Originally Posted by Call
I never mind someone who is willing to set down and have a rational discuss. They don't even have to agree with me. Just come to the table with facts...we can disagree with postions but you can not argue the facts. Why sit down and disagree with someone when you have no facts to bring to the table?
No proof has every been provided by anyone...that means either Democrat or Republican or dishwasher...that Bush lied. He has been accused of doing so but no facts, just the oppositions dreams. He has been accused of benefiting personally from the war...no facts, again the oppositions dreams.
He has been accused of being a divider, no facts, just oppositions dreams. What has the opposition offered to unify the country other than to oppose anything offered by the present administration. No answers from the Democratic side.
Now, if you want to have an intelligent conversation let's talk facts not dreams. I'm ready to set down and talk with you and I can bring whatever needs to be brought to the table. What will you bring?
As to Madam Speaker, she has no constitutional responsibility for foreign policy...none, zero...end of discussion. Don't even bother to bring it to the table.
As for what the governments of Syria or Iran can bring to the table, history is clear. Their past actions is clear. Their present actions are clear. They bring nothing to even compromise with. It's all or nothing with them. Diplomacy is the art of compromise. Their alternative is for everyone else to come under their rule or be killed. And you want to set down and talk with that on the table?
This post is getting long and I really want you to have an opportunity to reply. But keep it rational...bring facts to the table, lets discuss the facts, not something you wish to be but what is.
EDIT: For Scott, this is just the answer on the previous comment, not much about Pelosi...
I agree with you on most of it, however:
1) You can call it that he lied or not. He came out and said that SH had the WMD, and no discussion. He did not take Chinese, Russian or German or...word for it or the advice for patience. He rushed into it. There is NO, absolutely NO way that any American would have signed up for this war just to go and liberate some Iraq from the dictator. He put in that enormous thing, called the WMD to get the support. Then he sent Colin Powell to the UN with the PPT presentation. Colin quit after that -- the guy with the pride and honor. In the end, the washed it off telling us that it was simply the bad intel and the end???!!! Hey, people, just simply the bad intel -- some country was invaded, thousands killed, infrastructure destroyed, and just a bad intel!!! No, in my mind, he should be responsible for all that and should be tried for all that. Every mother that lost an innocent child over there (because of the bad intel) should be able to spit in his face for that. If he were not stubborn and more patient the situation would have been different.
2) I also acuse him of controlling the public in this country. Many times when his ratings hit the bottom just before the (re) elections, he (and his puppets) pulled the "threat" thing on us. Fear is the way to control the crowd. None, absolutely NONE of those "fake" elevated threats was real.
3) THe whole conspiracy theory and W benefiting off this whole thing is questionable. I do not believe in it at all, but there are some interesting points. Interesting enough to read, but not to believe for me.
4) Iran and Syria. I thought that Bush and his boys proposed to involve Iran into the Iraq solution??? Now, when the Dems did the Syria thing, Bush is all over them. Why??? What is the difference (supporting terror) between those two?
5) Foreign Policy:
Another thing is our horrible foreign policy or should I say politics.
We caused NK to go nuclear. Bush's speach after 9/11 did it. Yes, NK was fooling with that for a long time, but never made it to the end and never rushed it this much. He, and his "axis of evil" speach did it.
Same for Iran. Diplomacy could have solved many things, but this administration knows nothing about the diplomacy.
6) and the most unfortunate thing that I have experienced many times in last 3 years or so is the World respect. People around the world truly believe that the US is the greatest threat to the world's peace. And that propagates down, from Bush and our representatives to us, ordinary people. I see it once a month in Asia, and is getting worse...
Finally, Scott, calls Pelosi a traitor for trying to bring back our reputation and for trying to bring some diplomacy to the table. Yes, they may not be the ideal Government out there, however, here are a few examples for you:
a) North Korea. They wer one of three "axis of evil" but we did engage into diplomatic talks with them just a month ago. How come??? Does Syria need to build a nuke for us to realize that this cowboyism is not the answer???
b) Kosovo -- clearly the largest nest of terrorism in Europe. However, we're right there, protecting Kosovo Govrnment interests knowing that they support terrorism and other dirty things.
So, watching FOX or CNN or who knows what will definitely not depict a clear picture for you of what is happening out there...