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      04-12-2012, 02:09 PM   #1
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Worst dyno ever? - Update

Went for my first "baseline" dyno run last week before putting on the Akra midpipe I bought, and the results look pretty bad. Did 4 pulls on their Dynojet, all fairly consistent results. My car is an 08 E90 (2/08 build), 6MT, running Shell 91 Octane and the only relevant mod installed now is an Akra rear section. Overall conditions were warm (high 80s) but that shouldn't have been an issue.

Trying not to go off the deep end here but any suggestions for things to look for as possible issues? I can't believe these results are within normal variance of the S65. I am in Denver but the results shown below have been adjusted. (see further down for unadjusted results)



I am the original owner and never have had a tune. Service issues have been relatively minor. BMW did reprogram the car 12-18 months ago trying to find an electric gremlin in the stereo and it mentioned other "updates"... Thanks in advance.
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Last edited by signes; 11-14-2012 at 11:57 AM.
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      04-12-2012, 02:21 PM   #2
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      04-12-2012, 02:32 PM   #3
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About 38k right now.
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      04-12-2012, 02:40 PM   #4
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Did they log IAT, AFR, or any timing values?

Did they have significant fans pointed at the correct places on the car?

MT or DCT? Which gear did they dyno in?
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      04-12-2012, 02:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by signes View Post
About 38k right now.
We've seen the same on MY08s, just had another one last week with gains of ~16whp after updates were applied. If the vehicle was purchased used, there is a chance no updates were ever applied or worse - an early performance tune loaded with no follow-up diagnostics.

A VIN check with your dealer will show maintenance history. Since you're the original owner - this is a bit easier to backtrack. BMW reprogramming for electrical gremlins doesn't necessarily mean the DME was touched.

Check the condition of your plugs and have the DME reprogrammed with the latest updates (v2.46.x) and dyno again with a new tank of fuel. It's certain your lost power is within one (or multiple) of those variables, assuming dyno procedures were properly followed.
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      04-12-2012, 02:51 PM   #6
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i have an early 08 build also and love the car but am scared i might be in the same boat. i did already have the software updated previously by bmw then again by evolve. seems the later years have a little more hp even though bmw choose not to advertise it.
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      04-12-2012, 03:33 PM   #7
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I asked the dealer to update the software in my 08E90M3 and they refused. They will do only what BMW will pay for (meaning the car must "need" an update due to a problem) unless you want to pay them.

I noticed you are in CO and on 91 octane. Altitude costs 3% per 1000 feet and 91 octane costs another 3 percent, but the SAE correction should have dealt with the altitude.

I will get mine on a dyno this year to see how it fares.
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      04-12-2012, 03:39 PM   #8
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I would get the updates and do basic maintainence. New airfilter (maybe at this time get a AFE, BMC, MS or other replacement filter). I mean my baseline dyno for my 2011 M3 was 345rwhp and almost 260 tq. This was the mid base numbers from the 3 runs..Car only had 1500 miles on her, but it did have 93 octane.



To be off by almost 40rwhp is a ton, unless the dyno operator did something wrong.

BTW, the day of this dyno they strapped down a brand new 2011 Mustang GT 5.0 and it did 366rwhp/350tq...I felt small and puny..

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      04-12-2012, 03:41 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
Did they log IAT, AFR, or any timing values?

Did they have significant fans pointed at the correct places on the car?

MT or DCT? Which gear did they dyno in?
Car is 6MT.

I've got the run files and looked at the results in WinPEP - can I see using that software if the other variables were recorded? They had several large fans running, 2-3 of which were right in front of the main intake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tom @ eas View Post
We've seen the same on MY08s, just had another one last week with gains of ~16whp after updates were applied. If the vehicle was purchased used, there is a chance no updates were ever applied or worse - an early performance tune loaded with no follow-up diagnostics.

A VIN check with your dealer will show maintenance history. Since you're the original owner - this is a bit easier to backtrack. BMW reprogramming for electrical gremlins doesn't necessarily mean the DME was touched.

Check the condition of your plugs and have the DME reprogrammed with the latest updates (v2.46.x) and dyno again with a new tank of fuel. It's certain your lost power is within one (or multiple) of those variables, assuming dyno procedures were properly followed.
I am the original owner (from ~30 miles) and have all service history. I had one CEL issue previously but I think it was a bad O2 sensor or something minor, otherwise no issues. They did reprogram the DME, will check the version from the service records. They said they took the opportunity to do all available updates applicable to my car.

I will try with another batch of fuel and try and corroborate the results. I talked to the dealer and they said unless there is a fault, there is nothing they can do (I would have to pay to have it reprogrammed to the latest version.) Is the v2.46.x applicable to 6MT cars?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
i have an early 08 build also and love the car but am scared i might be in the same boat. i did already have the software updated previously by bmw then again by evolve. seems the later years have a little more hp even though bmw choose not to advertise it.
Would be curious to see other results. I have seen several around 320 or so but nothing this low...
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      04-12-2012, 03:42 PM   #10
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Oh boy, my '08 with typical bolt-ons goes in for an Evolve tune and before and after dyno. I hope I fare better than you. I must say, my M3 doesn't feel feel like it has 100+ more HP than my old 350Z with bolt-ons. I'm kinda worried.
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      04-12-2012, 03:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post

To be off by almost 40rwhp is a ton, unless the dyno operator did something wrong.

Dave
Exactly, this is what worries me most. It is so far out of line that it cannot be explained by production variance. Also, 91 octane is the highest out here. I saw an article of how octane and altitude interact but can't find it now. To really make me cry, here are the unadjusted results...



The dyno shop has done 50+ E9x M3 runs and showed me some of the other results under similar conditions. The other cars were around ~340whp.
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Last edited by signes; 04-12-2012 at 03:52 PM.
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      04-12-2012, 03:52 PM   #12
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Disappointing numbers
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      04-12-2012, 04:04 PM   #13
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      04-12-2012, 05:00 PM   #14
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What is the correction factor SAE here?? Looks like 20%!

What gear was this done in?

Can you post up the conditions please. If the barometric pressure is extremely low it might explain the very poor results.

Log the ignition timing.
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      04-12-2012, 05:19 PM   #15
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Am I the only person who sees nothing wrong with this dyno sheet?

The numbers doesn't mean anything. It may just be a low reading dyno, and a very consistent one that is.

What we should look for is consistency, and then do some mods and check the delta.
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      04-12-2012, 05:25 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sal@Evolve View Post
What is the correction factor SAE here?? Looks like 20%!

What gear was this done in?

Can you post up the conditions please. If the barometric pressure is extremely low it might explain the very poor results.

Log the ignition timing.
SAE correction factor is shown as 1.27. Pulls in 4th. Conditions:

Temp: 88.4F - 90.18F
Bar Pressure: 24.13 - 24.19 in-Hg
Humidity: 5%

Uploaded one of the run files if anybody is interesting in looking at more. Not sure how to see if they logged more data.
Attached Files
File Type: zip RunFile_003 signes.zip (3.7 KB, 43 views)
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      04-12-2012, 05:34 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
I would get the updates and do basic maintainence. New airfilter (maybe at this time get a AFE, BMC, MS or other replacement filter). I mean my baseline dyno for my 2011 M3 was 345rwhp and almost 260 tq. This was the mid base numbers from the 3 runs..Car only had 1500 miles on her, but it did have 93 octane.



To be off by almost 40rwhp is a ton, unless the dyno operator did something wrong.
...yet another strong 2011 dyno though. Something is weird.
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      04-12-2012, 06:56 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kawchkjf View Post
Am I the only person who sees nothing wrong with this dyno sheet?

The numbers doesn't mean anything. It may just be a low reading dyno, and a very consistent one that is.

What we should look for is consistency, and then do some mods and check the delta.
Normally, I think that everyone would agree with you but this particular dyno is just too low. Something here is not right.
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      04-12-2012, 07:02 PM   #19
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Try and find out what other stock m3s have put up on that particular dyno.

Some won't agree, but a quick run against another m3 will quickly let you know if you're down on power.
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      04-12-2012, 08:05 PM   #20
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What kind of Dyno is it?
Higher octane gas is available at Hill petroleum/Sunoco / vpfuels in Denver FYI
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      04-12-2012, 08:22 PM   #21
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I'm going to look at this file later tonight !
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      04-12-2012, 08:24 PM   #22
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6000ft above sea level (denver) will do that to you. Never seen a dyno fully correct for it.
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