Thread: SC confused !
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      10-31-2012, 05:35 PM   #59
Jon@Bimmersport Automotive

Drives: E90 M3 Active Supercharged
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Mississauga, On Canada

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2003.5 BMW M3  [5.00]
Originally Posted by m33 View Post
Jon I'm wondering if this is just opinion or if there's data to
back it up. I think we all want to see data at this point.

Here's what I've seen, and can give you data if interested (it's
been posted before): when we compare equal boost, there's no
comparison; the Vortech makes about the same (maybe a tiny bit
more) wtq and far more whp than the AA/HKS. But when we compare
equal whp, it's true that the HKS makes quite a bit more torque,
but at the cost of 2+ more PSI boost.

You might have seen that we had a recent drag event with both
kits. When you see the results on the drag strip, it's not even a
fair race. The ESS-VT1+meth beats AA/HKS-620+Meth; and the ESS
620 kits walked it.

I guess the only thing left is to compare vBox files to see if the
AA/HKS can out accelerate the Vortech kits in the mid range. I'm
open to the possibility, but so far nobody with an AA kit has been
willing to give up their vBox files to help see if it's fact or
fiction. Jon do you have any vBox files to compare the two? I'll
be happy to give you mine...I've got hundreds you can have.
It is an opinion from having personal experience. Having a vortech supercharger on our S52, and a HKS charger on our S52. We have an ESS VT2-650 kit on our E60 M5 and is a great kit. Now comparing the Vortech to HKS, We have a customer with a Dinan S/C kit and a level 1 HKS E46 M3. The HKS at part throttle is like a turbo system, even on AA's Prima system. Where the HKS shines is PART THROTTLE loads. Again, I am not posting dyno data, dyno runs, Vbox runs because they are all wide open loads in which the conditions do reflect part throttle driving in the city in which most customers daily drive their car. I did not find the same similar feeling with my vortech configured vehicles. Do not take it wrong, the vortech is in no way an inferior product. Your right on the differences on the PSI and flow, because if you have a larger area it is less PSI to flow 1000cfm than to flow 1000cfm in a smaller area is more PSI. That just means yes, the smaller blower can translate into earlier power delivery - which for people who want that, can get it. Which has more potential? The bigger blower - being the ESS/Vortech unit for those who want to keep up with DLSJ5 and IMG.

I did see the drag times, and all the ESS cars came out on top! Mind you, the AA car is running pilot super sports compared to R888's from my recollection (correct me if I'm wrong). There was also a video and from what I saw was 535 kit with pulley and meth got walked by an AA stage 2. The 535 kit with meth and pulley then walked on a VT2-600 kit. Contradicting?

It is also a known fact that ESS has a track record of 0 blown engines, as well as the highest output M3..and I believe may be the first that is still pushed daily on the street.

Unfortunately I do not have vbox files. Our law in Ontario here is that if your 50km over, it will cost you your S/C kit in fines and possibly crushed vehicles like the C6 Z06 and Pcar turbo they made examples of. So getting these types of tests done is somewhat hard unless we head to the boonies, and that is not so often with our performance cars. I will try to get some data when I can for the cause, for sure.

....maybe we should have done this at a strip near Bimmerfest East 2012! (you have a nice ride btw)

Chris, we have both kits on the E90 M3 in Toronto. Meet up with the owners and see which one you like better, but the kits on these cars are both higher levels than what your interested in - although I do not see that as a problem.

If you need help with meetings I can arrange that for you, although with our winter right around the corner it may be hard to do and if you - we have to get traction at almost 5degrees celcius.

M33, It all can go back and forth. The only way to tell you which is better is have a run with both on the highway. Matter of fact, meet at a gas station almost on an empty tank *video shot*, fill up with 93 octane to prove no mix of E85 or race fuel and finally a run on the highway. That way there's no complaints. Sadly because Akash is the only one stepping up, there is only dyno racing or dyno database references, vbox runs to tell you which is faster. It reminds me of that Nitto racing game online years back. I do not blame anyone as on a legal point of view, it's risky stuff all for a video on the net to most.

For the OP, like mentioned - get a ride in both, and if you need help seeing them in person I will get in contact with them for you if needed. Make your decision on which one you like better based on that drive. I will leave my input at that, and let the rest sort itself out.

Also most importantly to those looking at kits in the Ontario region. Verify that you are buying your product from an AUTHORIZED dealer in your area, it is the ONLY way to receive the product support your entitled to and warranty. I have been getting many price matches from inquiring customers, so please check what your getting into before purchasing. We are ESS and AA's only Authorized installer and reseller in the Ontario as a Canadian based company.

Last edited by Jon@Bimmersport Automotive; 10-31-2012 at 06:02 PM.