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      06-13-2007, 11:29 AM   #1
mesier1111
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Disappointed

The more I read the more disappointed I am in what the new M3 will bring. It appears that the M5/M6 will be MUCH faster and still have the great handling characterstics. I know an "M" is unlike any other, but I got to start agreeing with 335i coupe owners who believe modding their coupe will make it an M. Between upgrading suspension and wheels, Vishnu (especially the V2 that is coming out), rear diff. and exhaust and the next thing you know you are holding turns as well as the M3, and beating it in 0-60 and 1/4 AND track times. I think it will be interesting to watch 45K 335i coupes with 10K of mods (bringing the total to 55k, less than a well equipped M3 will be) perhaps surpass the M3 in many performance categories.

God I hope I will be wrong, but with BMW officially expecting 0-62 times of not really any better than the outgoing E46 M3, I must say, as important as overall performance and handling are, straightline acceleration is still a very important part of the driving experience, both off and on the track.

Here's to the E92 M3 coming out and proving me dead wrong....please
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      06-13-2007, 11:40 AM   #2
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Why is it that almost every post that expresses "concern" about a tuned 335 being faster than the new M3 is posted by someone who owns a 335? Are you really concerned or just trying to brag about how smart you are to buy the lower priced car that you think will run rings (pun intended) around the higher priced model?

I don't know, but I do know that I personally would not want to do engine mods on a car costing as much as the 335 does. I would rather have a fully warranted, factory-tuned M3 than a 335 that may even be faster or better in some ways. I do not want the worry of wondering whether I will have to buy a new motor at some point because I have no warranty. I also do not want to deal with a possibly temperamental tuned car.

For those that do not care about the same issues, more power to you and good luck with your car.
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      06-13-2007, 11:52 AM   #3
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This has been discussed ad nauseum, but BMW quoted a 0-60 time of 5.1 for the e46 m3, and now quoted 4.8 for the e92 m3. If the e46 m3 ended up going from 0-60 in 4.8, then how fast do you think the new m3 will run it?

If a proceded 335 ends up being as fast/faster in a straight line than the new m3, will it be impressive? Yes. Will it stop me from buying an e92 m3? No.
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      06-13-2007, 11:58 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
Why is it that almost every post that expresses "concern" about a tuned 335 being faster than the new M3 is posted by someone who owns a 335? Are you really concerned or just trying to brag about how smart you are to buy the lower priced car that you think will run rings (pun intended) around the higher priced model?

I don't know, but I do know that I personally would not want to do engine mods on a car costing as much as the 335 does. I would rather have a fully warranted, factory-tuned M3 than a 335 that may even be faster or better in some ways. I do not want the worry of wondering whether I will have to buy a new motor at some point because I have no warranty. I also do not want to deal with a possibly temperamental tuned car.

For those that do not care about the same issues, more power to you and good luck with your car.
Agreed.
Will people stop posting about this topic and wait till the damn car comes out.
Shall I type up a whole story about buying a $20k car and then spending $35k in mods so it is "M".
Yeah, I shouldn't, because it's stupid.
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      06-13-2007, 12:30 PM   #5
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Personally I don't see the extra $10k on mods being better value for money than the extra you will pay for the M3.

Mods may or may not bring M3 performance within reach (let's face it, real-life opportunities to test this in anger will be be few - most of us will not get to find out save from reading about it), but that money spent will most likely subtract value from your car (would I pay RRP for a slightly used M3? Probably. A modded 335i? Not a chance).
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      06-13-2007, 12:47 PM   #6
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If your benchmark is only 0-60 and 1/4 mile, then you are missing lots of stuffs
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      06-13-2007, 12:48 PM   #7
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yea, i don't know what the big deal is either. bmw doesn't want their 3 series to beat out their flagship model so the M3 probably wont run the posted 4.8 seconds, probably will run a couple tenths less than that. BMW does that all the time to their numbers
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      06-13-2007, 01:13 PM   #8
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wow that 335i just smoked that m3 and ohhh snap that twin turbo g35 just smoked both of them! ohh snap! who cares! there is always a car faster..

if you seriously got a 335i then spent 10 k to get it to M status then your a fucking idiot for not getting the m3 in the first place.. sorry
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      06-13-2007, 02:16 PM   #9
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yea boy
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      06-13-2007, 02:25 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Boostedg35 View Post
wow that 335i just smoked that m3 and ohhh snap that twin turbo g35 just smoked both of them! ohh snap! who cares! there is always a car faster..

if you seriously got a 335i then spent 10 k to get it to M status then your a fucking idiot for not getting the m3 in the first place.. sorry

+1

couldnt have said it better.
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      06-13-2007, 02:56 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
Why is it that almost every post that expresses "concern" about a tuned 335 being faster than the new M3 is posted by someone who owns a 335? Are you really concerned or just trying to brag about how smart you are to buy the lower priced car that you think will run rings (pun intended) around the higher priced model?

I don't know, but I do know that I personally would not want to do engine mods on a car costing as much as the 335 does. I would rather have a fully warranted, factory-tuned M3 than a 335 that may even be faster or better in some ways. I do not want the worry of wondering whether I will have to buy a new motor at some point because I have no warranty. I also do not want to deal with a possibly temperamental tuned car.

For those that do not care about the same issues, more power to you and good luck with your car.
I'm not one of the typical 335i owners. I luv mine but have not modded it at all, pure and simple its a carry thru till the M3 comes out. If it was out today, and they were taking orders I would put the money down. I just am afraid I will get in it and instead of being blown away, I will be "wow this is nice" but not that blow you away feeling I got when I first got in an E46 M3, especially after riding in a 330ci with sport pkg and everything. Thats all. But the warrantied engine is a great point, biggest reason I haven't touched my 335i.

Thanks for your input
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      06-13-2007, 02:59 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SunnyD View Post
This has been discussed ad nauseum, but BMW quoted a 0-60 time of 5.1 for the e46 m3, and now quoted 4.8 for the e92 m3. If the e46 m3 ended up going from 0-60 in 4.8, then how fast do you think the new m3 will run it?

If a proceded 335 ends up being as fast/faster in a straight line than the new m3, will it be impressive? Yes. Will it stop me from buying an e92 m3? No.
That actually is incorrect. At first press release they may have quoted 5.1, but on the BMWusa website (at least in 2005 and 2006 when I checked) the 0-60 time was listed as 4.8, so they were giving it the credit it was due.
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      06-13-2007, 03:04 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2m3 View Post
If your benchmark is only 0-60 and 1/4 mile, then you are missing lots of stuffs
thanks for the input guys, but as many of you have shown, you didn't read my post, you just skimmed it. If we love the M its because it says M on it. I buy a car PURELY from the performance end, and there is PLENTY of easy suspension mods, tire/wheel mods that would make it so it wasn't just 0-60 times. I never, ever just talked about 0-60 times. I talked about other mods that would bring it to the same level on the track.

No offense, but if buying a car isn't about showing everyone how cool you are or making up for a lack of something else, and its about pure performance, then I want to get into the car that will be the best to drive. Up until this point (ferraris and other 100K+ cars excluded) I believed that was a M3 was one of them, but now, its seems you may finally be paying for a badge, not better performance.
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      06-13-2007, 03:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mesier1111 View Post
its seems you may finally be paying for a badge, not better performance.
The more I see and read about the performance, the more I'm starting to agree with you.

Again though, we need to wait until the car is released to say for sure. One thing I'm very disappointed with is the interior pictures so far. It seems BMW did leave the inside of this M back in the 1980's, when the M badge really meant something!!
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      06-13-2007, 03:33 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mesier1111 View Post
thanks for the input guys, but as many of you have shown, you didn't read my post, you just skimmed it. If we love the M its because it says M on it. I buy a car PURELY from the performance end, and there is PLENTY of easy suspension mods, tire/wheel mods that would make it so it wasn't just 0-60 times. I never, ever just talked about 0-60 times. I talked about other mods that would bring it to the same level on the track.

No offense, but if buying a car isn't about showing everyone how cool you are or making up for a lack of something else, and its about pure performance, then I want to get into the car that will be the best to drive. Up until this point (ferraris and other 100K+ cars excluded) I believed that was a M3 was one of them, but now, its seems you may finally be paying for a badge, not better performance.
u sure are making a lot of assumptions for a car that isn't released yet. funny thing is, i believe most of the disbelievers will diasappear when the car is finally tested...you all will know who you are. until then, you really are stressing a lot over conjectures and opinions...there are many things better to do than trying to convince others of your own insecurities about the car... really is fatiguing to read post on how the new m3 will be inadequate..the m3 is overpriced..blah.blah blah when the CAR ISN'T OUT YET and US prices are only estimates!

make it simple, if you're not that impressed WHEN the car is released, then don't buy it. there will be MANY that will take your place in line. ha!
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      06-13-2007, 03:48 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mesier1111 View Post
That actually is incorrect. At first press release they may have quoted 5.1, but on the BMWusa website (at least in 2005 and 2006 when I checked) the 0-60 time was listed as 4.8, so they were giving it the credit it was due.
Even if it was the initial press release that stated a 5.1 0-60 time, isn't the time of 4.8 for the e92 m3 also from the initial press release? I'm just saying that we need to wait for the real world tests to show up before we start showing concern over the performance of the m3. I'm sure we'll see plenty of "Proceded 335 vs. new m3" threads once they're out.
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      06-13-2007, 03:54 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aerisolphaln View Post
The more I see and read about the performance, the more I'm starting to agree with you.

Again though, we need to wait until the car is released to say for sure. One thing I'm very disappointed with is the interior pictures so far. It seems BMW did leave the inside of this M back in the 1980's, when the M badge really meant something!!
Really?
That's an interior left back in the 80s to me:


[source: www.worldcarfans.com]


[source: http://www.classicdriver.de]

Best regards, south
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      06-13-2007, 04:01 PM   #18
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Look at the HP/Weight Ratios. I'm using estimated RWHP figures since crank numbers are misleading.... These are just estimates OK.
- E46 M3 280hp, 3415 lbs = 0.081991
- E92 335i 275hp, 3571 lbs = 0.07701
- E92 M3 360hp, 3648 lbs = 0.09868
- E92 Procede 376hp, 3571 lbs = 0.10529
- E60 M5 430hp, 4012 lbs = 0.10718

So get lighter and wider wheels & tires and you're done if you only want a fast street car. Get LSD and suspension if you track the car. In a straight line with this much power, it's not that neccessary to get the LSD since we are already seeing guys hit 1.6X 60' with just DR's. Brakes are pretty good as is. The 12 hour endurance race at Bathurst where the PRocede 335i won first and 4th place had stock brakes. Only significant mods were Procede, suspension, oil cooler
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      06-13-2007, 04:22 PM   #19
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Don't worry ... the modded 335i will be on the side of the road trying to cool off after 2 runs.
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      06-13-2007, 05:05 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwzimmer View Post
Look at the HP/Weight Ratios. I'm using estimated RWHP figures since crank numbers are misleading.... These are just estimates OK.
- E46 M3 280hp, 3415 lbs = 0.081991
- E92 335i 275hp, 3571 lbs = 0.07701
- E92 M3 360hp, 3648 lbs = 0.09868
- E92 Procede 376hp, 3571 lbs = 0.10529
- E60 M5 430hp, 4012 lbs = 0.10718

So get lighter and wider wheels & tires and you're done if you only want a fast street car. Get LSD and suspension if you track the car. In a straight line with this much power, it's not that neccessary to get the LSD since we are already seeing guys hit 1.6X 60' with just DR's. Brakes are pretty good as is. The 12 hour endurance race at Bathurst where the PRocede 335i won first and 4th place had stock brakes. Only significant mods were Procede, suspension, oil cooler
You are quoting 25hp drivetrain loss for the 335i and over 50hp drivetrain loss for the E92 M3.
Why the big disparity?


Also, does the quote you provided for the 335i weight include 90% tank filling, 150lb driver, and 15lbs for luggage?
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      06-13-2007, 05:44 PM   #21
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I'm quoting actual Dyno results. Stock M5's dyno around 425-435hp.
A 335i dynos around 275hp on average.
I derived the M3's numbers based off the M5's drivetrain loss.

The 335 as you know is underrated and drivetrain loss is a percentage, not a number
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      06-13-2007, 05:50 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtown View Post
Don't worry ... the modded 335i will be on the side of the road trying to cool off after 2 runs.
Wow, I wonder how the 335i won 1st and 4th place in a 12 hour endurance race against STI's and EVO's if it was on the side of the road trying to cool down.

http://www.bimf.com.au/latest_news.a...=16&Pagecat=16
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