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Originally Posted by Sticky
You realize the V8 is lighter than the 6 cylinder it replaced don't you? You realize neither of those v8's you mentioned has individual throttle bodies, right?
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That's because the inline 6 was cast iron. BMW never mentions that fact when they brag about how light the new V8 is. Do you even know what individual throttle bodies are/do? They do not account for a substation portion of the engine's weight. Yes, it's great that the V8 has ITBs, but the fact remains that BMW's engine pound for pound is seriously underpowered compared with competing engines.
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Originally Posted by Sticky
You don't care about hp per liter? Ok, so BMW should just stick in a 427 cubic inch V8 and call it a day? The hp per liter is what gives the motor its characterists, by design it has to rev higher.
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HP/liter does not define an engine's characteristics. It's a unit of measure!!!! Please, understand that concept before you go any further.
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Originally Posted by Sticky
I don't think you get it, competitive results? BMW is competitive, actually best in class, with smaller engines. The M5 does not need 6.2 liters to beat the benz V8. It does need its redline though. This is also what makes it special. The only other motors that are anywhere near as special as the S65 or S85 would be the F430 V8 and the GT3's flat six. That is it, and BMW offers the best motors for the money of these manufactuers. Sounds to me like they are doing fine, some people just don't get it and never will.
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I own an e60 M5 and I wouldn't even go so far as to say that only the F430's V8 or GT3's flat 6 beat it. You like those engines because of their high hp/liter output. No offense, but being a stat geek doesn't mean you know what you're talking about. Other engines are built with different philosophies in mind. That shouldn't automatically make them less valuable. You just sound really bias.
You said "the M5 does not need 6.2 liters to beat the benz V8". Beat it at what? I bet your answer is along the lines of HP/liter. Get over it. Like I said before, it's a unit of measure and does not dictate an engine's characteristics.
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Originally Posted by Sticky
Say what you will about forced induction, I don't think the M3 would give me as big of a smile if it wasn't screaming toward redline.
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That's your opinion.
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Originally Posted by Sticky
A 911 GT3 would just turn into... a turbo.
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I think it's more along the lines of a GT3 turning into a GT2. Remember that car? GT3 with twin turbos. Where do I find the "owned" smilie?
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Originally Posted by Sticky
An F430 would no longer have that special ferrari high rpm wail that makes your spine tingle and is an intrinsic part of the driving experience. Yes, the motors are less fuel efficient, yes, they don't make as much torque, yes, they are freaking special and unlike anything else and therefore worth their premium.
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Why can't turbo engines be special? The Ferrari F40 uses a turbo and I don't think anyone is disappointed in that car.
Sticky, while I had a lot of fun picking apart your comments, you missed the point of my original post. I was not trying to discredit BMW's current philosophy towards performance engines, rather I was stating that this design has passed its prime. Time to move onto the next evolution. Don't tell me you wish automakers had stuck with steam engines because they were so special.