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      01-18-2010, 12:32 AM   #90
Rectify
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Drives: BMW M3
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Canada

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post


You are fooling yourself if you think the thermals weren't calculated and tested on the DCT and then retrofitted for the 6MT vs. the other way around. What you are suggesting is exactly the opposite of proper design and testing methodology. It also assumes the DCT was an engineering afterthought, even though all of the contemporary press releases made clear that the DCT was a flagship product.
I'm sure BMW calculated they could get away with using the same cooler, and they did. I'm sure this is the same BMW team that calculated they could get away with improper bearings on the S54. Seems they have a history of making mistakes on flagship products The decision was one based on cost, not on giving the DCT the best option possible.




Quote:
Overheating doesn't prove undersized cooler. You said an undersized cooler has been "established." Overheating doesn't "establish" anything. A SIB or recall would suffice. Post the SIB or recall, or drop the issue.
This does not make sense to me. Proof is once a recall is issued? So there are no issues before that? They suddenly appear once the recall is issued? I will not drop it because I have hands on experience with this particular issue. Overheating even at the stock power level or on the track definitely establishes there is an issue. Several people have posted about it. Is the only time you are willing to acknowledge it when and if BMW ever recalls it? The S54 was perfect until BMW issued a recall, right? Are you willing to acknowledge it is the same cooler as the manual transmission? Are you willing to acknowledge DCT members have gone into limp mode due to the tranny overheating on the strip, street, and track?



Quote:
It seems that you don't realize that you're complaining that ESS has a repeat pattern of UNDERSTATING their performance. I think Roman has made this exact point on many occasions. Since you seem to think that uncorrected dyno charts are a benefit to ESS, you're clearly not understanding how the SAE correction formulas work. So let this chart demonstrate something about SAE 1349 correction. Holding barometric pressure and humidity constant at the SAE 1349 reference points (29.92, and 0%), we get the following correction factors with temperature:
ESS has not stated performance yet. They have posted overstated dyno numbers, yes, but no performance figures of any kind. You can post a million charts but did ESS not just post a corrected figure that was far less than the uncorrected figure? Why is this not supporting you?

All the SC'd cars will end up at around the same number at the same boost. The second ESS dyno proves it.



Quote:
So you see, depending on the temperature, posting uncorrected dyno charts HURT ESS, not help them. Posting uncorrected charts for anything that was measured above 60 degrees farenheit hurts them. Once you get up to 100 degrees, it hurts them by more than 4%. So quit complaining about this because you're really complaining that they're actually stronger, not weaker than they claim.
Does not make any sense to me when the corrected numbers are weaker and the uncorrected numbers are stronger. I'm sure conditions can exist where what you say can take place but that clearly did not happen here. Does not make any sense to me when ESS hand picks the uncorrected figure that is higher to post. Why not post the lower, corrected figure if not looking to brag about peak numbers? Does not make any sense to me when I have seen SC'd cars dyno'd and the corrected numbers match up and the uncorrected posted numbers don't. Maybe some trap speeds from ESS would help so we don't have to play the dyno game? I am a bit leery of accepting ESS dyno numbers at this point especially considering we have different charts, some SAE, some DIN, some corrected, some uncorrected, floating around and people quoting inflated numbers without realizing it. Having numbers on the strip and the dyno is better than only having one. Especially considering some tuners use a completely different dyno. Having a customer with a completed, street driven car go to a third party would be great as well.
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