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      02-23-2012, 03:13 AM   #1
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LTBMW - not a reputable way to conduct business

A negative experience with LTBMW

I've been a member of these forums for a long time, and I have to say that my experience working with companies on these forums has been pretty amazing. In all my years on these forums, I've had nothing but positive things to say about the many great companies that we're so familiar with here on these forums, many of whom are sponsors. But my experience with LTBMW was so negative, that I think its only right that other people on this forum know my story, so they know what kind of company they're dealing with, if they decide to take a risk on LTBMW.

(For those who don't want to read through the details, the summary is at the very end)

On Friday, I called LTBMW to get a price on KW Clubsports. I got on the phone with Long Tran. He seemed eager to earn my business, which I appreciated. We discussed all the details of my car, and without any haggling, Long offered me a good price: $2500 with installation included. At the time though, I wasn't entirely sure though whether I wanted to go with clubsports, or with something a little more affordable like RDsport springs. So i asked Long if i could take a couple of days before I placed my order. Long replied "yeah, just give me a call anytime before next thursday if you want to have them installed on saturday."

Flash forward to today (wednesday), just 5 days later. I called up LTBMW excited to place my order. I spoke to Long and said "i'm ready to pull the trigger for the clubsports." We discussed the details again - $2500, free installation. Long again confirmed these prices and then transferred me to another guy who was going to take my credit card information and finalize the order. After I was transferred over, and they had taken all my information, including my credit card number,I asked if they could email or call me back to schedule an appointment time for Saturday to come in and get them installed. "Sure no problem" he said.

Three hours later, I got a phone call from Long. "I got some bad news for you..... I can't honor that price anymore." Long then proceeded to tell me that somehow in the 5 day span between my original order and today, (Not to mention the three hour span between his reconfirmation of the price earlier in the day) that KW had somehow hiked prices on the clubsports by over SIX HUNDRED FIFTY DOLLARS (to $3,150). "Sasan, I swear to you they just increased the prices, I have no control over this." Suffice it to say, I find that more than a little hard to believe. KW has never had a price jump anywhere near that in the entire history of the product. The excuse was more than a little convenient. I'm willing to bet that anyone who sells KW can confirm that there was no $650 price increase in the past 5 days.

As upset as I was over such a huge price jump, I told Long I would still do the deal. Thinking that the deal was done, I got ready to finalize the details with Long.

But believe it or not, that wasn't the worst of it. The part that really set me off happened next. After spiking the price up on me by that much, Long THEN told me "I'll cut you a deal and give you installation for 200 instead of 250." I COULDNT BELIEVE IT !!. In disbelief, I told him, that our deal which we had twice confirmed was 2500 including free installation and "now you're going to charge me 200 on TOP of the 650 price hike??" First Long started off by saying "he had promised me no such thing." But he quickly backed off of that approach, realizing how many times we had gone over the fact that the installation would be free. Instead he said "I just can't do free installation for you anymore."

My response was "Long, I can understand you might have a price hike on parts, and that you're a slave to that price hike, which is why I agreed to do the deal with you even despite the absurd price hike..... But that price hike on the parts has nothing to do with your promise to offer me free installation. There is no outside force causing you to jack the price of installation up. You can claim that the price hike on the clubsports was out of your control, but you can't claim that the price hike on installation is out of your control." It didn't seem to matter to Long, and he offered no rhyme or reason for the price hike on the installation other than that's just how he wanted to do it. Long told me "that's the price, Sasan, I won't go any lower. Take it or leave it."

Out of principal.... I left it.


Summary: To me a good company is one that keeps its word. LTBMW is a company that will back out on its quotes and promises to its customers when it suits them, and manufacture lies in the proces. After quoting me 2500 for a set of KW clubsports they manufactured a phony story to get out of a price they had quoted me, only to jack the price up on me by 33% (850 dollars) and break a few promises in the process.

I'm sorry for the rant guys, but if you want to do business with a company on these forums, I recommend companies like EAS and IND that will stand behind their quotes and promises, and actually go OUT OF THEIR WAY to right their wrongs, in the name of good customer service. Not only did LTBMW not right its wrongs, they made them worse. Customer service matters nothing to them.

- esquire
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      02-23-2012, 03:29 AM   #2
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Interesting read...
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      02-23-2012, 03:33 AM   #3
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Good for you to leave it!
Can't believe you would still do the deal at $3150 though
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      02-23-2012, 03:36 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dukeM3 View Post
Good for you to leave it!
Can't believe you would still do the deal at $3150 though
For KW Clubsports? Damn man, I'm surprised he even got offered $2500 in the first place. Clubsports aren't V3's, they retail for around $3700.

Wrong section by the way.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=271

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Originally Posted by e92_m3 View Post
Interesting read...
Indeed, interesting read....the few times I have dealt with LTBMW Long and Ivan have been great with me.

Last edited by LateBraking; 02-23-2012 at 03:46 AM.
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      02-23-2012, 03:39 AM   #5
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omg... i'm completely shocked that they -Long especially- would even do such a thing. smh
totally uncharacteristic of them, all my years on here, this's the 1st time i've heard them do wrong.
i really hope they fix this, they need 2.
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      02-23-2012, 03:41 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LateBraking View Post
For KW Clubsports? Damn man, I'm surprised he even got offered $2500 in the first place. Clubsports aren't V3's, they retail for around $3700.

Wrong section by the way.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=271



Indeed, interesting read....
Late Breaking, I knew the price was good. The issue was that Long, backed out on me after offering the quote. Long is no rookie in the business, he knows the prices of clubsports.
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      02-23-2012, 04:30 AM   #7
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While I don't agree about Long not offering the free installation I can vouch that KW has indeed raised their prices very recently. You can ask any vendor on the forum.
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      02-23-2012, 04:52 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LateBraking View Post
For KW Clubsports? Damn man, I'm surprised he even got offered $2500 in the first place. Clubsports aren't V3's, they retail for around $3700.
+1!

Just like you said, a set of those KW Clubsports cost around $3700. That price of $3700 also depends on whether your m3 has EDC or not.

Anyways, I was also shocked to see that Long charged the OP $2500 for the KW Clubsports with free installation. As far as I know, the KW V3's are the ones that comes close to Long's quote of $2500. KW V3's cost around $2800 a set.

Micommunication between OP and Long maybe???
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      02-23-2012, 07:07 AM   #9
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Did you try contacting other vendors right after the price change to see if this were true? EAS is close by too, no?
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      02-23-2012, 07:11 AM   #10
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KW V3'S to do not cost 2800 a set. its more like 2100-2300 either way what they did is wrong with offering free install and then changing the deal at the end when the buyer committed to purchasing the suspension.

To be honest with you in all of my years modifying cars most retail business's and shops really dont know shit about their products, or customer service. The ones that do know whats up are the ones that you never hear anything bad about anyway.

To the OP the price does seem OK but at the same time they shouldnt have quoted you mutiple times one thing and then try to switch it up on you.

Tisk Tisk LTBMW
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      02-23-2012, 10:05 AM   #11
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Wow.... Try contacting supreme power. They gave good deals for different parts. I'm an very satisfied with there pricing and customer service.
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      02-23-2012, 10:14 AM   #12
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Sorry to hear. Isn't Long the owner? Sounds to me like he mixed up the prices and didn't realize it until you decided to actually purchase then came up with a bogus excuse.
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      02-23-2012, 10:16 AM   #13
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Very Interesting...I wanted to get my spring install with LTBMW.. but realized when i was at the meet i was a little hesitant on doing it... Im pretty sure he was probably looking at the V3's price LOL... so the easy excuse is a price hiked.... i could understand that he needs to stick with the new price hiked.. and props to OP for sticking with it... im sure it was an honest mistake but shit tell the customer the truth and im sure the OP knows exactly how much the suspension cost in the beggining.... i know its BS but it would have been better if he said it upfront and told you the truth... and since they made a mistake... i would have offered the installation and sticked with it.. but charging you more with that and saying take it or leave it.. LOL fawk that... good thing you left it... little things like this will not make me do business with them...

if i ever do it... i suggest to go with MRF Engineering... Contact Malek... not sure if he can get you the parts but if you want any work done to you car hes the best guy to go to...
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      02-23-2012, 11:18 AM   #14
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Wow, that is some B.S.
Not only did he loose you as a potential customer he just lost a lot more business over this...
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      02-23-2012, 11:31 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
Sorry to hear. Isn't Long the owner? Sounds to me like he mixed up the prices and didn't realize it until you decided to actually purchase then came up with a bogus excuse.
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      02-23-2012, 12:53 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean05 View Post
Very Interesting...I wanted to get my spring install with LTBMW.. but realized when i was at the meet i was a little hesitant on doing it... Im pretty sure he was probably looking at the V3's price LOL... so the easy excuse is a price hiked.... i could understand that he needs to stick with the new price hiked.. and props to OP for sticking with it... im sure it was an honest mistake but shit tell the customer the truth and im sure the OP knows exactly how much the suspension cost in the beggining.... i know its BS but it would have been better if he said it upfront and told you the truth... and since they made a mistake... i would have offered the installation and sticked with it.. but charging you more with that and saying take it or leave it.. LOL fawk that... good thing you left it... little things like this will not make me do business with them...

if i ever do it... i suggest to go with MRF Engineering... Contact Malek... not sure if he can get you the parts but if you want any work done to you car hes the best guy to go to...
Didn't they install the upside down StopTechs and loose brake lines?

http://m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=641714

EAS & IND has always treated me great!
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      02-23-2012, 12:54 PM   #17
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I'm sorry to hear about your experience and I can confirm that KW did in fact increase pricing early Feb. for 2012. We are an authorized dealer for KW and can install them at our facility as well so feel free to drop me a PM and I'd be more than happy to help you guys out.
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      02-23-2012, 12:55 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esquire View Post
A negative experience with LTBMW

Long told me "that's the price, Sasan, I won't go any lower. Take it or leave it."

Out of principal.... I left it.


- esquire
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      02-23-2012, 01:25 PM   #19
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i went there once...to do a small thing...they quoted me $40 over the phone and when they finished, i was in longs office to pay and he charged me an additional $20...he said i was given the wrong price.....at the end of the day, i paid him the extra 20..since it meant SO MUCH to him....SHADE is the only word that comes to mind when i think of them.

So, OP, im definitely NOT surprised he changed the terms of the deal on u like that...it just says alot about what kind of principles they have...i think the only people that rave about them on yelp and forums are because those people are their circle of friends or relatives.
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      02-23-2012, 01:45 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m3heaven View Post
While I don't agree about Long not offering the free installation I can vouch that KW has indeed raised their prices very recently. You can ask any vendor on the forum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by **********s.com View Post
I'm sorry to hear about your experience and I can confirm that KW did in fact increase pricing early Feb. for 2012. We are an authorized dealer for KW and can install them at our facility as well so feel free to drop me a PM and I'd be more than happy to help you guys out.

Even though I think a company should stick to its quotes, especially where, as here, we went over them several times and there was no ambiguity as to the make or model of my car or the part that i was requesting, you can see that I agreed (hesitantly) to move forward with the agreement and deal with the ridiculous markup, which in a best case scenario was a very bad mistake on his part, or in the worst case scenario it was done intentionally to get out of a deal that wasn't going to make them much.

I appreciate that those who are familiar here with KW pricing are saying that there was a price hike sometime in early february. Can anyone confirm that the price hike occured after February 17th (the date of my first conversation with Long)? The 17th doesn't exactly strike me as early february. But all that aside, can anyone confirm that the price hike was $650 ? If anyone can vouch for that amount or that date, please let me know.

But again, I was (begrudgingly) willing to eat that price hike and deal with Long renegging on a quote. I was still going to move forward. What really bothered me was that rather than give me the installation for free as he had originally promised - or even assuming he never promised me that (which he did), that he didn't say "okay in the name of righting a wrong and customer service I'll give you the install for free" - he went out of his way to tack on installation.

Clearly, I'm frustrated. And I apologize to everyone here for showing my frustration. But that's just not right. I can't recommend LTBMW to anyone here. Your business is only as good as your word, and LTBMWs word has no value.


- esquire

p.s. I appreciate everyone's empathy.
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Last edited by esquire; 02-23-2012 at 01:56 PM.
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      02-23-2012, 02:14 PM   #21
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Gotta agree with you esquire. If there was a verbal agreement for free installation and then they decided against it, that's messed up.

The price hike, I can accept that and would have done the same as you (bit the bullet and accepted the hike), but going back and deciding to charge for the installation after being promised you didn't have to pay for it? That sucks.
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      02-23-2012, 02:48 PM   #22
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The new pricing structure for KW went into effect as of 02/01/12.
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