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      11-07-2011, 04:30 PM   #419
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
What amazes me is the strawman BS you puke up. I have never said the GTR can beat everything and anything. I have never said the GTR doesn't have flaws. I have defended the car against garbage like "its just a Nissan" "its not a supercar because it doesn't cost a half million dollars" .
What's even more amazing is the fact that you, a non GTR owner, comes on and rips GTR owners when they defend the car they like from purely unhinged crap.
Where is the ripping, it hurts to read your posts because you side step the entire point. You simply can't accept that performance numbers do not make a 'super car'. Intangibles and price are actually a part of the definition of a super car, it's something that is very expensive and typically an insanely great performing car. This is the entire draw of the GT-R, super car performance at a fraction of the price, it's not ripping, it's fact.

If you think a GT-R is among the list of super cars, well then by your definition a BOSS Mustang and a Z06 should be spoken of in the same sentence with Pagani and Mclaren, do you realize how crazy that is???

Again, this is not ripping just a matter of perspective, not semantics. Performance is one aspect vs. intangibles like a zonda's exhaust, or it's carbon fiber door panel.

You are taking this again personally, without applying a rational arguement.
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      11-07-2011, 04:46 PM   #420
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Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Where is the ripping, it hurts to read your posts because you side step the entire point. You simply can't accept that performance numbers do not make a 'super car'. Intangibles and price are actually a part of the definition of a super car, it's something that is very expensive and typically an insanely great performing car. This is the entire draw of the GT-R, super car performance at a fraction of the price, it's not ripping, it's fact.

If you think a GT-R is among the list of super cars, well then by your definition a BOSS Mustang and a Z06 should be spoken of in the same sentence with Pagani and Mclaren, do you realize how crazy that is???

Again, this is not ripping just a matter of perspective, not semantics. Performance is one aspect vs. intangibles like a zonda's exhaust, or it's carbon fiber door panel.

You are taking this again personally, without applying a rational arguement.
There is another definition of those cars like the Zonda, McLaren F1 etc. Those are "Hypercars" - the top end of super cars and very exclusive.

The Corvette Z06 is classified as a super car as it is in the same class as the 911 Turbo, Audi R8, GT-R etc. Go look up any super car list and the Vette is in there.

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      11-07-2011, 05:17 PM   #421
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Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Where is the ripping, it hurts to read your posts because you side step the entire point. You simply can't accept that performance numbers do not make a 'super car'. Intangibles and price are actually a part of the definition of a super car, it's something that is very expensive and typically an insanely great performing car. This is the entire draw of the GT-R, super car performance at a fraction of the price, it's not ripping, it's fact.

If you think a GT-R is among the list of super cars, well then by your definition a BOSS Mustang and a Z06 should be spoken of in the same sentence with Pagani and Mclaren, do you realize how crazy that is???

Again, this is not ripping just a matter of perspective, not semantics. Performance is one aspect vs. intangibles like a zonda's exhaust, or it's carbon fiber door panel.

You are taking this again personally, without applying a rational arguement.


Frankly if a Boss 302 can hang with a gtr, 458, or Gallardo it would be a supercar but it can't. You offered up one piece of evidence. How would it do around the 'ring or any number of other courses. It would lose badly to the Nissan and other supercars. Christ, it would also get pasted in a straight line.
You obviously don't take my opinion too seriously but you're willing to say practically every respected car reviewer considers a GTR a supercar are wrong? I offered up three guys that know cars a hell of a lot better than anyone on this forum and every one of the said the Nissan was a supercar.
But a suppose you know better than Tiff Nedell, Jason Plato or Jay Leno.

And as far as rational arguments are considered I have offered plenty. All you GTR supercar deniers can say is its not exotic, which isn't a prerequisite, no that there are "intangibles"(ie you can't quantify it).
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      11-07-2011, 06:20 PM   #422
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Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Here is a stock mustang that beat a GT-R and a host of other cars, is this Mustang a "super car" - If a GT-R is a supercar, by your definition so is a Z06 and Boss Mustang

It amazes me easily you guys forget that there are other cars out there that can compete and or beat the GT-R.

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/car-...guna-seca.html
That's one test at the twisty Laguna Seca. The fastest laps link in the link you posted showed a different outcome with the 2012:
http://www.fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html

I probably couldn't find many more as they don't typically even bother comparing the two cars. The Boss is not even in the same ballpark...apples and oranges. It's the overall performance capability and engineering of the car. A Boss and M3 are not that far apart performance wise. Also, I never said it's the fastest car out there.

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      11-07-2011, 08:20 PM   #423
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Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
Yeah. Its really disappointing. And nothing like the rumor mill was throwing out there. I don't know if I want the '13 now.
I was too. I heard its 0 to 60 at 2.8 or 2.7, but i expected at least 30 HP.

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Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
What amazes me is the strawman BS you puke up. I have never said the GTR can beat everything and anything. I have never said the GTR doesn't have flaws. I have defended the car against garbage like "its just a Nissan" "its not a supercar because it doesn't cost a half million dollars" .
What's even more amazing is the fact that you, a non GTR owner, comes on and rips GTR owners when they defend the car they like from purely unhinged crap.
They call that "trolling" on here. So basically you have to agree with all of the absolutely false statements they say (the select few) about the GTR.



Quote:
Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
Frankly if a Boss 302 can hang with a gtr, 458, or Gallardo it would be a supercar but it can't. You offered up one piece of evidence. How would it do around the 'ring or any number of other courses. It would lose badly to the Nissan and other supercars. Christ, it would also get pasted in a straight line.
You obviously don't take my opinion too seriously but you're willing to say practically every respected car reviewer considers a GTR a supercar are wrong? I offered up three guys that know cars a hell of a lot better than anyone on this forum and every one of the said the Nissan was a supercar.
But a suppose you know better than Tiff Nedell, Jason Plato or Jay Leno.


And as far as rational arguments are considered I have offered plenty. All you GTR supercar deniers can say is its not exotic, which isn't a prerequisite, no that there are "intangibles"(ie you can't quantify it).
Notice how they keep skipping that fact....
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      11-07-2011, 08:51 PM   #424
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Originally Posted by F10-500 View Post
gtr is too fugly to begin with, let's see, the name nissan reminds us of ugly cars such as these







and when they slap a gtr badge on the back of the car it ends up looking like these







pros:
0 - 60 under 3.5s

cons:
- boys with sausages will always approach you
- makes ricers hard, really hard if you got a ricey kit shipped from japan
- dumbass owners/dreamers back at nagtroc will give you AWESOME car dude!
-tranny and diff could possibly fail at any time, drag racing or taking her to the track, it sucks that much because it's a damn nissan with renault's final touch up
- boys are still trying to get your number and hook up with you, it's all about the 0 - 60 + launch control
- poor quality inside and out
- $2k for the damn rubbers and they handle like shit in the wet
- the awd system overheats
- missin oil cooler
- car is too ugly and only fanbois can spot you on the highway or in parking malls
- the dealer treats you like shit and could possibly kick your door to get it closed right infront of your eyes
- when the tranny fails they send a tech from japan over to ship it back and mail you the invoice and lie to your face and tell you it's not fixable, better get the cheque ready buddy.
- the damn turd is a dick magnet, do you get it ? it turns boys on not girls, STD will be on the way not a baby
- the list is too long it may take a week or two to complete it, but you get the idea ugly + fragile = fail

and if you think you can launch the car whenever you want, you better think twice, cause sooner or later you'll end up pissing all over the track stock or modded, this is nissan's nature in designing poop cars, ready to send $20k ? cause they won't sell you the diff alone, the damn thing along with tranny comes with it

Amazing post. Well done.
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      11-07-2011, 09:50 PM   #425
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Re: Supercar, fine, it's supercar, but the only thing you've done is lowered the bar for 'super car' and created another tier of vehicles, another group that the GT-R is not in, a group above and beyond the reach of the GT-R.


Quote:
Originally Posted by erio View Post
That's one test at the twisty Laguna Seca. The fastest laps link in the link you posted showed a different outcome with the 2012:
http://www.fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html

I probably couldn't find many more as they don't typically even bother comparing the two cars. The Boss is not even in the same ballpark...apples and oranges. It's the overall performance capability and engineering of the car. A Boss and M3 are not that far apart performance wise. Also, I never said it's the fastest car out there.

A 2012 ZL1 Camaro holds a faster ring time than a Lamborghini Murcielago LP670-4SV, does this mean that the Camaro and the Lambo should be mentioned in the same league, in performance MAYBE, in class, or level ...No way, they are designed for very different buyers, purposes, and criteria.

That is my point, I'm trying to bring the GT-R back down to earth but the owners in this thread seem to be very reluctant to either: A. bring the GT-R down to earth, or B. throw it's rivals like the z06 at or above the GT-R.

It amazes me to see how easily a Ferrari 458 is brought into the equation, long before a z06 is. The GT-R might have similar performance numbers to a 458, but these cars are miles apart in design, price, purpose and customer base.
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      11-07-2011, 10:01 PM   #426
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Originally Posted by mattixxg View Post
I was too. I heard its 0 to 60 at 2.8 or 2.7, but i expected at least 30 HP.



They call that "trolling" on here. So basically you have to agree with all of the absolutely false statements they say (the select few) about the GTR.





Notice how they keep skipping that fact....
Quote:
Originally Posted by 997GT3 View Post
Frankly if a Boss 302 can hang with a gtr, 458, or Gallardo it would be a supercar but it can't. You offered up one piece of evidence. How would it do around the 'ring or any number of other courses. It would lose badly to the Nissan and other supercars. Christ, it would also get pasted in a straight line.
You obviously don't take my opinion too seriously but you're willing to say practically every respected car reviewer considers a GTR a supercar are wrong? I offered up three guys that know cars a hell of a lot better than anyone on this forum and every one of the said the Nissan was a supercar.
But a suppose you know better than Tiff Nedell, Jason Plato or Jay Leno.

And as far as rational arguments are considered I have offered plenty. All you GTR supercar deniers can say is its not exotic, which isn't a prerequisite, no that there are "intangibles"(ie you can't quantify it).
I stopped wasting my breathe awhile ago. You folks should too. You're not going to get anywhere. BMW owners think that BMW's are Gods gift to man. They're either A.) Snobby 16 year old's who have mommy and daddy buy them the car or 2.)Badge Whores. I don't even own a GT-R or an M3 but I can accept the fact that it's a beast and punishes anything out there. I classify it as a supercar.(I think that's what started this whole debate)

Move on with your lives. Be happy with what you have. I have a C63 AMG Coupe with P31 coming in and I don't have any regrets.
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      11-07-2011, 10:04 PM   #427
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
I stopped wasting my breathe awhile ago. You folks should too. You're not going to get anywhere. BMW owners think that BMW's are Gods gift to man. They're either A.) Snobby 16 year old's who have mommy and daddy buy them the car or 2.)Badge Whores. I don't even own a GT-R or an M3 but I can accept the fact that it's a beast and punishes anything out there. I classify it as a supercar.(I think that's what started this whole debate)

Move on with your lives. Be happy with what you have. I have a C63 AMG Coupe with P31 coming in and I don't have any regrets.
+10000000000 .. I am the original poster on this thread and I'm afraid this thread has turned into pure crap! ... I love both cars... and I love all high perf cars, each with its own character flaws but each one with its own strengths.... I have a M3 now but my hope is within six months I'll have a GTR... and i know I'll always have a soft spot for a M3.. reading all these poser posts about the "brand name" etc and the character / personal attacks above make me sick! ..
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      11-07-2011, 10:05 PM   #428
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
I stopped wasting my breathe awhile ago. You folks should too. You're not going to get anywhere. BMW owners think that BMW's are Gods gift to man. They're either A.) Snobby 16 year old's who have mommy and daddy buy them the car or 2.)Badge Whores. I don't even own a GT-R or an M3 but I can accept the fact that it's a beast and punishes anything out there. I classify it as a supercar.(I think that's what started this whole debate)

Move on with your lives. Be happy with what you have. I have a C63 AMG Coupe with P31 coming in and I don't have any regrets.
Quick question, why didn't you buy a GT-R???? Did you actually buy the C63 coupe or is this like the other M3s that were 'coming'.


I'm really curious to understand why, you of all people would NOT buy a GT-R??? The proof is in the pudding, right here, for the money why would/did you choose a c63amg coupe with P31 package over a GT-R....
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      11-07-2011, 10:06 PM   #429
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Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
I stopped wasting my breathe awhile ago. You folks should too. You're not going to get anywhere. BMW owners think that BMW's are Gods gift to man. They're either A.) Snobby 16 year old's who have mommy and daddy buy them the car or 2.)Badge Whores. I don't even own a GT-R or an M3 but I can accept the fact that it's a beast and punishes anything out there. I classify it as a supercar.(I think that's what started this whole debate)

Move on with your lives. Be happy with what you have. I have a C63 AMG Coupe with P31 coming in and I don't have any regrets.
i dont want to agrue and dont fall into either of those categories. i personally think the gtr is a beast as well just dont put it into the supercar category. the c63 should be a monster for you. have fun with that.
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      11-07-2011, 10:11 PM   #430
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i dont want to agrue and dont fall into either of those categories. i personally think the gtr is a beast as well just dont put it into the supercar category. the c63 should be a monster for you. have fun with that.
You're part of the minority. Thank you! Can't wait.
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      11-08-2011, 08:23 AM   #431
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Idiots! Red is better than blue, red sox, no Yankees, cold vs. hot...it's a super, no duper, no wannabe, no exotic... Thx for the entertainment though lol:
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      11-08-2011, 10:18 AM   #432
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
[
Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
i dont want to agrue and dont fall into either of those categories. i personally think the gtr is a beast as well just dont put it into the supercar category. the c63 should be a monster for you. have fun with that.
You're part of the minority. Thank you! Can't wait.
No he is not. He is part of the majority.....which is saying the GT-R is a phenomenal car just not a supercar to many of us
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      11-08-2011, 10:23 AM   #433
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[quote=alms211;10763955]
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[
Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
i dont want to agrue and dont fall into either of those categories. i personally think the gtr is a beast as well just dont put it into the supercar category. the c63 should be a monster for you. have fun with that.
You're part of the minority. Thank you! Can't wait.
No he is not. He is part of the majority.....which is saying the GT-R is a phenomenal car just not a supercar to many of us. Same about the C63.
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      11-08-2011, 11:38 AM   #434
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Yeah. Its really disappointing. And nothing like the rumor mill was throwing out there. I don't know if I want the '13 now.
Hate to say it, but as someone who just bought a 2012 GT-R only two months ago, I'm relieved that the difference wasn't that much between the 2012 and the 2013...

And as for that idiot posting an ugly picture of an old Nissan as "justification" for your badge bigotry, PUH-LEEZE! I can dredge up a few ugly old BMW pictures as well.
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      11-08-2011, 11:54 AM   #435
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No he is not. He is part of the majority.....which is saying the GT-R is a phenomenal car just not a supercar to many of us
so your saying the majority of people think the gt-r is a phenomenal car but not a super car. case closed. thanks
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      11-08-2011, 12:15 PM   #436
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so your saying the majority of people think the gt-r is a phenomenal car but not a super car. case closed. thanks
How is it not a super car? What does it take it define a super car? If the majority of car publications and world call it a super car, is that enough?

Super car comparison:
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...r/viewall.html

Motor Trend names GT-R best Super Car under 100k
http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/n...nder-100k.html

Top Gear Super Car of the year 2007: GT-R
http://www.**************.com/pit-ge...rd-2007-a.html

USA Today: Nissan Supercar gets more power
http://content.usatoday.com/communit...t-r-supercar/1

Jalopnik: Supercar teardown GT-R
http://jalopnik.com/5422557/supercar...wn-nissan-gt+r

Wall Street Journal: Super car at not so super price
http://online.wsj.com/video/news-hub...E33E55A38.html


Really guys, if the whole world calls the GT-R a super car, why not the BMW forum?
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      11-08-2011, 12:40 PM   #437
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alms said i was part of the majority that thinks the gt-r is a phenomenal car just not a super car. i just agreed with him. it performs like one and better than a lot but there is more than performance. thats why so many m3 owners are enamored with it even though it isnt that great of a straight line performer or that its too heavy. arguing that something is true unfortunatly doesnt make it so. its a great car regardless if it is defined as a super car. i personally do not and you do.
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      11-08-2011, 01:17 PM   #438
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Quote:
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Quote:
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so your saying the majority of people think the gt-r is a phenomenal car but not a super car. case closed. thanks
How is it not a super car? What does it take it define a super car? If the majority of car publications and world call it a super car, is that enough?

Super car comparison:
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...r/viewall.html

Motor Trend names GT-R best Super Car under 100k
http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/n...nder-100k.html

Top Gear Super Car of the year 2007: GT-R
http://www.**************.com/pit-ge...rd-2007-a.html

USA Today: Nissan Supercar gets more power
http://content.usatoday.com/communit...t-r-supercar/1

Jalopnik: Supercar teardown GT-R
http://jalopnik.com/5422557/supercar...wn-nissan-gt r

Wall Street Journal: Super car at not so super price
http://online.wsj.com/video/news-hub...E33E55A38.html


Really guys, if the whole world calls the GT-R a super car, why not the BMW forum?
I just googles BMW m3 supercar and found just as many articles (including the tanner foust and Paul Tracy series battle of the supercars pitting a Lexus ISF vs E92 M3. Are you going to say that those are supercars as well just because some silly rags or tv show claims them to be? The term supercar is thrown around so loosely these days it has lost it panache IMO. I'm done debating it. If you think your beloved GTR is a super duper supercar of epic proportions then so be it. Just know that there are many out therethat simply believe otherwise.
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      11-08-2011, 02:18 PM   #439
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Originally Posted by alms211 View Post
I just googles BMW m3 supercar and found just as many articles (including the tanner foust and Paul Tracy series battle of the supercars pitting a Lexus ISF vs E92 M3. Are you going to say that those are supercars as well just because some silly rags or tv show claims them to be? The term supercar is thrown around so loosely these days it has lost it panache IMO. I'm done debating it. If you think your beloved GTR is a super duper supercar of epic proportions then so be it. Just know that there are many out therethat simply believe otherwise.
I think part of it is that Nissan has always marketed the car as a supercar. Even in the latest interview on the 2013, chief engineer Mizuno calls it a supercar or "multi-performance supercar." Yes it's semantics. Call it what you like...it is what it is. This thread has really become old....

vid: http://bcove.me/9mjka37x

Last edited by erio; 11-08-2011 at 02:26 PM.
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      11-08-2011, 04:15 PM   #440
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alms211 View Post
I just googles BMW m3 supercar and found just as many articles (including the tanner foust and Paul Tracy series battle of the supercars pitting a Lexus ISF vs E92 M3. Are you going to say that those are supercars as well just because some silly rags or tv show claims them to be? The term supercar is thrown around so loosely these days it has lost it panache IMO. I'm done debating it. If you think your beloved GTR is a super duper supercar of epic proportions then so be it. Just know that there are many out therethat simply believe otherwise.
Oh so theyre silly now?
the same people that have driven and reviewed more cars than you probably will?


Ok...if you say so.
Other people also believe that Kobe Bryant is better than Micheal Jordan even tho numbers say an entirely different thing.

The easter bunny is real people....
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