BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > M3 (E90 / E92 / E93) > Regional Forums > Canada
 
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-30-2012, 07:58 AM   #45
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3-Mike View Post
I'm still waiting on my NT05s so this "snow" thing might be a good thing as I can run on my winter tires!!
The snows are still on my wifes 335is so maybe I should just borrow it

Actually.With the latest forecast I do not think snows will be needed

SaturdayMainly cloudy. 40 percent chance of flurries early in the morning. Clearing in the evening. High 9. SundayCloudy with 60 percent chance of showers. Low zero. High 8. MondaySunny. Low plus 2. High 11. TuesdayShowers. Low plus 2. High 10. WednesdayCloudy with 60 percent chance of showers. Low plus 4. High 9. ThursdayA mix of sun and cloud. Low plus 1. High 9.
Appreciate 0
      04-01-2012, 11:35 PM   #46
gbrett5
Hammerhead
gbrett5's Avatar
Canada
2
Rep
106
Posts

 
Drives: 08 E90 M3 (SG)
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto, ON Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gearhead999s View Post
The snows are still on my wifes 335is so maybe I should just borrow it

Actually.With the latest forecast I do not think snows will be needed

SaturdayMainly cloudy. 40 percent chance of flurries early in the morning. Clearing in the evening. High 9. SundayCloudy with 60 percent chance of showers. Low zero. High 8. MondaySunny. Low plus 2. High 11. TuesdayShowers. Low plus 2. High 10. WednesdayCloudy with 60 percent chance of showers. Low plus 4. High 9. ThursdayA mix of sun and cloud. Low plus 1. High 9.
So "face for radio weatherman", how did the day go? I hear you were short a couple Hammerhead Miatas but that an old M5 showed up for good measure. Good day?
Appreciate 0
      04-02-2012, 07:24 AM   #47
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gbrett5 View Post
So "face for radio weatherman", how did the day go? I hear you were short a couple Hammerhead Miatas but that an old M5 showed up for good measure. Good day?
Yep the woolly one did drop by & see us but the Miata of targa fame did not see any track duty

We had a great day in spite of the weather which had greated us to this 1st thing in the AM.


The track was wet all day long and was quite slick which made for a lot of fun IMO We spent a good part of the morning working on exerises including an excellent trail braking exerise from higher speeds.We had a great turnout considering the weather with lots of M3's and a new GT3 4.0 whose owner was out on the track almost the complete morning having fun.I think I saw his headlights when I should not have,but he was far from being the only one to have this issue during the day.It was a great day for learning and a lot of fun was had!

Last edited by Gearhead999s; 04-02-2012 at 08:08 AM.
Appreciate 0
      04-02-2012, 09:06 PM   #48
MaxL
Captain
Canada
18
Rep
952
Posts

 
Drives: E90 M3, Cayenne T, 991 GT3
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bay Area

iTrader: (0)

That was an interesting day. I never had that little traction on a track before (near-freezing temps and aggressive tires do not mix well). One of the things that was throwing me off was that I never felt how much grip I had, and many of grip loss situations were completely unexpected. At times it was like driving in a videogame with poor physics model and no force feedback - very unsettling. Never had this before even in rainy weather.

Only on the way home I realized why it might have been that way. I see two reasons:

1. There was no perceivable (to me) slip before complete loss of traction. In dry, the car is always slipping a little when cornering (without breaking off) and based on that you know you how close you are to the limit. In those conditions the slip before break off was so small that I often could not feel it - probably a result of very cold & wet rubber having different traction vs. slip angle curve or just overall g-forces being too low for my "sensors" to perceive the difference.

2. Wet line was crossing the dry line on most corner exists with moments when one rear wheel was on very slippery stuff and the other had much better traction. Applying too much power then threw rear more violently and less predictably. Probably explains why the car was less predictable when I drove the wet line Al showed me vs. the dry line - driving dry line was slower, but loss of traction was easier to manage there.

Anyway, it was great to start the season and see everyone.
Appreciate 0
      04-02-2012, 09:39 PM   #49
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxL View Post
That was an interesting day. I never had that little traction on a track before (near-freezing temps and aggressive tires do not mix well). One of the things that was throwing me off was that I never felt how much grip I had, and many of grip loss situations were completely unexpected. At times it was like driving in a videogame with poor physics model and no force feedback - very unsettling. Never had this before even in rainy weather.

Only on the way home I realized why it might have been that way. I see two reasons:

1. There was no perceivable (to me) slip before complete loss of traction. In dry, the car is always slipping a little when cornering (without breaking off) and based on that you know you how close you are to the limit. In those conditions the slip before break off was so small that I often could not feel it - probably a result of very cold & wet rubber having different traction vs. slip angle curve or just overall g-forces being too low for my "sensors" to perceive the difference.

2. Wet line was crossing the dry line on most corner exists with moments when one rear wheel was on very slippery stuff and the other had much better traction. Applying too much power then threw rear more violently and less predictably. Probably explains why the car was less predictable when I drove the wet line Al showed me vs. the dry line - driving dry line was slower, but loss of traction was easier to manage there.

Anyway, it was great to start the season and see everyone.
Max that is why I ran yesterday on my street PS2 setup.I think my NT05 track setup would have been a disaster in those conditions and would have behaved like your car did.I could not use full throttle at all and I was getting wheelspin over the mild hump on the back straight in 3rd gear at 3/4 throttleA great way to get warmed for the season!
Appreciate 0
      04-02-2012, 09:54 PM   #50
STALKER
Brigadier General
50
Rep
3,663
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 E90 M3, 991 C4S, 997 GT3
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto, ON

iTrader: (5)

I think I could have ran the track faster then drive it in those conditions with my RS-3s.

The skid pad was a lot of fun though in cold wet conditions.
__________________

2008 AW/FR E90 M3-SOLD
2013 991 C4S-SOLD
2010 GT3
Appreciate 0
      04-03-2012, 09:26 AM   #51
sawzall
Major
sawzall's Avatar
Canada
24
Rep
1,277
Posts

 
Drives: A Car
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 911S  [5.00]
2011 911 GT3 RS  [0.00]
I'm glad I went with the PSS. They definitely had more grip then my NT05. Driving in those conditions was pretty interesting.

Here's a video from my last session on the track. I was too chicken to try the 'aggressive' rain line I was shown - I couldn't judge the braking area properly because it crossed the dry racing line, and so you would get grip, lose it and gain it again after crossing the line. So I pretty much just tried to stay inside of the dry line where I could get grip.
Appreciate 0
      04-03-2012, 04:44 PM   #52
Schweigun
Fear De Vier
Schweigun's Avatar
Canada
0
Rep
6
Posts

 
Drives: 2006 BMW Z4 M Coupe, Black
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto, ON

iTrader: (0)

An amazing day in an amazing car

I had a blast, from beginning to end. Could have done without the bitter cold and definitely visited the port-o-potty one too many times (fuck that was nasty), but in terms of rain on the track I think it's the best thing because you can have fun and keep the rubber on your tires. The car was a thing of beauty, absolutely amazing. I love it, we're in love, that's all there is to say. The connection of Man & Machine has been made. As Cleo McDowell said in coming to America, "I don't know whether to bow or shake your hand or kiss it... he he... I feel like breakdancin!"

Incidentally my track day was almost ruined that very morning with an EML light that came on bringing the car to a crawl near my house. Thanks to Pej's advice (turn the car off and back on, yeah!) I was up and running again and we set off to the track. I think the car was being a diva and was pissed at for leaving it alone for two days. I dropped it off at the dealer today to check out the EML issue and they called me back to say that it is just a fault in the main engine computer and that a software patch will cover it, 2hrs labour. He said the good news was that my coverage one warranty would cover it, but I have a $200 deductible so that doesn't help me all that much. Then he said that if that doesn't work there's more good news (the first bit was considered good news) and that is the this part is actually covered for 8 years regardless of the condition. So I told him "wait a minute, you're telling me that you can do a software patch that MIGHT work and I'll pay $200 for that, and if that doesn't work don't worry cause the part is covered under warranty?". He says yes that's how BMW instructs them to do it. OK!! Anyways $200 is a low number for any BMW service and I would gladly pay it for a permanent fix but why would I dish out that money on a "MAYBE it will fix the issue"? Yeah it'll patch it until I'm out of the 8 years and then I'll have to pay to replace the part lol.

Ok back to the track day. I love being reminded how amazing cars can be when 4 little patches of rubber can keep you traveling at those crazy speeds in the wet. Well 4 patches and tons of research, chemistry, and engineering genius. I can fully admit that the DSC was carrying me but I didn't turn it off because I enjoyed the speeds it allowed me to achieve. I also love how in sport mode it let me goof around a bit. I suppose if I had started the day with it completely off I would have built up a pretty good speed, but I wanted my money's worth and I got it!

Thanks also to all who gave me driving tips, Jay, and the guy in the Integra (didn't catch his name). And finally, Duncan I bow to you... Driving God!!!! Your car control is epic and I will work at it until I'm there.
Appreciate 0
      04-06-2012, 05:09 PM   #53
Gearhead999s
Major General
Gearhead999s's Avatar
93
Rep
6,814
Posts

 
Drives: F25 2.8d(wifes)F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

A video from the day from our friend Scoty.


Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:09 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST