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      08-19-2011, 09:45 AM   #1
e121c
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911/997 Carrera 4S VS E92 M3

Hi guys, was looking to get some opinions about these 2 cars, I have driven BMW's all my life and my last car was the E46 M3, loved the car but turned it in for a 335, now I'm looking to purchase either an 09 M3 or an 07 Carrera 4S. Was wondering if you guys can help me decide or perhaps talk me out of buying the Carrera?

P.S. I've always wanted a porsche! but know very little about them (cost of maintenance/handling and just overall the feel of owning a Porsche!

any feedback is appreciated !!! thanks!!!
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      08-19-2011, 09:54 AM   #2
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Awd/4wd Sucks...
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      08-19-2011, 10:00 AM   #3
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Awd/4wd Sucks...
hmm...wish I could have heard more from ya, but thanks for your opinion nonetheless! haha
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      08-19-2011, 10:00 AM   #4
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Awd/4wd Sucks...
Not necessarily. Absolutely different experience for sure but Porsche has done a great job implementing it IMO. Accelerating out of corners and any time you are driving hard in the rain and an AWD car is amazing. Good luck keeping up with a 4S on a damp/wet track. Also, on certain tracks, the traction of the AWD is very useful. An AWD is an easier car to drive fast and feels incredibly planted (take an R8 out sometime at the track and see what I mean ). There are compromises too but to simply say it sucks is not a fair comment.
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      08-19-2011, 10:01 AM   #5
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Not necessarily. Absolutely different experience for sure but Porsche has done a great job implementing it IMO. Accelerating out of corners and any time you are driving hard in the rain and the 4S is amazing. Good luck keeping up with a 4S on a damp/wet track. Also, on certain tracks, the traction of the 4S is very useful. There are compromises too but to simply say it sucks is not a fair comment.
Thanks Gthal! but what would be the compromises ?
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      08-19-2011, 10:05 AM   #6
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Thanks Gthal! but what would be the compromises ?
Others will know more than me on this but in my experience, AWD cars are a little heavier, push more in corners, and aren't as challenging to drive (for some a bad thing) and you wouldn't use your throttle to "drive" the car as much... the last two would make the car a little less exciting for some, i.e. it's easier.
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      08-19-2011, 10:13 AM   #7
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I just prefer RWD cars... Alot more fun to drive.

AWD is super safe, planted, etc... But not nearly as fun.
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      08-19-2011, 10:15 AM   #8
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Thanks for all the replies! But what about cost of maintenance? would the Porsche be in the same ball park as the M? or would it be a whole other level up there in terms of cost?
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      08-19-2011, 10:18 AM   #9
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      08-19-2011, 10:19 AM   #10
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carrera 4s is a great car but after the facelift and the engine revision which happened in 2008 or 2009, i would not get the 2007. i had an option for a carrera 4s @ 26k km (~15 miles), i decided not to.

but that car with 2009 model year or newer could be better than M3 if you are ok with losing the rear seats and a regular size trunk
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      08-19-2011, 10:25 AM   #11
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Porsche wins on weight and driving purity. The 4S is a scalpel.

M3 wins on driving purity and practicality. The M3 is a forcep.
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      08-19-2011, 10:43 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shift@red View Post
A 4S is still a sharper more precise tool than the M3 and despite having the penalty of AWD weight, its still lighter than the M3.

The AWD in dry weather puts 100% power to the rear and even when power is applied to the front wheels, you will always have a significant rear wheel bias. 911s are the best feeling/handling AWD cars out there.
Yup.

OP, you should get a Porcshe, great cars, you can beat on them daily and they keep on running.

Repair cost will be about the same as new M3 if the car is out of warranty. Maintenance is same cost as well. You do oil changes once every 6 months.

Upgrades will cost you just as much or more depending what you buy as you would on a M3.

AWD is awesome, on any car, snow or rain or dry weather.

The only downside IMO, is working on a car your self. Engine bay is crammed and many things have to be done from underneath on a lift.
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      08-19-2011, 10:48 AM   #13
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Yup.

OP, you should get a Porcshe, great cars, you can beat on them daily and they keep on running.

Repair cost will be about the same as new M3 if the car is out of warranty. Maintenance is same cost as well. You do oil changes once every 6 months.

Upgrades will cost you just as much or more depending what you buy as you would on a M3.

AWD is awesome, on any car, snow or rain or dry weather.

The only downside IMO, is working on a car your self. Engine bay is crammed and many things have to be done from underneath on a lift.
Thanks Man!, I have made up my mind with your kind words.

Would this be a good deal? been eyeing this one.
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...e&rdpage=thumb
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      08-19-2011, 11:20 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by stega View Post
Awd/4wd Sucks...

What? AWD does not suck. I had 4 Subaru STIs in a row (03,06,09,11) that all handled on rails. The TQ you get out of the hole is unreal compared to RWD.

AWD is more planted, faster out of the hole, and just as fun if not more fun to slide sideways as a M3. Plus, most AWD cars have a adjustable center diff to make the car more RWD bias.

OP, go with what car makes you happier. They are both awesome cars. I love my 2011 ZCP M3, but the lack of torque in my M3 that my 35K STIs would give me really bums me out.

Good luck with your choice!
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      08-19-2011, 11:20 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gthal View Post
Others will know more than me on this but in my experience, AWD cars are a little heavier, push more in corners, and aren't as challenging to drive (for some a bad thing) and you wouldn't use your throttle to "drive" the car as much... the last two would make the car a little less exciting for some, i.e. it's easier.
these are generalities that are correct. But really, you have to see how the power is distributed by the AWD system and also what the center differential is and how sensitive it is to detecting slippage. It's this that really defines the driving character of the AWD car. To say the C4S will handle like a RS4 or Evo 8 or GTR or Gallardo is complete false b/c these cars all have different types of center differentials and different default power distribution. And don't get me started on torque vectoring systems like the AYC in the Evo X. These mechancial and often electronic aids will really determine the handling character of the AWD car.

I don't know how the C4S' power is distributed, as I recall from the 911 Turbo's system, the center diff generally allows all power to be distributed to the rear wheels. Only when certain slip is detected by the mechanical diff, would a certain percentage of power get moved up front. I don't know how much and what the distribution is, but I can say the C4S will handle alot like a C2S in most conditions, aside from a damp track or certain conditions coming out of a corner where you will get significant wheelspin.

Now don't quote me on this, but these are what I recall from the top of my head on default power distribution and maximum allowable distribution by the center differential:

C4S: 5%-95%, 40%-60%
RS4: 40-60, 80-20 & 20-80
Evo 8/9: 50-50, 100-0 & 0-100
Gallardo: 30-70, ?-?
GTR: 40-60, 2-98

Last edited by mdosu; 08-19-2011 at 11:39 AM.
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      08-19-2011, 11:25 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILSMKU View Post
What? AWD does not suck. I had 4 Subaru STIs in a row (03,06,09,11) that all handled on rails. The TQ you get out of the hole is unreal compared to RWD.

AWD is more planted, faster out of the hole, and just as fun if not more fun to slide sideways as a M3. Plus, most AWD cars have a adjustable center diff to make the car more RWD bias.

OP, go with what car makes you happier. They are both awesome cars. I love my 2011 ZCP M3, but the lack of torque in my M3 that my 35K STIs would give me really bums me out.

Good luck with your choice!
That was a joke. But I strongly prefer RWD. And don't give me this bs about how its more fun sideways. lol RWD= Sideways fun.

But as other have said it depends on the awd system/ diff

Last edited by stega; 08-19-2011 at 11:41 AM.
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      08-19-2011, 11:38 AM   #17
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Quote:
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Awd/4wd Sucks...
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Originally Posted by stega View Post
That was a joke. But I strongly prefer RWD. And don't give me this bs about how its more fun sideways. lol RWD= Sideways fun.
LOL. Hater! LOL.

AWD sliding is JUST AS FUN. IT takes more skill to keep all them wheels spinning!
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      08-19-2011, 11:41 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILSMKU View Post
most AWD cars have a adjustable center diff to make the car more RWD bias.

!
most are adjusted for you by a computer, so you're at the mercy of what the engineers think is safe and fun for the car, it's rare to find AWD cars that allow driver adjustments, of course I'm aware STi is one of the few that allows for it.
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      08-19-2011, 11:52 AM   #19
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Its an older system, but the AWD on the 993 Turbo was terrible. My brother converted his car to RWD because the system was more scary when it engaged. I am sure it has improved, but it wouldn't hurt to spend some time on the Porsche forums and read what those folks have to say about the AWD system in the model year you want to purchase.
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      08-19-2011, 11:53 AM   #20
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LOL. Hater! LOL.

AWD sliding is JUST AS FUN. IT takes more skill to keep all them wheels spinning!
lol whatever you wanna think...
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      08-19-2011, 11:58 AM   #21
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Its an older system, but the AWD on the 993 Turbo was terrible. My brother converted his car to RWD because the system was more scary when it engaged. I am sure it has improved, but it wouldn't hurt to spend some time on the Porsche forums and read what those folks have to say about the AWD system in the model year you want to purchase.
That's the thing, I can't find a decent Porsche Forum with enough activity in them to get fast and decent feedback
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      08-19-2011, 12:01 PM   #22
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That was a joke. But I strongly prefer RWD. And don't give me this bs about how its more fun sideways. lol RWD= Sideways fun.

But as other have said it depends on the awd system/ diff
u could make AWD(Evo) go sideway/act like RWD just add bigger rear swaybar, the rear will rotate trust me.
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