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      01-17-2012, 11:07 PM   #23
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I'm not really for all this High GPA stuff. Show them your real-world talents OP. Become a self-made millionaire before you graduate and apply, showing these firms you got street smarts to play on Wallstreet. They want to see you know the markets, they want to know you can turn a profit eventually. Most internships are hired and purposely given hours just below what qualifies for full benefits. They're used as chew toys by Big firms to file paperwork at little-to-no-charge.

Show them you can make money. It's all any of them care about. It IS about who you know, but also more about what you can do (for them).
Are you saying this as a figure of speech or literally? lol

...because if I became a self-made millionaire in college; the last place that I'd be looking is to get hired by a scummy wall street company that wants to fully take advantage of my talents. At that point you don't need them.
Not exactly it's nice to be a millionaire but would be better to be a billionaire and in that case you'll need some connects which you'll get at the "scummy wall street firms"
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      01-17-2012, 11:08 PM   #24
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I actually work for JPM. What department are you trying to get into? I believe it's the work experience and the people you know. At the moment, i'm a VP Branch Manger at a dt Seattle location. I'm currently going back to school to get my BA. That's right, I don't have a 4 year college degree but have a heck of a background in the finance industry. I know that going back to will help me open more opportunities. Luck also can help
My ultimate goal is to be a FA. However for the meantime, some real life experience (such as an internship) would definitely help!
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      01-17-2012, 11:10 PM   #25
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I actually work for JPM. What department are you trying to get into? I believe it's the work experience and the people you know. At the moment, i'm a VP Branch Manger at a dt Seattle location. I'm currently going back to school to get my BA. That's right, I don't have a 4 year college degree but have a heck of a background in the finance industry. I know that going back to will help me open more opportunities. Luck also can help
I know plenty of people in the finance industry that don't have there degrees all the power to you guys for doing what you do haha in my opinion you kind of have to only use what you learn in school as a foundation. All the important things you learn while working in the industry. Correct me if I'm wrong though
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      01-17-2012, 11:15 PM   #26
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Not exactly it's nice to be a millionaire but would be better to be a billionaire and in that case you'll need some connects which you'll get at the "scummy wall street firms"
Billionaire? There is only 400 or so in the world...

I think you need to get out of the clouds and be a little more realistic. If you are a millionaire in college that is self made; you will never have issues with connects or frankly issues with anything (at that point you can be employing people if you play your cards right and have a proper mindset and as long as you are not an idiot). The last thing that I would be looking for is to work for someone who I know will do little for me at that point other than take advantage of my talents. Yeah, I can make money for them but I make a whole lot more money for myself at that point.

As far as the "scummy comment", obviously that's a little far fetched but we all know how financial services companies make their money...
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      01-17-2012, 11:15 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Questforpower
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Originally Posted by Vanity View Post
I'm not really for all this High GPA stuff. Show them your real-world talents OP. Become a self-made millionaire before you graduate and apply, showing these firms you got street smarts to play on Wallstreet. They want to see you know the markets, they want to know you can turn a profit eventually. Most internships are hired and purposely given hours just below what qualifies for full benefits. They're used as chew toys by Big firms to file paperwork at little-to-no-charge.

Show them you can make money. It's all any of them care about. It IS about who you know, but also more about what you can do (for them).
Are you saying this as a figure of speech or literally? lol

...because if I became a self-made millionaire in college; the last place that I'd be looking is to get hired by a scummy wall street company that wants to fully take advantage of my talents. At that point you don't need them.
I say it literally. If you really can't, in the length of college undergrad and a post-grad degree (4-6 years) make a million dollars on your own, you have no business reaching the high echelons in any firm as Titanic in nature as GS, MS, or etc. You don't go into Goldman Sachs looking to get a job as a algo-bot technician. You go in looking for a career. Im not saying you can't get hired otherwise, but if these guys are looking to make a successful career then they really ought to know that Goldman is a company that deals with Billions in revenue every year, with multiple connections to the banking sector in every single continent.

You can't make a million? You'll get hired, but you won't get a career. These guys really ought to be looking for more than just a job at these firms. If all you're getting is a job, get out and make it on your own, entrepreneurial style. Better to rule in Hell than to serve in Heaven, right?

Besides, with talents like that and a position as a fund manager, the money really gets easy just collecting 2% performance fees from clients, especially if you manage in the 100+ million portfolio (rather small on Wallstreet, I'd say). I'd do that, especially with my talents so I can collect nice bonuses.
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      01-17-2012, 11:21 PM   #28
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I know plenty of people in the finance industry that don't have there degrees all the power to you guys for doing what you do haha in my opinion you kind of have to only use what you learn in school as a foundation. All the important things you learn while working in the industry. Correct me if I'm wrong though

As I was building my book the managing director told me a degree "Basically shows him that you showed up to class and you were able to turn in your homework." It's all about production, drive, and what you can offer them. Cause in the end just like you there are 100 other candidates with the same credentials if not something better.
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      01-17-2012, 11:23 PM   #29
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I say it literally. If you really can't, in the length of college undergrad and a post-grad degree (4-6 years) make a million dollars on your own, you have no business reaching the high echelons in any firm as Titanic in nature as GS, MS, or etc. You don't go into Goldman Sachs looking to get a job as a algo-bot technician. You go in looking for a career. Im not saying you can't get hired otherwise, but if these guys are looking to make a successful career then they really ought to know that Goldman is a company that deals with Billions in revenue every year, with multiple connections to the banking sector in every single continent.

You can't make a million? You'll get hired, but you won't get a career. These guys really ought to be looking for more than just a job at these firms. If all you're getting is a job, get out and make it on your own, entrepreneurial style. Better to rule in Hell than to serve in Heaven, right?

Besides, with talents like that and a position as a fund manager, the money really gets easy just collecting 2% performance fees from clients, especially if you manage in the 100+ million portfolio (rather small on Wallstreet, I'd say). I'd do that, especially with my talents so I can collect nice bonuses.
Let's just say we disagree there...

Please see my last comment, very few people with the talent to make over a million dollars in their college career will want to work for someone else at that point; I don't even see how that's even possible legally (even in the financial services business and on the stock market unless you have quite a bit of money to start with). Your comment is quite far fetched if you ask me.
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      01-17-2012, 11:26 PM   #30
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Let's just say we disagree there...

Please see my last comment, very few people with the talent to make over a million dollars in their college career will want to work for someone else at that point; I don't even see how that's even possible legally (even in the financial services business and on the stock market unless you have quite a bit of money to start with). Your comment is quite far fetched if you ask me.
Uh huh. I did it. Why can't someone else, too?

Somehow because in your head it's impossible makes it impossible for someone else? Anyone who really wants to chase a dream as big as rising to the top of GS is really gonna have to make a lot of millions along his way. Starting with a million isn't really absurd. Just my two cents.
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      01-17-2012, 11:34 PM   #31
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Uh huh. I did it. Why can't someone else, too?

Somehow because in your head it's impossible makes it impossible for someone else? Anyone who really wants to chase a dream as big as rising to the top of GS is really gonna have to make a lot of millions along his way. Starting with a million isn't really absurd. Just my two cents.
Very happy for you Please feel free to PM me your strategy .

It's definitely possible (there are always exceptions) it's just neither probable nor common especially when GS employs 35,000 people or MS employs 65,000. If I polled 95% of those employees, I doubt they would all tell me they made a million in college... I know if I did; I'd be staying away from corporations for miles.
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      01-17-2012, 11:34 PM   #32
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Billionaire? There is only 400 or so in the world...

I think you need to get out of the clouds and be a little more realistic. If you are a millionaire in college that is self made; you will never have issues with connects or frankly issues with anything
(at that point you can be employing people if you play your cards right and have a proper mindset and as long as you are not an idiot). The last thing that I would be looking for is to work for someone who I know will do little for me at that point other than take advantage of my talents. Yeah, I can make money for them but I make a whole lot more money for myself at that point.

As far as the "scummy comment", obviously that's a little far fetched but we all know how financial services companies make their money...
Just because you have a million dollars doesn't mean it buys you connections and favours with anybody; it just gets more than your foot past the door. And I wish having a million dollars was enough to employ people. At least not here in Canada. Unless, of course, you meant leveraging that million against bank loans.

And lastly, you really ought to be less greedy with your talents. Making a million (in comparison to what people in GS make) is not a life-achievement in the financial industry. A millionaire can't afford the millionaire life-style. You need to be a multi-millionaire to do that. Using your talents in the markets, getting your foot through the door, you might as well use it to make good money in the industry and "be someone with money" and not just "somebody with money".
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      01-17-2012, 11:38 PM   #33
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Very happy for you Please feel free to PM me your strategy .

It's definitely possible (there are always exceptions) it's just neither probable nor common especially when GS employs 35,000 people or MS employs 65,000. If I polled 95% of those employees, I doubt they would all tell me they made a million in college... I know if I did; I'd be staying away from corporations for miles.
Probably true statistics. But 95% of the people at GS have just jobs. I'm talking about the managers of the employees. This advice really is for not just "getting in" but getting a "career". Like I said above, get a career inside those big names, don't get a job. No one wants to be a desk employee working 9-5 under someone. I'm sure those fund managers all have really interesting stories about success in college, though. A lot of them started companies from scratch, most likely. It's not uncommon for economics or finance undergraduates to participate in programs that initiate entrepeneurial growth. They also have access to sponsorships and etc. You dont need your own money to make a million, but just getting the investments to get there is where most people start.

These are the guys who usually sit at the top of the class in the Ivy leagues across the nation. Thats where GS picks their interns from. That's all I'm saying, really.
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      01-17-2012, 11:39 PM   #34
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Just because you have a million dollars doesn't mean it buys you connections and favours with anybody; it just gets more than your foot past the door. And I wish having a million dollars was enough to employ people. At least not here in Canada. Unless, of course, you meant leveraging that million against bank loans.

And lastly, you really ought to be less greedy with your talents. Making a million (in comparison to what people in GS make) is not a life-achievement in the financial industry. A millionaire can't afford the millionaire life-style. You need to be a multi-millionaire to do that. Using your talents in the markets, getting your foot through the door, you might as well use it to make good money in the industry and "be someone with money" and not just "somebody with money".
Vanity, you have a lot of insight regarding this topic. What do you for a living, if you don't mind me asking..and howd you make that million? lol
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      01-17-2012, 11:43 PM   #35
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Warning for bad spelling or grammar mistakes written on my phone :D

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Originally Posted by Questforpower View Post
Billionaire? There is only 400 or so in the world...

I think you need to get out of the clouds and be a little more realistic. If you are a millionaire in college that is self made; you will never have issues with connects or frankly issues with anything (at that point you can be employing people if you play your cards right and have a proper mindset and as long as you are not an idiot). The last thing that I would be looking for is to work for someone who I know will do little for me at that point other than take advantage of my talents. Yeah, I can make money for them but I make a whole lot more money for myself at that point.

As far as the "scummy comment", obviously that's a little far fetched but we all know how financial services companies make their money...
What's wrong with shorting for the stars this is all theoretical anyway isn't it and really I won't have any problems with connections If I become a millionaire of a website I make alone in a basement?

Anyway as vanity said, once you enter a firm like that with millions clearly your not a beginner and do not need to clime the ladder up from the very bottom since you already earned your stripes on your own. You would enter at a managerial position not an analyst that's someones b*tch but yes I agree you could make money on your own at that point. Personally i would still work at a firm because, as my dad taught me, there is no shame and work and the experience you get as an investment banker at one of theses firms is second to none. Aka I would work at any of these firms because I love the field not for the money, that's just a perk with the job
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      01-17-2012, 11:48 PM   #36
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Just because you have a million dollars doesn't mean it buys you connections and favours with anybody; it just gets more than your foot past the door. And I wish having a million dollars was enough to employ people. At least not here in Canada. Unless, of course, you meant leveraging that million against bank loans.

And lastly, you really ought to be less greedy with your talents. Making a million (in comparison to what people in GS make) is not a life-achievement in the financial industry. A millionaire can't afford the millionaire life-style. You need to be a multi-millionaire to do that. Using your talents in the markets, getting your foot through the door, you might as well use it to make good money in the industry and "be someone with money" and not just "somebody with money".
I can agree with almost all of what you said. The only problem being that you make it sound that the first million is your easiest with things getting harder when it comes to multiplying that money. That's simple not true, in fact it's the opposite... if I had the knowledge to make a million in college, I would have multiplied that money 10 to 15 x by now (all by myself and on my own accord, frankly I have a few ways to that down). All this while employing a few people personally and trying to help them out with their projects.

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Originally Posted by Vanity View Post
Probably true statistics. But 95% of the people at GS have just jobs. I'm talking about the managers of the employees. This advice really is for not just "getting in" but getting a "career". Like I said above, get a career inside those big names, don't get a job. No one wants to be a desk employee working 9-5 under someone. I'm sure those fund managers all have really interesting stories about success in college, though. A lot of them started companies from scratch, most likely. It's not uncommon for economics or finance undergraduates to participate in programs that initiate entrepeneurial growth. They also have access to sponsorships and etc. You dont need your own money to make a million, but just getting the investments to get there is where most people start.

These are the guys who usually sit at the top of the class in the Ivy leagues across the nation. Thats where GS picks their interns from. That's all I'm saying, really.
Like I said; there are and will always be exceptions. Just remember that in this economic environment in terms of funding and start up capital it's a little more difficult than it's ever been nor is that the best advice for someone who is simply looking for an internship at a financial services company. Let's just put it this way; if he had a million, he wouldn't be asking this type of info to someone on a car forum. If I had a million in college and you told me what you did; then more than likely I'd laugh... although it may not be the same case for everyone.
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      01-17-2012, 11:49 PM   #37
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Vanity, you have a lot of insight regarding this topic. What do you for a living, if you don't mind me asking..and howd you make that million? lol
To be honest? I don't claim to be a guru of anything or a money master. But I do do stocks full-time and my family is half rooted in Medicine while the other half is rooted in Business. I always had a desire to do business all the way back to when I was in High school. I studied my ass off, independently learning everything on my own. I got some support from those in my family, or whomever had expertise. But don't think, by-and-large, that any of them carried me to where I am.

For a living, I trade the market. Though I don't really like the title "day-trader"
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      01-17-2012, 11:52 PM   #38
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What's wrong with shorting for the stars this is all theoretical anyway isn't it and really I won't have any problems with connections If I become a millionaire of a website I make alone in a basement?

Anyway as vanity said, once you enter a firm like that with millions clearly your not a beginner and do not need to clime the ladder up from the very bottom since you already earned your stripes on your own. You would enter at a managerial position not an analyst that's someones b*tch but yes I agree you could make money on your own at that point. Personally i would still work at a firm because, as my dad taught me, there is no shame and work and the experience you get as an investment banker at one of theses firms is second to none. Aka I would work at any of these firms because I love the field not for the money, that's just a perk with the job
I'd be shocked if you had connection problems at that point... you either sold the company to someone at that point or you have venture capitalists lining up at your door when they see your success.

As far as the second paragraph, all true except IMHO; there are much better uses of your talents, time and resources at that point that working for a large financial services company.

As I've said anything is possible but these exceptions are few-

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/pf_article_112341.html
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      01-17-2012, 11:54 PM   #39
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To be honest? I don't claim to be a guru of anything or a money master. But I do do stocks full-time and my family is half rooted in Medicine while the other half is rooted in Business. I always had a desire to do business all the way back to when I was in High school. I studied my ass off, independently learning everything on my own. I got some support from those in my family, or whomever had expertise. But don't think, by-and-large, that any of them carried me to where I am.

For a living, I trade the market. Though I don't really like the title "day-trader"
So I'm figuring you didnt go to college, independently reading and learning on your own is what you did? I dont see how all this info can be found in textbooks though.
but damn props to you lol
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      01-17-2012, 11:55 PM   #40
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I'd be shocked if you had connection problems at that point... you either sold the company to someone at that point or you have venture capitalists lining up at your door when they see your success.

As far as the second paragraph, all true except IMHO; there are much better uses of your talents, time and resources at that point that working for a large financial services company.
To be honest, I could never see myself working undersomeone, cause there's always someone to talk to. I just want to make enough and leave it in the bank and go travelling for the rest of my life. I got one life, and I don't really care for seeing the innards of GS's concrete and glass castle for it's eternity. The world is a much better view

Maybe on a ship... on the Riveria.... daydreams
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      01-18-2012, 12:00 AM   #41
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So I'm figuring you didnt go to college, independently reading and learning on your own is what you did? I dont see how all this info can be found in textbooks though.
but damn props to you lol
No, No. I did go to college. I got admissions into a University ranked in the top 20's across the world. I entered undergrad in the Faculty of Science thinking Medicine was what I wanted to do. Then found that dream wasn't for me and quit half-way through my BSc degree and transferred into English Honours in the Faculty of Arts, thinking Law School had to be the choice for me since being a Doctor didn't work out. First World Problems. After trying that for a while and, not liking the Faculty of Arts, I started fresh into Commerce in the Faculty of Business.

I've been everywhere... No degree though, yet. That degree will be finished, though. Sometime.
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      01-18-2012, 12:02 AM   #42
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To be honest, I could never see myself working undersomeone, cause there's always someone to talk to. I just want to make enough and leave it in the bank and go travelling for the rest of my life. I got one life, and I don't really care for seeing the innards of GS's concrete and glass castle for it's eternity. The world is a much better view

Maybe on a ship... on the Riveria.... daydreams
I sir look up to you
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      01-18-2012, 12:04 AM   #43
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I sir look up to you
Oh that's quite good. I look up to me too! Just kidding! Let's deflate my ego for now.
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      01-18-2012, 12:06 AM   #44
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Btw OP, if you're looking for a good connection list, try asking your professors. I know the professor at my Business school in University had previously worked a career before assuming professorship. Some even worked at places like Morgan Stanley. Try asking them.
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