Brake info from UK M3 sales brochure

1198r · 06-01-2007, 01:57 PM

Managed to get a sales brochure last weekend and reading through info it details the following information under safety and control and wanted to know if this is new for E92 M3 or not. Word for word from brochure:

"Dynamic Stability Control Plus(DSC+) comprising: Anti-lock braking system (ABS), Automatic Stability Control (ASC), brake drying, brake fade compensation, brake pre-tensioning, cornering brake control (CBC), dynamic traction control (DTC), electronic brake force distribution (EBD), engine drag torque control (MSR), hill start assistant, soft stop"

Any of this on the E46?

JEllis · 06-01-2007, 02:20 PM

My E36 has ABS and ASC. EBD sounds new and similar to equipment available to Porsche owners.

Jason

M3_2010 · 06-01-2007, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1198r

Managed to get a sales brochure last weekend and reading through info it details the following information under safety and control and wanted to know if this is new for E92 M3 or not. Word for word from brochure:

"Dynamic Stability Control Plus(DSC+) comprising: Anti-lock braking system (ABS), Automatic Stability Control (ASC), brake drying, brake fade compensation, brake pre-tensioning, cornering brake control (CBC), dynamic traction control (DTC), electronic brake force distribution (EBD), engine drag torque control (MSR), hill start assistant, soft stop"

Any of this on the E46?

E46 has ASC, ABS, DTC, EBD.....
Soft stop can't be any good..... I like to stop my own car.

GregW / Oregon · 06-01-2007, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3_2010

E46 has ASC, ABS, DTC, EBD.....
Soft stop can't be any good..... I like to stop my own car.

E46 also has CBC. Brake drying, hill start assistant, soft stop & MSR are new, I believe. Agree on soft stop, whatever that is. I think I can modulate my stops just fine so my passengers' heads don't bob.

E36325is · 06-02-2007, 12:49 AM

Yes just got my 335 coupe, soft stop is absolutely awful, makes it harder to modulate the brakes, need to find a way to turn it off if possible!

lucid · 06-02-2007, 01:37 AM

Does someone have the exact technical specs on this soft stop thing? I can guess what it is trying to accomplish, but I want to know exactly how it is implimented. If it is what I am thinking, it sounds horrible.

E90Fleet · 06-02-2007, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucid

Does someone have the exact technical specs on this soft stop thing? I can guess what it is trying to accomplish, but I want to know exactly how it is implimented. If it is what I am thinking, it sounds horrible.

It works great
Some just need to get used to it

As you are about to stop, it slightly releaves the pressure on the rear brake pads and stops the car more gently.

Its designed to take 50% of the modulation needed away ( so if you dont modulate slightly, peoples heads wil still "bob" slightly )

Most E9x have it, and most E6x

13eastie · 06-02-2007, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E90Fleet

It works great
Some just need to get used to it

As you are about to stop, it slightly releaves the pressure on the rear brake pads and stops the car more gently.

Its designed to take 50% of the modulation needed away ( so if you dont modulate slightly, peoples heads wil still "bob" slightly )

Most E9x have it, and most E6x

Thanks for the explanation.

While I will leave to my passengers to comment as whether I might benefit from the "soft-stop", I think it sounds a million miles away from the "Ultimate Driving Machine". More like technology for its own sake.

E90Fleet · 06-02-2007, 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 13eastie

More like technology for its own sake.

Its a standard feature on almost all BMW DSC systems since 2005.

It makes it a better drive for a huge amount of drivers that cant modulate properly

lucid · 06-02-2007, 03:41 AM

I don't mind the DSC. Actually, it might have saved my ass once. With regards to the soft stop thing: all I can say is that I hope there is way to turn it off on the M3.

E36325is · 06-02-2007, 07:00 AM

I wonder if I change to an aftermarket brake set like Brembo or AP will it disable this awful soft stop thing?

replicat · 06-02-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E36325is

I wonder if I change to an aftermarket brake set like Brembo or AP will it disable this awful soft stop thing?

Most likely not, because that system is probably control in the BCM (Braking Control Module) And works throught the hydraulics...a set of Gran Turismos won't fix it..

I will be a Master Tech for BMW when this car is out, so I'll figure a way to get it controlled or overridden.

00o00 · 06-02-2007, 11:06 AM

why in hell would they fit a break modulation system on a car that is suppost to be designed for proformance driving im talking about soft stop, i don't see the reasoning behind this, we have gotten along fine for years without it, now i can understand it on the normal 3 series, but an ///M thats just dumb

does the M5 have this?

mofomat · 06-04-2007, 10:52 AM

People are getting their knickers in a twist about something which is hardly even noticeable. I have it in my E90. I didn't have it in my E46 M3. I never even notice it to be honest.

lucid · 06-04-2007, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mofomat

People are getting their knickers in a twist about something which is hardly even noticeable. I have it in my E90. I didn't have it in my E46 M3. I never even notice it to be honest.

If it is not something that is noticed, than why the hell is there? The whole point of the system is to make a difference in how the car comes to a stop, and that should be noticable. So, I have to question your perception. Or, maybe it has to do with the way you drive--maybe you like soft stops to begin with...

mofomat · 06-04-2007, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucid

If it is not something that is noticed, than why the hell is there? The whole point of the system is to make a difference in how the car comes to a stop, and that should be noticable. So, I have to question your perception. Or, maybe it has to do with the way you drive--maybe you like soft stops to begin with...

I can assure you that my perception is fine.

Maybe when something does it's job properly you don't notice it. How about a referee in a sports game? You only notice them when they make a mistake.

Basically, if you don't try to modulate the brake when you come to a stop, then you will notice it. If you do, and just drive normally, then you don't need it to take over for you.

seven_227 · 06-04-2007, 11:44 AM

In my e92 335i when im in stop and go traffic the brakes are so jerky !

lucid · 06-04-2007, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mofomat

I can assure you that my perception is fine.

Maybe when something does it's job properly you don't notice it. How about a referee in a sports game? You only notice them when they make a mistake.

Basically, if you don't try to modulate the brake when you come to a stop, then you will notice it. If you do, and just drive normally, then you don't need it to take over for you.

Sorry, I don't buy the anology. A better anology might be with ABS or something. And when ABS kicks in, I notice it. When any electromechanical system interferes with handling, I notice it, and so should you if you are somewhat in touch with what the car is doing is my point.

mofomat · 06-04-2007, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucid

Sorry, I don't buy the anology. A better anology might be with ABS or something. And when ABS kicks in, I notice it. When any electromechanical system interferes with handling, I notice it, and so should you if you are somewhat in touch with what the car is doing is my point.

ABS has a much more aggressive intervention. Of course you're going to notice that, like I do.

However, you don't notice soft stop unless you drive in a particular way. So if you don't attempt to stop the car smoothly, then you will notice it. If you drive normally, and try to drive smoothly, then you will not notice soft stop because it won't need to intervene.

However, the brake assist can be annoying. If you tap the breaks quickly but with little force, it can confuse the system and 'think' you want full force breaking, which can be jerky.

lucid · 06-04-2007, 01:14 PM

I don't know what you mean by "normal" driving. Normal by what standard?...Well, maybe I've judged the road conditions, and for whatever reason I want to come to an abrupt stop. Then the dumbass technology kicks in, and I'll be cursing at the car. I'm fine with these kind of interventions when safety is an issue. But clearly, in this case, safety is not an issue. And then like you are saying, with any such system, there are always problems with recognizing events, and making false interventions, which is even more annoying. The previous poster seems to be complaining about the same thing.

Anyway, I'll have to drive the thing and then I can really let it loose on the idiot who came up with the idea. BMW engineers are great with engines, suspensions, and other core systems, and that's where they should focus their energy. Stuff like this sounds purely annoying and is somewhat typical of BMW's orientation with unnecessary technologies...

mofomat · 06-04-2007, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucid

I don't know what you mean by "normal" driving. Normal by what standard?...Well, maybe I've judged the road conditions, and for whatever reason I want to come to an abrupt stop. Then the dumbass technology kicks in, and I'll be cursing at the car. I'm fine with these kind of interventions when safety is an issue. But clearly, in this case, safety is not an issue. And then like you are saying, with any such system, there are always problems with recognizing events, and making false interventions, which is even more annoying. The previous poster seems to be complaining about the same thing.

Anyway, I'll have to drive the thing and then I can really let it loose on the idiot who came up with the idea. BMW engineers are great with engines, suspensions, and other core systems, and that's where they should focus their energy. Stuff like this sounds purely annoying and is somewhat typical of BMW's orientation with unnecessary technologies...

I think you've jumped to some conclusions about what you think 'soft-stop' actually is, and what it feels like, otherwise you wouldn't be dwelling on things like "normal driving" and "road conditions".

The road conditions are pretty irrelevent really. It is a minor aspect of the driving experience and therefore I go back to my original point that people are getting their knickers in a twist about something which isn't a big issue.

Just to make it clear so you know what soft-stop is. When you apply the foot brake to come to a stop, in a normal car unless you ease off very slightly on the brake, the car will come to a jerky stop. Soft-stop allows you to apply the same constant brake pressure, and for the very last fraction of a second it will release the brakes allowing you to come to a smooth stop. It is hardly noticeable.

The road conditions are irrelevent. You can still come to an abrupt stop in the same way as you would without 'soft-stop'.

I find it bizarre that you are complaining about something which you haven't even experienced yet!

I tell you. You could drive it and you wouldn't even know it was there.

yves · 06-04-2007, 02:35 PM

They will have it for a reason they dont make extra costs when they could have left it out they are a company like any other trying to make as much profit as possible. I drive a 6 series often and you can easy do abrupt stops. and tested alto of BMW lately and never noticed anything trying to make it stop sofetly. just forget about you will not notice it anyways.

06-01-2007, 01:57 PM	#1
1198r Private First Class Drives: E92 M3 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nova Posts: 171 iTrader: (0) Garage List 2007 E92 M3 [0.00]	Brake info from UK M3 sales brochure Managed to get a sales brochure last weekend and reading through info it details the following information under safety and control and wanted to know if this is new for E92 M3 or not. Word for word from brochure: "Dynamic Stability Control Plus(DSC+) comprising: Anti-lock braking system (ABS), Automatic Stability Control (ASC), brake drying, brake fade compensation, brake pre-tensioning, cornering brake control (CBC), dynamic traction control (DTC), electronic brake force distribution (EBD), engine drag torque control (MSR), hill start assistant, soft stop" Any of this on the E46?
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06-01-2007, 02:20 PM	#2
JEllis Brigadier General Drives: E36 M3, 997S Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 3,366 iTrader: (1)	My E36 has ABS and ASC. EBD sounds new and similar to equipment available to Porsche owners. Jason __________________

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06-02-2007, 12:49 AM	#5
E36325is Second Lieutenant Drives: 1M coupe Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 218 iTrader: (0)	Yes just got my 335 coupe, soft stop is absolutely awful, makes it harder to modulate the brakes, need to find a way to turn it off if possible!

06-02-2007, 01:37 AM	#6
lucid Major General Drives: E30 M3; Expedition Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA Posts: 8,037 iTrader: (0)	Does someone have the exact technical specs on this soft stop thing? I can guess what it is trying to accomplish, but I want to know exactly how it is implimented. If it is what I am thinking, it sounds horrible.

06-02-2007, 03:41 AM	#10
lucid Major General Drives: E30 M3; Expedition Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA Posts: 8,037 iTrader: (0)	I don't mind the DSC. Actually, it might have saved my ass once. With regards to the soft stop thing: all I can say is that I hope there is way to turn it off on the M3.

06-02-2007, 07:00 AM	#11
E36325is Second Lieutenant Drives: 1M coupe Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 218 iTrader: (0)	I wonder if I change to an aftermarket brake set like Brembo or AP will it disable this awful soft stop thing?

06-02-2007, 11:06 AM	#13
00o00 Private Drives: its comming... Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: CT Posts: 69 iTrader: (0)	why in hell would they fit a break modulation system on a car that is suppost to be designed for proformance driving im talking about soft stop, i don't see the reasoning behind this, we have gotten along fine for years without it, now i can understand it on the normal 3 series, but an ///M thats just dumb does the M5 have this?

06-04-2007, 10:52 AM	#14
mofomat Captain Drives: BMW M3 (E92) Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Maastricht, NL Posts: 996 iTrader: (0)	People are getting their knickers in a twist about something which is hardly even noticeable. I have it in my E90. I didn't have it in my E46 M3. I never even notice it to be honest.

06-04-2007, 11:44 AM	#17
seven_227 Lieutenant Drives: AW e92 335i Join Date: May 2007 Location: Dubai Posts: 590 iTrader: (0)	In my e92 335i when im in stop and go traffic the brakes are so jerky !

06-04-2007, 01:14 PM	#20
lucid Major General Drives: E30 M3; Expedition Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA Posts: 8,037 iTrader: (0)	I don't know what you mean by "normal" driving. Normal by what standard?...Well, maybe I've judged the road conditions, and for whatever reason I want to come to an abrupt stop. Then the dumbass technology kicks in, and I'll be cursing at the car. I'm fine with these kind of interventions when safety is an issue. But clearly, in this case, safety is not an issue. And then like you are saying, with any such system, there are always problems with recognizing events, and making false interventions, which is even more annoying. The previous poster seems to be complaining about the same thing. Anyway, I'll have to drive the thing and then I can really let it loose on the idiot who came up with the idea. BMW engineers are great with engines, suspensions, and other core systems, and that's where they should focus their energy. Stuff like this sounds purely annoying and is somewhat typical of BMW's orientation with unnecessary technologies...

06-04-2007, 02:35 PM	#22
yves New Member Drives: BMW Z3, BMW X5 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Germany Posts: 23 iTrader: (0)	They will have it for a reason they dont make extra costs when they could have left it out they are a company like any other trying to make as much profit as possible. I drive a 6 series often and you can easy do abrupt stops. and tested alto of BMW lately and never noticed anything trying to make it stop sofetly. just forget about you will not notice it anyways.