After Reading Most of e90 Failure

[NFAM3]

I didn't want to jack a thread so I'm just starting this little one. I'm not looking for another huge fight w/ anyone. I just have a little question. After reading the tail end of that thread, I noticed someone said that BMW can't keep up with the order of new engines b/c there have been so many failures. At least thats what I got out of a specific post. Does this mean the S85 is a POS motor? This is the first time I hear this on this board. Does it really have that many problems, even stock?

[Jaypod]

I dont think that there is THAT many failures - but failures are inevitable. You have to remember M cars are only a small portion of BMW's overall sales so not as likely to have a warehouse full of them. A hole is the block is not going to be the only reason an engine will be replaced.

[THE TECH]

There are already a couple other threads in regards to this. No need to start yet another.

[NFAM3]

Then I apologize. I did not search. I had just read that other thread. It was the first time I had heard something negative about our motors. Everyone always seems to worship the S85. It was just a different tune to me.

Mod, if you can, please lock this thread. We really don't need another one then. Again, my apologies.

[akh23456]

Just want to let you know i had to wait a Month for my rear bumper when someone ran into me. Just to give a time frame for other parts.

[Jaypod]

Its S65 BTW, S85 is the V10

[w00tw00t]

s65 ... not s85 ... its is a rock solid motor - the thing to note is that usually the folks who have no issues, never post up - only a few who do blow up will most likely post up here... most of the blown stuff is either a money shift.. or seriously tracked and boosted..

[NFAM3]

Sorry. S65. I'm still new at this. I've only had it since June!!!

[bigjae1976]

The S54 from the E46 M3 was shared with the Z4Ms...unlike the S65. The E9x is nearing the end of its production do I'm sure BMW has ramped down S65 production. I think these fears are overblown. The key ingredient of most of the failures is FI. Although there have been some NA failures...this is the rare exception. Consider how these cars are being beaten on...I meant driven.

[Edjay]

Imo the things that fails the most are the ones that are produced and stocked the most.
If its something that does not have high demand production is low. I feel if this motors are failing left and right production will be ramped up to meet demand.

[ES_TRADER]

All I want to know is if my engine blows up too, is the dealer gonna blame it on my full akra evo and also say I fucked with the ecu because of the delete -r installation?

Becaus technically an exhaust a part of the engine so modified exhaust = modified engine?

I don't want to be stuck with a $25,000 bill

[BMRLVR]

I doubt that BMW can't keep up with orders. with the production numbers of the M3 and the cost of the engine (approximately $25000) it is probably not an engine that would be kept in stock!

Actually, the lack of stock may be an indication that few failures are happening. I know that our warehouse at work only stocks parts that are used regularly. Parts that are rarely used are special ordered and not stocked.

My brother works in our supply chain division and he says that the main goal of the warehouse is to stock as low of a dollar amount of parts as possible while meeting demand and that all of our warehouses have a max dollar amount that they are supposed to not exceed. Since the S65 is so expensive, stocking any amount of those at a BMW warehouse would displace lots of commonly used items oil filters, wiper blades, fasteners, etc.

Were not really dealing with a $2000 small block chevy here.

To the OP, think about how many engine failures that have been posted on here compared to the amount of people that have had no trouble. I'd say the ratio is pretty good. Also, as for the clicking noise, no one seems to have a definitive answer to what it is. Some people have had new crankshafts and bearing installed and the noise comes back. Other people have kept on driving their cars and the noise either subsides or don't get ever get any worse.

[klammer]

Just to put in perspective, I have 27k miles on the car with about 30 track days in 2 years. My wife DD's the car and I average about 11.5 mpg over those 27k and not had a peep or whimper from this car, it rocks!

[smmmurf]

^^I agree. If you don't fuck with the car it will be reliable. Start heavily modding a finely-tuned, $25K, 12:1 compression motor and you are opening yourself up to issues.

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

The S54 from the E46 M3 was shared with the Z4Ms...unlike the S65. The E9x is nearing the end of its production do I'm sure BMW has ramped down S65 production. I think these fears are overblown. The key ingredient of most of the failures is FI. Although there have been some NA failures...this is the rare exception. Consider how these cars are being beaten on...I meant driven.

I would add that if the supercharger is tuned correctly, running at the proper psi and running the proper octane, a failure is very unlikely as well.

[BMRLVR]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

I would add that if the supercharger is tuned correctly, running at the proper psi and running the proper octane, a failure is very unlikely as well.

+1 Given proper tuning, boost, and running an adequate octane rating a supercharged engine should be plenty reliable and a catastrophic failure should be highly unlikely.

A boosted engine most likely won't last quite as long as an engine running stock power levels, however, longevity will still be quite good and most likely in the hundreds of thousands of miles before needing a rebuild. This of course is providing that the maintenance intervals are adjusted to reflect the additional power levels!

[tibra1]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

I would add that if the supercharger is tuned correctly, running at the proper psi and running the proper octane, a failure is very unlikely as well.

Speculation..speculation and more speculation..the only way to ensure longevity is to leave the engine in its original configuration...

[BMRLVR]

Originally Posted by tibra1

Speculation..speculation and more speculation..the only way to ensure longevity is to leave the engine in its original configuration...

Maybe you should re-read my post..... That is basically exactly what I said..... I stated that the engine longevity will not be that of an engine at OEM spec.

I am basing the longevity of an SC'ed car in the hundreds of thousands of miles based upon the robust construction of the block/bedplate assembly, the forged crankshaft, the bearing area of the crank and rod bearings, the excellent oiling system, robust valvetrain, etc. You can tell a lot of how strong an engine is just by the looking at the parts!

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by BMRLVR

Maybe you should re-read my post..... That is basically exactly what I said..... I stated that the engine longevity will not be that of an engine at OEM spec.

I am basing the longevity of an SC'ed car in the hundreds of thousands of miles based upon the robust construction of the block/bedplate assembly, the forged crankshaft, the bearing area of the crank and rod bearings, the excellent oiling system, robust valvetrain, etc. You can tell a lot of how strong an engine is just by the looking at the parts!

Well said as always Jamie.

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by tibra1

Speculation..speculation and more speculation..the only way to ensure longevity is to leave the engine in its original configuration...

Who would argue against your basic statement that leaving it stock would ensure longevity over heavily modified?

Based on what we currently know, I stated a FI failure is unlikely as long as you are adhering to the specifics I listed, it wasn't about longevity, how long are we talking here? ESS has had kits with 50 to near 100K miles on the stock motor and sold 350 supechargers worldwide with no documented failures, does that kind of info register with you, or were you not aware of it?

[tibra1]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

Who would argue against your basic statement that leaving it stock would ensure longevity over heavily modified?

Based on what we currently know, I stated a FI failure is unlikely as long as you are adhering to the specifics I listed, it wasn't about longevity, how long are we talking here? ESS has had kits with 50 to near 100K miles no failures, sold 350 to date with no failures, does that kind of info register with you, or were you not aware of it?

Coming from another boosted car which was modded.. its a far cry taking an existing boosted platform and tweaking it..as opposed to taking an N/A application and boosting it from scratch

The stats for the number of SCs and engine failures or lack thereof, while interesting doesnt tell ANYTHING about whats going on inside these motors.

Until someone takes a factory N/A motor w/ X miles and a SC engine with equal mileage, opens them up and puts them side by side you will never truly no what boosting these engines really does to it.

As far as being able to just look and see..oh so and so engine component "looks" strong therefore its ok to boost..well..that is hubris..without real world empirical data, testing and tear-down inspection...its all speculation.

[img]

Originally Posted by BMRLVR

Maybe you should re-read my post..... That is basically exactly what I said..... I stated that the engine longevity will not be that of an engine at OEM spec.

I am basing the longevity of an SC'ed car in the hundreds of thousands of miles based upon the robust construction of the block/bedplate assembly, the forged crankshaft, the bearing area of the crank and rod bearings, the excellent oiling system, robust valvetrain, etc. You can tell a lot of how strong an engine is just by the looking at the parts!

+1