeing with me.


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      04-25-2012, 09:42 PM   #103
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Having owned both, the C63 is more expensive to operate. I'm getting notably worse gas mileage and tire wear is more pronounced. The C63 is covered for wear and tear (brakes included) in Canada whereas the M3 was not. This may be different in the US. However, regular maintenance was covered on the M3 (oil changes) and not on the C63.

If day to day costs are how you determine the better DD car, the C63 loses IMO. If you define the better DD car to be the one that sounds aggressive and has more easily attainable power then, IMO, the C63 wins. What makes a car a better daily car is subjective and what one of us values will be different than another. Heck, what I value in a DD car changes from week to week .
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      04-25-2012, 09:43 PM   #104
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Since I drive mostly city miles I've gotten around 13.5 mpg in my '11 M3. I averaged 14.0 over the life of my '09 C63.

I replaced the rear tires on the C63 every 6K miles. They would hit the wear bars there and with living in a rainy area it just wasn't safe to keep using them.

The rear tires on my '11 M3 are at 6600 miles and I'm shocked at the amount of tread I have left. I'm hoping for 12K miles out of them.
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      04-25-2012, 10:07 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine View Post
I think it is now obvious to me, you don't own a c63amg. To say that Tire wear and MPG are equal to an M3, just about nullifies any semantics you care to craft. Oh and, to allude that BMW does not cover brakes, is to use unsubstantiated anecdotal stories to build some sort of argument. The fact of the matter is that the c63amg and M3 are equally priced (base msrp). But the c63 gets worse MPG, wears out tires faster, and does not come with free service. The only real argument you could come up was that the tank in the M3 is smaller than the c63, not enough to prove your point. And not enough to mount your high horse.

When you engage in discourse, you can't just walk away and quit, well you can, when you have failed to prove your point. Even your buddy Hot|Ice agrees that the c63amg is marginally more expensive, I'm willing to bet he didn't want to post that it was more expensive since he hates agreeing with me.


man, you are one argumentative and annoying poster

your incessent arguments over the most insignificant of semantics issues is very irritating and takes away from the point of the thread.

both the c63 and m3 are great cars, but different. i enjoy driving the c63 more than the m3 because the fun can be had at lower speeds, where the m3 has to get ragged out to squeeze the fun out of it. I dont have the time or desire to commit to more than a few track days a year, so for me, the c63 is a more fun DD type car.

neither of these cars are remotely cost effective to run, so the minimal differences id imagine arent critical for most owners, myself included.
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      04-25-2012, 10:09 PM   #106
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I'm with GBlansten in this thread.

1. He's pretty damn funny.
2. I find myself always agreeing with his posts.
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      04-25-2012, 10:16 PM   #107
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Quote:
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I'm with GBlansten in this thread.

1. He's pretty damn funny.
2. I find myself always agreeing with his posts.
You agree with yourself?
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You sound like my buddies who have AMG's - Slam the gas, slam the brakes...
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      04-25-2012, 10:17 PM   #108
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You agree with yourself?
Indeed
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      04-25-2012, 11:18 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine View Post
I think it is now obvious to me, you don't own a c63amg. To say that Tire wear and MPG are equal to an M3, just about nullifies any semantics you care to craft. Oh and, to allude that BMW does not cover brakes, is to use unsubstantiated anecdotal stories to build some sort of argument. The fact of the matter is that the c63amg and M3 are equally priced (base msrp). But the c63 gets worse MPG, wears out tires faster, and does not come with free service. The only real argument you could come up was that the tank in the M3 is smaller than the c63, not enough to prove your point. And not enough to mount your high horse.

When you engage in discourse, you can't just walk away and quit, well you can, when you have failed to prove your point. Even your buddy Hot|Ice agrees that the c63amg is marginally more expensive, I'm willing to bet he didn't want to post that it was more expensive since he hates agreeing with me.


You really cannot read nor logically reason.

Here are threads for my car and mods being sold:

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667996
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667596

Additionally, not sure if you noticed, I live in Canada. We use the metric system (on my 0.6l/100km comment which you did not comprehend, is NOT the gas tank).

The C63 costs ~$6K less here fully loaded and I pay 13% tax on everything.

I also pay less insurance on my C63.

BMW Canada doesn't cover brakes. MB Canada does. BMW pays for oil services. In my book, the two are equal; I also changed oil more frequently on my M3 and Z4MC and will on the C63.

Tires: I go to the track a few times a year so any tire will die fast for me, as my Z4MC and M3 tires did. Even if they didn't: $600/year for rears by your argument (discounted in the future for PV) over 3-4 years of ownership doesn't along cover a $6K + 13% difference in present value dollars.

Run the numbers, if you can. I already have. Grow up while you are doing it. Learn how to read before you run your mouth. Helps with getting your foot / feet out of it later on.

In either case, even if you were right... you are right in a construct you have invented (called "straw-man") and not what I or anyone else meant.

Here - a consolation prize for you: I never meant to disrespect the M3. I am so sorry. Now, please stop giving me --and everyone else-- headaches with your utter lack of anything to say but troll.

BTW - Just so you know, I had your car. I still like it. People like you give it a bad name. Sell it and buy a Honda Civic SI. Seriously, please just stop it. For your own sake.
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      04-25-2012, 11:21 PM   #110
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Quote:
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both the c63 and m3 are great cars, but different. i enjoy driving the c63 more than the m3 because the fun can be had at lower speeds, where the m3 has to get ragged out to squeeze the fun out of it. I dont have the time or desire to commit to more than a few track days a year, so for me, the c63 is a more fun DD type car.
That's all I meant and he went on his diatribe about costs, etc. Which for me (a) don't matter, and (b) are actually not stacked in the M3's favour. Either way, I wish I could keep both. Unfortunately the wife will not let me keep a third daily driven car.
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